New to the forum but have been an avid lurker reading several posts on bike engined cars.
I am planning on fitting a Blackbird engine to my 1970 Hillman Imp to rpleace the original engine but keep it in the same position as the Imp engine
driving through a MX-5 diff that wil be turned and used upside down to keep the drive going in the correct direction.
I have posted a question in the transmission section to see if this is a good idea or are there better diffs to be used in this way.
A photo of the car as how it is at the moment,more to follow.
Cheers
Col.
sorry can t help on the diff,
But the engine choice any reason for the bird engine? probably ok for road use, but if near a track be on the look out for oil surge etc, plenty of
posts on here if you search for it,
best of luck with the project,
No bother.
The reason for the Blackbird motor is nothing other than it was available with all the ancillaries for a good price.
I have read of the oil surge problems and the thoughts of dry sumping/baffling the sump etc which is a bit of a concern. The Imp will be mostly used
on the road as a weekend toy.
Cheers
Col.
I would question your engine choice. From what I've read Blackbird engines do not fair very well in car installations something to do with the
crankcase and head twisting which results in con rods flying through the casing.
There are plenty of other engines of similar spec: Fireblades, Zx10r, Zx9r etc etc.
[Edited on 6/10/15 by wylliezx9r]
should be ok for road use, they are a good powerful engine, for the money,
A good baffle plate and poss acusump for road use, should be ok,mine was fine on the road, and made 130 bhp at the wheels
best of luck with it,
Ok, so the diff will just be rotated over itself from pointing forward in the MX5 site, to facing backwards? not sure how the upside down bit will reverse the drive rotation as the CWP only goes one way.
Hello guys long time since I have posted on here. I hope your all well & 
and welcome colimp I think your going to like it on here there are
some fantastic people
[Edited on 8/10/15 by imp paul]
quote:
Originally posted by sam919
Ok, so the diff will just be rotated over itself from pointing forward in the MX5 site, to facing backwards? not sure how the upside down bit will reverse the drive rotation as the CWP only goes one way.
I see, your right.
I had a look at your pics imp Paul and see youve done the same with a 7".
It all figures in a moment of clarity :-)
OK so back to fitting a bike engine in a imp .be aware bike engines are tall not good as it wants to be inside rear parcel shelf ,and above also sump
to floor clearance is very very tight .and then there's diff and motor clearance as the set up is long and goes in to the rear panel just a few
problems lol
[Edited on 8/10/15 by imp paul]
Yeh, good points Paul.
Well aware of the height issue regarding the rear panel and know that will need trimming lol. Seen a good few Imps with the K series and Peugeot TU
motors in them that suffer similar issues.
Not sure if a Yamaha FZR motor would be a better choice due to it being at 45 degree angle like an imp motor.
I have the Blackbird motor so will stick with that and work around the issues. A shallow sump will surely help the ground clearance I hope?
How is your build coming along? You still messing with Lambrettas as well?
I once put a Yamaha TZR250 engine in one many moons ago which was great fun for the 3 years i had it.
Cheers
Col
[Edited on 8/10/15 by colimp66]
A friend of mine did a simile conversion using an R1 engine and Sierra diff. He made a cradle to mount the engine and diff in that bolted to the imp
engine mounts.
Easier that way to remove if he had any problems.
quote:
Originally posted by capri_big_jim
A friend of mine did a simile conversion using an R1 engine and Sierra diff. He made a cradle to mount the engine and diff in that bolted to the imp engine mounts.
Easier that way to remove if he had any problems.
.JPG)
engine 7may 07
here you go i removed my frame as i did not find it the way to go as sump is far to low 
Strange question from me, how stable is the shell on those 2 engine stands ?
My 15 year old son is currently stripping a 1970 imp super & was trying to think of a good affordable way to work on the shell, that looks just
the ticket.
Cheers
Hi Paul,
Thanks for the photo of your engine in the cradle. The ground clearance is certainly a concern and something I am aware of but can't check until
I get the car back on wheels with the suspension on. Can I assume a shorter sump may help?
Andy the bodyshell has been sitting on the engine stands for the last 6 years and has been turned so many times to repair the floor and everything
else that was needed.
If I was using them again I would cut them so the pivots are at 90 degrees then tie both of the stands together with a bar inbetween them so they dont
spread slightly. I did all the work myself and spun the car easily to to repair it.
If your on the Imp club forum you can check out the build there.
Cheers
Col
Hi Colin Im afraid to say it ,but I feel it will be dangerous with the sump . I also fitted a big low sump but still no good Colin ,massive risks that's why the engine is now midmount
As the blackbird, and most bike engine, sumps are so shallow anyway, cutting it down would be asking to blow the engine up. Bike engines are already so tightly packaged that if it could be cut down Honda would do it too. Dry sumping might allow you to run a sump plate rather than a proper sump, if you see what I mean, but otherwise I'd leave it well alone.
quote:
Originally posted by imp paul
OK so back to fitting a bike engine in a imp .be aware bike engines are tall not good as it wants to be inside rear parcel shelf ,and above also sump to floor clearance is very very tight .and then there's diff and motor clearance as the set up is long and goes in to the rear panel just a few problems lol
[Edited on 8/10/15 by imp paul]
I would definitely stay away from the Blackbird engine. I went through 2 in two years and that was just fast road use. They like to throw rods
Still with the Blackbird motor as that's what I have and progressed quite as bit with my Imp.
