Supergoose
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| posted on 21/3/12 at 10:05 PM |
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Locost Sump
Has/does anyone found any benfits from running anything other than a standard sump?
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Strontium Dog
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| posted on 22/3/12 at 12:03 AM |
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What, apart from being able to drive over speed bumps and small stones?!
http://s187.photobucket.com/albums/x319/zephyr2000/General%20forum%20uploads/?action=view¤t=3DEngine.mp4
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modee
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| posted on 22/3/12 at 12:59 AM |
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If you attempt to race a crossflow with a standard sump in a locost the engine will be sitting far to high in the chassis. Corners such as Coram and
Gerrards will kill an engine with an un-baffled sump.
[Edited on 22/3/12 by modee]
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Richard Jenkins
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| posted on 22/3/12 at 06:37 PM |
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Even with a modified (i.e. shortened) sump you will still have the flywheel and gearbox bellhousing giving you no effective reduction in ground
clearance.
If you have a Tony Law (or equivalent) exhaust then you can't lower the engine too much otherwise the manifold fouls on the top chassis rail.
A baffled sump is a good recommendation but not essential, I ran a standard unbaffled sump for 3 years without any engine problems.
[Edited on 22/3/12 by Richard Jenkins]
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modee
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| posted on 22/3/12 at 07:14 PM |
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Hi Richard. I guess we have very different approaches to car building. I wouldn't dare run with a standard sump and I always had the bottom of
the sump 10mm below the chassis. Good luck at Silverstone.
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Supergoose
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| posted on 22/3/12 at 08:06 PM |
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The thing is I have purchased a lovely car with an unknown engine un installed, unfortunately the previous owner missed a gear and blew the motor, he
sourced a motor form elsewhere from an ex racer that finished racing and exchanged the race engine for something more interesting. So I’m pulling the
unknown lump apart measuring and weighing to check spec while reading the regulations. The motor seems very good so far although it doesn’t seem to be
running the control Kent cam. How long has the Kent cam been part of regulation? Also need to swot up on offset dowels.
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Supergoose
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| posted on 22/3/12 at 08:08 PM |
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ie, i dont know how high the motor is sitting on its current mounts
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modee
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| posted on 22/3/12 at 08:19 PM |
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Supergoose. Any engine used since 2005 (I think) should have the spec. Kent cam. You will need to fit one before you race. Maurice.
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procomp
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| posted on 27/3/12 at 11:00 AM |
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Hi
A properly baffled sump is a MUST if you want to look after the engine long term. There's plenty off evidence of what happens when the baffling
/ oil pickup pipe are not done right.
Most where using a Burtons sump but they are now out of stock and are not planing to have more made. However there are plenty of us who do make them
for Circa £300. Or given your relatively local pop down with a cammera and take some pics of how we do it and replicate as what we run is a proven
working design over the last 20 years.
Cheers Matt
PS. By the looks off some off the advice being given on here Re engines i think you may do better just contacting in person those that actually know
what they are doing rather than being led down a very expensive garden path.
As always it's far cheaper to do the job right first time than feck it up first time and still end up having to do it right after. 
Cheers Matt
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Richard Jenkins
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| posted on 27/3/12 at 07:14 PM |
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For the record I'm not an expert on engines and don't claim to be. I also don't give any warranties on what worked for me would be
fine for anyone else, but guess I was either lucky or slow to race with an unbaffled sump.
[Edited on 27/3/12 by Richard Jenkins]
[Edited on 27/3/12 by Richard Jenkins]
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Trollyjack
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| posted on 27/3/12 at 10:03 PM |
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Don't supose you will take a photo and put it in your Archive Matt Please
Too far to come and take a photo
TrollyJack
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procomp
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| posted on 28/3/12 at 03:17 PM |
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Hi
Richard the only way you would have survived with a STD sump would have been if you where running with a 1600 ( BA ) dipstick and filling it to the
full mark, That would have meant you had the oil level way too high for a 1300.
Everyone who has ran with the 1300 dipstick ( AA ) and run the oil at the correct level in a STD sump has either been very slow or had the engine last
2-3 laps. If evidence is needed just look at how long certain engines where lasting that where built by those using poor baffling and a bodged pickup
pipes. When your spending decent money on the rest off the engine skimping on the sump is ridiculous when there is designs out there that can be
copied to ensure it's taken care off.
Cheers Matt
PS ill get some pics after Silverstone off the design or rather the templates to allow one to be built as i don't think i have a sump
that's not fitted currently.
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Dick Axtell
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| posted on 28/3/12 at 04:20 PM |
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quote:
Originally posted by procomp
A properly baffled sump is a MUST if you want to look after the engine long term. There's plenty off evidence of what happens when the baffling
/ oil pickup pipe are not done right.
Maybe you can modify an oil pick-up to suit an already-shortened sump? Would be very interested to hear if its possible.
BTW - This isn't for track use. Merely a mod to overcome lack of ground clearance with existing std Xflow sump.
[Edited on 28/3/12 by Dick Axtell]
Work-in-Progress: Changed to Zetec + T9. Still trying!!
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procomp
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| posted on 28/3/12 at 06:12 PM |
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Hi.
No chance, to get the right clearance to the floor of the sump and manage to sneak the pipe routing between the sump side and con rod bolts (
especially if using ARP ) you need the engine/sump that it's going to fit and then weld it up on a dummy block.
Just been looking at the car that the OP has brought. It's originally Paul Presgraves car that was brought by Mark and now with the OP. The race
engine that Mark swapped Etc was the one we built for him to replace the one he buggered at Cadwell. If you know who's engine he then purchased
that would give me a very good idea of what state it would be in tuning wise. Or as usual ill make the offer of saying if you want to bring the bits
over one evening next week or when suits we will go all over it with you and give you all the info you need etc FOC.
Cheers Matt
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Dick Axtell
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| posted on 28/3/12 at 06:38 PM |
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So its not quite as straightforward as I's hoped. Have to re-examine the shortened sump, and pick-up which went with it. Problem with this p/u -
no means of securing it in place (original brkt removed due to being shortened).
Will call if I can get over to you. Thanks for your comments.
Work-in-Progress: Changed to Zetec + T9. Still trying!!
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coozer
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| posted on 28/3/12 at 07:39 PM |
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I would like to baffle the sump on my blacktop after chopping it down so its level with the gearbox/bellhousing.
Any pictures of the best way to do it would be much appreciated.
Is just welding a box round the pickup a good way?
Regards,
Steve
1972 V8 Jago
1980 Z750
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Supergoose
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| posted on 1/4/12 at 07:48 AM |
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I'm also looking for photos please
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Supergoose
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| posted on 1/4/12 at 03:43 PM |
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quote:
Originally posted by procomp
Hi.
No chance, to get the right clearance to the floor of the sump and manage to sneak the pipe routing between the sump side and con rod bolts (
especially if using ARP ) you need the engine/sump that it's going to fit and then weld it up on a dummy block.
Just been looking at the car that the OP has brought. It's originally Paul Presgraves car that was brought by Mark and now with the OP. The race
engine that Mark swapped Etc was the one we built for him to replace the one he buggered at Cadwell. If you know who's engine he then purchased
that would give me a very good idea of what state it would be in tuning wise. Or as usual ill make the offer of saying if you want to bring the bits
over one evening next week or when suits we will go all over it with you and give you all the info you need etc FOC.
Cheers Matt
Mines Paul Presgraves ex locost, realy dont know whos engine i ended up with, but pauls was re built and put in a differn't car as i understand
it. I've now got an unbaffled shortened sump that i will convert. but ta v much 
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dhutch
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| posted on 1/4/12 at 08:10 PM |
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quote:
Originally posted by Strontium Dog
What, apart from being able to drive over speed bumps ...
This really, in my case.
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Trollyjack
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| posted on 3/4/12 at 08:22 PM |
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which sump to shorten
I've got two sumps one is from a 1300GT
This one is around 6.5" deep and already has some baffleing in I know not enough
 
