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Author: Subject: Zetec water rail
richard munnis

posted on 15/1/16 at 08:38 PM Reply With Quote
Zetec water rail

Hi Folks
What is the advantages of running a water rail and can it do away with the header tank i have Thank you in advance any pictures would be appreciated cheers Richard

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big_wasa

posted on 15/1/16 at 08:58 PM Reply With Quote
Yes it's super neat and very minimalistic but it doesn't alter the fact it doesn't really work properly in a road car.

Some will tell you there's work just fine but most will agree it's just jewellery.

I've had two and still went back to the factory stat.

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britishtrident

posted on 15/1/16 at 09:04 PM Reply With Quote
Only two reason for fitting one (1) there is no other way to get the engine to fit ie: fitting into a Mk1/2 Escort (2) You have a need to produce lots of boiling water.





[I] What use our work, Bennet, if we cannot care for those we love? .
― From BBC TV/Amazon's Ripper Street.
[/I]

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jeffw

posted on 16/1/16 at 06:31 AM Reply With Quote
I suggest you search for Raceline Water Rail and get a slightly more rounded response.






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big_wasa

posted on 16/1/16 at 10:17 AM Reply With Quote
Better still I would love to see a poll.

Have you owned one and how did you get on with it.

A) works just fine and looks great. B) looks great but just doesn't work as well as stock.

I've owned two so my opinion is my experience and not what I've seen posted.

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britishtrident

posted on 16/1/16 at 11:05 AM Reply With Quote
Anybody who has got one to work has either had to resort to bodges or leave out the thermostat. It was designed at the end of the carbuerettor era, in those days nobody fitted thermostats but with modern fuel injection running without a thermostat is not viable.
The designer seemed not to understand that to open car thermostats need the hot coolant to freely circulate over the thermostat bulb even when the thermostat is closed.





[I] What use our work, Bennet, if we cannot care for those we love? .
― From BBC TV/Amazon's Ripper Street.
[/I]

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jeffw

posted on 16/1/16 at 12:25 PM Reply With Quote
Dear God, another BT rant....

If you really are that concerned about the Raceline waterrail why don't you ring up the designer (Pete at Raceline) and get some facts.






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r1_pete

posted on 16/1/16 at 05:52 PM Reply With Quote
Mine worked fine, and regularly tours Europe with its new owner.

I did have the heater piped in so it did bypass - almost...

enginedone
enginedone

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matt5964

posted on 16/1/16 at 06:51 PM Reply With Quote
You could look at the dunnell one also

http://www.dunnellengines.com/datasheets/RMP%202052%20Zetec%20Water%20Rail.pdf





Luego velocity XT 2.0ltr 221.3bhp 178.9lbft

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rm0rgan

posted on 16/1/16 at 07:42 PM Reply With Quote
I have one fitted (well, a variant of). It worked fine while moving but struggled to manage heat in traffic so re fitted thermostat and header tank and job was a carrot. Think it looks neater than a standard set up even with the header tank fitted.

Description
Description


Description
Description


Description
Description


[Edited on 16/1/16 by rm0rgan]





Sigs are uncool.

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richard munnis

posted on 16/1/16 at 08:05 PM Reply With Quote
Header tank

Hi
Nice looking job can you please tell me what your header tank is off cheers Richard

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rm0rgan

posted on 17/1/16 at 08:52 AM Reply With Quote
Renault Clio or Kangoo but there are others that work just as well.





Sigs are uncool.

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big_wasa

posted on 17/1/16 at 09:43 AM Reply With Quote
Metro Mgtf and Volvo C70 are neat and compact.
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GRBBONGO

posted on 17/1/16 at 10:27 AM Reply With Quote
Follow these steps and all will be fine.

Just follow the advise to the letter in the attached article and you ll have no problems at all. I installed mine onto my new Zetec install and have had no problems at all. Just make sure the pressure rad cap on the thermostat tower is replaced with a sealed type cap. I was very sceptical when I purchased mine after reading some negative reviews but had no choice due to amount of space between engine and bulkhead. I'm now glad I have it as looks nice and tidies the engine bay up a touch.
http://forum.wscc.co.uk/forum/index.php/files/download/34-westfield-world-issue-five-2009/

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rm0rgan

posted on 17/1/16 at 02:46 PM Reply With Quote
quote:
Originally posted by GRBBONGO
Just follow the advise to the letter in the attached article and you ll have no problems at all. I installed mine onto my new Zetec install and have had no problems at all. Just make sure the pressure rad cap on the thermostat tower is replaced with a sealed type cap. I was very sceptical when I purchased mine after reading some negative reviews but had no choice due to amount of space between engine and bulkhead. I'm now glad I have it as looks nice and tidies the engine bay up a touch.
http://forum.wscc.co.uk/forum/index.php/files/download/34-westfield-world-issue-five-2009/



You might need to copy and paste the article as it's members only :-)





Sigs are uncool.