Got it down off the spit and on its wheels now with all the suspension fitted.
Once down on the floor I cut a hole in the rear parcel shelf and trial fitted the engine or slid it in onto of my skateboard lol.
Without any weight in the car it sits about 150mm from the floor to the bottom of the sump. I hope to improve that with the possibility of a different
inlet for the carbs or as well as modifying the sump if required.
Cheers
Col
[Edited on 30/3/16 by colimp66]
That's looking good
Good luck with the build, I too would be reluctant to use a Blackbird engine. Too many horror stories of blow ups even in road use due to oil
surge.
You cant really go wrong with a fuel injected Fireblade or Yamaha R1 set up, plenty out there at relatively cheap money compared to the Hayabusa and
ZZR14 and Zx12 options.
Have a chat with Andy at the Scottish Kit Car Center in East Lothian, he has just finished a R1 conversion in a rear engined Grasser with a nice self
contained diff unit.
Lots of experience with Honda stuff also, including blown Blackbirds.
Luckily enough I have a connector that will be suitable for transferring the drive from the engine to the diff form a member of the forum. Cheers
Alan
As well as receiving the connector I have started on making the frame up to hold the engine in the the Imp chassis which will then allow me to marry
up the diff with the engine with having the connector, slow progress but I dip into it when time allows. The makings of a propshaft although very
short is being devised in tandem with the rest of the work being done.
Cheers
Col.
I can remember when bike racers put Imp engines in sidecar outfits.....................................
http://www.rjegraphics.com/ENG_MOD_no_graphics/Projects.htmlhttp://www.rjegraphics.com/ENG_MOD_no_graphics/Projects.html
[Edited on 18/5/16 by britishtrident]
[Edited on 18/5/16 by britishtrident]
[Edited on 18/5/16 by britishtrident]
Have you thought about what diff ratio you need?
MX-5 ones tend to be on the short side for a BEC.
Hi,
The standard ratio of the MX-5 will be used initially as that's what I have. It has been mentioned that it may be a tad low geared and top out at
around 100MPH... My thoughts are that a 100MPH in an Imp will be more than enough and the acceleration should be brisk to say the least. It will be a
weekend toy at best and built for a bit of fun.
If I don't like it once finished it can either be modified again or sold on. It's a hobby and happy to keep messing about with it to get it
right or as good as I can.
Cheers
Col.
Started on the fabrication of the engine cradle for fitting between the two chassis rails of the Imp.
At the moment it is being supported by a temporary engine cradle below it sitting on a we trolley. This is allowing for around 6 inches of ground
clearance which may change slightly once the engine weight is taken up by the springs etc but hoping for it not to go much lower.
Hoping to get more done later this week.
Cheers
Col
Its all about mounting blackbird engine as crankcase distorts nipping crank speak to andy bates he might be able to help mount it properly nothing wrong with engine just how its mounted
Cheers Ali,
I have spoken to Andy regarding the Blackbird motor and he did mention the flexing issue that occurs with these motors often being the cause of
problems.
A bit more of the frame tacked in last night.
Cheers
Col.
There are 1000s of blackbird bikes with very big mileages so nothing wrong with motor and at the end of the day its a Honda will make a very nice car good luck with it .
Hi,
I have recently done a zzr1200 with a freelander diff 3.20 ratio worked really well.
regards Jon
Cheers John,
Be good to see your conversion. Possibly bettered geared than I will be with using the MX-5 diff.
Made up the lower spars for the cradle last night all tacked in and feeling chuffed with myself on the look of the cradle.
Cheers
Col.
Looking good :-)
We just rolled my son's imp out & fitted some 13 x 8 alleycat wheels that he got 2nd hand, just needs a lot of shell welding unfortunately
:-(
13x8's will just squeeze in under the arches I believe, I have 7's on mine at mo with 185/60x13 tyres but looking for a lower profile to fit
on the front to allow full lock without rub on the inner arches.
Been busy with a few other jobs this past wee whilst since I posted last. New dashbaord constructed and covered..This is it loosely fitted into the
car
This week it has been a bit of a tidy up where the engine pokes into the parcel shelf so I have mad e a cover/access panel for this. Reused the
original panel I had cut out but in reverse so it will cover the airfiler etc without touching.
Finally picked up my very short propshaft s I can get on with finishing of the framework to hold the engine and the diff combined which will then
allow me to have the driveshafts fabricated.
Cheers
Col.
[Edited on 17/11/16 by colimp66]
Now onto the engine and diff bit not in the car..... Yet!!!
Cheers
Col
[Edited on 17/11/16 by colimp66]
Wow!! 4 years has passed since I was last on here, apologies for taking so long to give an update on my Imp.
So I have made the rest of the framework to take the MX-5 differential, propshaft was also made and the driveshafts adapted so the MX-5 ones fit the
Imp uj's to drive the wheels forward.
The car has been painted and a headlining installed, brake lines have been fashioned and fitted along with a clutch and fuel line too. Seats, windows
are fitted, sound insulation and some of the carpet as well as the engine being out back together and started up.
I've not been idle ... just slow at getting all of it done and upto date on here. Life and work getting in the way really and erm.. a pandemic as
well.
I'm now trying to figure out how I post some photos of the progress????
Cheers
Col.
[youtube]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3TQwP2EenmQ[/youtube]
Gearshifter made up.
[youtube]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nKmCFPoQq3E[/youtube]
Cheers
Col.