Description
 
Description
But I have also got a std 1300 sump which is deeper up to an extra 1.5" deeper.
this one has no baffles at all
 
Description
 
Description
What depth should I be heading for, I have been told around "5 by a fellow member but have lost his drawing
Can some one help
TrollyJack
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Trollyjack
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| posted on 9/4/12 at 09:14 PM |
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Can any one tell me do I have to shorten the GT sump and will I have to add any more baffle plates
TrollyJack
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ShaunB
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| posted on 9/4/12 at 10:26 PM |
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When I first bought my Locost racer it was fitted with a standard GT sump but with some additions to keep more of the oil in the bowl:
 
Baffled Xflow Sump
I personally didn't have any oil pressure issues with it, but I did have ground clearance issues. The lowest part is the leading edge of the
bowl, mine was very scraped and eventually cracked. To complete the rest of the season I welded the crack and then overplated the leading edge with
some 2mm sheet I had handy:
 
Sump guard
For this year I've modified another sump reducing the bowl depth by 20mm, but adding the lost capacity back by making the front deeper (20mm
brings the base of the sump to the same height as the bottom of the bellhousing). A box has been added around the (shortened) pickup and a windage
tray installed - sorry no photos as it's on the car at the minute. Again it's all working fine so far, and the oil pressure has been good
around Silverstone and Snetterton.
When I get around to doing another one, I will go the last step and have a gated box around the pickup.
Cheers,
Shaun.
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