coyoteboy
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| posted on 5/8/15 at 07:56 PM |
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Argon/CO2 supplies - not much in it
So I'm set up comfy with a MIG now, have pub gas bottle but suspect I can't get it refilled anywhere local (it's about 10 years old
I think) so will probably have to donate it to recycling. So I'm looking at welding gas suppliers and theres
Gas-UK.
They're selling 10 litre 200 bar pure argon for £35+VAT, with no rental and no deposit lost if returned within 12 months (pro-rata after
that).
It's £25 for CO2 of the same size.
So I'm thinking I'll go with them, but trying to gauge it so I'll run out and need to return it within 12 months.
Those with more experience than I, running about 15 l/min for general welding I've seen it suggested using the litresxbarpress to give total
quantity (it's not right due to various factors but seems commonly used) which would suggest 2000litres. That should last about 2 hours of arc
time, which is plenty to practice and do some initial fab work.
Thoughts? Anyone know cheaper/better? I'll grab an argon reg and adapter for CO2 in case I need it later.
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sdh2903
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| posted on 5/8/15 at 08:10 PM |
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M and s fire protection in Rutherglen will fill pub bottles. Think I paid around 15 quid Lasr time I had my pub bottle filled.
http://www.m-s-fireprotection.co.uk/
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Slimy38
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| posted on 5/8/15 at 08:12 PM |
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Pure argon is bad for MIG, CO2 is the traditional but can cause it to spit. A mix of the two is good, typically either 5% or 20% CO2 mix.
The prices are roughly what I pay for Adams gas. I get a 9 litre tank for £30 + VAT. But there's also no rental and no drop in deposit, so you
wouldn't be restricted to 12 months.
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coyoteboy
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| posted on 6/8/15 at 01:11 AM |
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Hmm wasn't aware pure argon would be an issue with normal welding, was going that route as I want to play with alu MIG which requires it and
it's listed as fine for normal steels too?
Will check out adams gas and the pub gas option - I'd rather not risk anyones safety filling the pub gas if it's not safe but considering
I have the cyl it would be a lot easier!
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IanSouthLincs
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| posted on 6/8/15 at 06:18 AM |
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I use BOC Gases under their Volkszone offer. I'll dig out details for you when I get home later, or you could hop over to the mig welding forum,
plenty of details about it over there. Also there is a guy on there running a shop called Weldequip that will do you a good price for a Wescol
regulator, it's what I use. Hope this helps 😀
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coyoteboy
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| posted on 6/8/15 at 11:23 AM |
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Slimy - Adams gas is charging 85quid plus vat for 9L at 135bar of argon/co2, with a £55 deposit. While the deposit doesn't drop, that's
still £140 for a 9L 135bar tank, over £85 for a 10 litre 200 bar tank of pure argon (less for mix) and 50 deposit which would all go in 3 years if you
left it that long? Am I missing something here, I feel a bit dense.
[Edited on 6/8/15 by coyoteboy]
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coozer
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| posted on 6/8/15 at 12:47 PM |
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Regarding refilling the pub bottle.. .take it to the beer wholesaler and they will exchange it rather than a refill. They then send it back to the
station who check the dates, retest as required.
I bought a pub bottle from the wholesaler, welded a few things including a trailer, used to to empty 4 kegs of fosters, them did some more welding!
£15 it cost me.
1972 V8 Jago
1980 Z750
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theconrodkid
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| posted on 6/8/15 at 12:51 PM |
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i have been using pub gas for years,the normal bottle last a long long time,when i used it at my garage i used to refill about twice a year and i did
a lot of bodging rusty relics in them days 
who cares who wins
pass the pork pies
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Slimy38
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| posted on 6/8/15 at 04:37 PM |
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quote:
Originally posted by coyoteboy
Slimy - Adams gas is charging 85quid plus vat for 9L at 135bar of argon/co2, with a £55 deposit. While the deposit doesn't drop, that's
still £140 for a 9L 135bar tank, over £85 for a 10 litre 200 bar tank of pure argon (less for mix) and 50 deposit which would all go in 3 years if you
left it that long? Am I missing something here, I feel a bit dense.
[Edited on 6/8/15 by coyoteboy]
You've doubled up on the deposit. It's £85 as your first tank, that includes £55 of deposit and £30 for 9l of gas. Your refills are then
£30 each, then you get the other £55 back as your deposit at the end of it. (all + VAT).
I didn't add up the pressure though, looks like your tanks are a fair bit higher pressure. Perhaps that's where your litres x pressure
might even the prices?
I'm not sure why you've found pure argon good for normal steels. Everywhere I've seen says aluminium or stainless. Typical online
quote;
quote:
When MIG/GMAW welding ferrous materials, pure argon is not an ideal shielding gas, as it produces an arc with poor cathodic rooting characteristics,
large droplet size and therefore higher levels of spatter. For this reason, Ryval recommends that Mig Shield gases be used.
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rusty nuts
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| posted on 6/8/15 at 04:59 PM |
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Check out the prices for 20lt bottles, the deposit is higher but the gas works out a lot cheaper. Worth it in the long run.
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Slimy38
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| posted on 6/8/15 at 05:12 PM |
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quote:
Originally posted by rusty nuts
Check out the prices for 20lt bottles, the deposit is higher but the gas works out a lot cheaper. Worth it in the long run.
Good point, I have to admit I only saw the need (and the space) for a 9 litre bottle, but after my third refill I wonder whether that was the best
thing to do!!
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mark chandler
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| posted on 6/8/15 at 05:45 PM |
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I used to have a full cougar rented from BOC until I realised the rental costs v use  this had a long tube from bottle to welder so I could work
anywhere in the garage.
I now have the biggest bottle I could get from Adams gas, it's maybe 1/3 cougar 20 litres sounds about right and it was pumped right up.
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coyoteboy
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| posted on 6/8/15 at 06:54 PM |
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Ahh I see, Adams gas includes the tank deposit lol, that makes much more sense! Well I got myself a reg to see what I have left in my pub gas cyl and
it's chuff all but holds 15lpm at the moment for some tinkering while a replacement comes.
I could possibly get the cyl refilled but I just checked the test-due date and it's.....
1993!
So I don't think I could get someone to refill that in good conscience, if it went bang and injured someone I'd want to hang myself for
the sake of 50 quid.
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coyoteboy
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| posted on 7/8/15 at 11:40 AM |
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Local gas place has offered me an exchange CO2 cyl for £35 and £12 a refil. I'll probably go down this route for the time being and then when I
get to chassis welding or anything critical I'll switch out to an Argon 5 mix, I should be more practiced by then too!
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