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GRBBONGO

posted on 17/1/16 at 06:24 PM Reply With Quote
thanks I didn't think. Will try and paste it.
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Ugg10

posted on 17/1/16 at 07:05 PM Reply With Quote
quote:
Originally posted by rm0rgan

Description
Description



[Edited on 16/1/16 by rm0rgan]


Not sure about the new hard top though :-)





---------------------------------------------------------------
1968 Ford Anglia 105e, 1.7 Zetec SE, Mk2 Escort Workd Cup front end, 5 link rear
Build Blog - http://Anglia1968.weebly.com

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J90rdn

posted on 17/1/16 at 11:21 PM Reply With Quote
quote:
Originally posted by rm0rgan
quote:
Originally posted by GRBBONGO
Just follow the advise to the letter in the attached article and you ll have no problems at all. I installed mine onto my new Zetec install and have had no problems at all. Just make sure the pressure rad cap on the thermostat tower is replaced with a sealed type cap. I was very sceptical when I purchased mine after reading some negative reviews but had no choice due to amount of space between engine and bulkhead. I'm now glad I have it as looks nice and tidies the engine bay up a touch.
http://forum.wscc.co.uk/forum/index.php/files/download/34-westfield-world-issue-five-2009/



You might need to copy and paste the article as it's members only :-)


Would be interested to see also if you can C&P

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Rob Allison

posted on 18/1/16 at 12:39 AM Reply With Quote
When you understand how the standard stat block works then its easy to see what water rails will work. Its a modern engine and oil heating is a big thing.






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Paul Turner

posted on 18/1/16 at 12:47 PM Reply With Quote
I had a Raceline Water rail on mine when I fitted the Zetec back in 2001. It looked great. Raceline have a top notch reputation, it simplified the plumbing and since I was removing a x-flow I already had the stat housing, cap and stat to refit.

I have no heater fitted and drilling a hole in the stat to ensure some circulation before the stat opened did sound like a bodge but went ahead since, as I said above, Raceline have a top reputation.

Initially the system appeared to bleed the air out with no issues and the expansion bottle filled and emptied just like it had with the x-flow fitted but unlike the x-flow the gauge never read a constant temp, it was up and down over a 20 degree range. The sensor and gauge were the ones from the x-flow so they were compatible but to be sure I changed the sensor which made no difference.

Drilled another hole in the stat which made no difference.

Then the system pressurised and dumped all its water on the drive after a short leisurely spring drive. Presumed it would be the head gasket (engine was used strait from Mondeo) so stripped head off but everything looked OK with the original gasket so a bit of a mystery.

While it was apart I took the committee decision to fit the standard stat housing, stat etc and plumb it in as Ford intended with a pressurised header. 15 years and many 1000 of miles later I have never regretted my decision. Rock steady gauge reading which gives you a bit of confidence. Shortly after converting it back I picked up one of the rare alloy stat housings off and old Orion and have since replaced all the dodgy looking rubber with nice silicone pipes.

The one good thing about the Raceline rail was selling it on e-bay, got almost what I had paid since it appeared Raceline were out of stock when I auctioned it.

I have bought more stuff from Raceline since, never had an issue but I could not recommend the water rail.

Below are pics of what it looks like and how I connected it all together.






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big_wasa

posted on 18/1/16 at 01:58 PM Reply With Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Paul Turner

Drilled another hole in the stat which made no difference.





My experience was similar except the extra drillings made the overcooling worse. The advice was three around the stat to allow a more even flow over the bulb.

Worked great at tick over.

Worked great if you thrashed it.

On a steady run it would only get to 30~40 deg and that's not good for a zetec or emissions.

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Rob Allison

posted on 18/1/16 at 02:33 PM Reply With Quote
Did you not have the oil heat exchanger connected?






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Paul Turner

posted on 18/1/16 at 02:46 PM Reply With Quote
Never had an oil cooler fitted to mine. On a hot summers day the oil only gets to 90 degrees stood in traffic and in spring/autumn barely gets to 80 degrees. The oil stat would only open once a flood thus I would be carrying extra weight and complications about for no benefit.
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jeffw

posted on 18/1/16 at 02:52 PM Reply With Quote
My Raceline Waterrail works fine. Water temp comes up to 90 deg and then cycles upto 96 deg before the fan comes in and then it drops to 92 deg.

Don't have a problem with over-cooling, over-heating or low oil temps.






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britishtrident

posted on 18/1/16 at 02:55 PM Reply With Quote
A though occured to me a heavily modded engine that pushes the rad heat exchange capcity to near the limit will always will suffer less from overheat-over cool cycles than a bog standard engine.

In the month before christmas I watched one of the americam TST seminars on Cooling Systems in the 21 Century, it was a marathon video and I can't rember half of the finer detail they gave but one of the issues they highlighted was that the control of the flow through cooling systems is going to become a lot more complex and that manufacturers are progressively increasing by-pass flow.

A problem with lack of by-pass flow they mentioned was that it has been identified as a major cause of failure of water pumps with plastic impellers, when the out flow from the pump is blocked the exra torque required to spin the impeller against can cause the shaft to start slipping in the impeller.





[I] What use our work, Bennet, if we cannot care for those we love? .
― From BBC TV/Amazon's Ripper Street.
[/I]

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