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Author: Subject: Thinking about a bike engine.....
pekwah1

posted on 1/1/19 at 08:30 PM Reply With Quote
Thinking about a bike engine.....

Hi guys,

Iíve got a striker with a 2.0 blacktop zetec running through a type 9 to escort rear diff.
Although itís a great engine, Iím pretty sure Iíll end up swapping at some point this year and am seriously thinking about going down the bike engine route.

Iíve been reading a bit on this but not really sure on engine choice.
Iím hoping to have at least 170hp and I figure thereís no point doing a bike conversion without using the gearbox as well.

So any ideas what my best choice of bike donor would be? Ideally this will be on a budget so looking for cost effectiveness over going straight down the busís router etc.

Thanks in advance,
Andy

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Ugg10

posted on 1/1/19 at 08:42 PM Reply With Quote
With the escort rear end you will struggle to get the gearing right. Lowest ratio available is 3.54:1 which will limit your top speed to something like 110mph and make using 1st and 2nd gear very vicious. Most bike engine cars run something around 3.1 from either a Sierra (getting rare and expensive) or the freelander but these are irs type rear suspensions.

170hp from a bike engine you will be running some quite expensive engine r1 probably the cheapest, fire blade 1000cc late model, hyabussa, zx14. Most will need a sump mod and also a power commander to sort out fuelling if you do not use the stock air box which will probably stick through the bonnet.

May be easier and more cost effective effective to turbo or supercharge (there are rotrex at the top end but also some merc/mini Eaton cheaper options) the Zetec to 250-300hp.

Remembering that if you up the bop/ton significantly you will need to make sure the brakes, suspension, chassis and your skill (no aspertions cast) are up to the job.

[Edited on 1/1/19 by Ugg10]

[Edited on 1/1/19 by Ugg10]





---------------------------------------------------------------
1968 Ford Anglia 105e, 1.7 Zetec SE, Mk2 Escort Workd Cup front end, 5 link rear
Build Blog - http://Anglia1968.weebly.com

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CosKev3

posted on 1/1/19 at 08:43 PM Reply With Quote
The gearbox is integral to the engine,so you will have to use it!

Height of the newer engines is a issue,especially if you don't want to cut your bonnet.

What budget are you thinking?

As there can be a massive difference in costs between engines and associated parts to get it fitted and running safely and reliably

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Ugg10

posted on 1/1/19 at 08:47 PM Reply With Quote
Another option is to sort out the gearbox ratios (bgh, spc helical long first etc.) and add an atb diff if you donít already have one. This will transform the Zetec, you are then set for power upgrades. Also assuming your brakes are up to the job.

The upgrade spiral begins!

[Edited on 1/1/19 by Ugg10]





---------------------------------------------------------------
1968 Ford Anglia 105e, 1.7 Zetec SE, Mk2 Escort Workd Cup front end, 5 link rear
Build Blog - http://Anglia1968.weebly.com

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Nickp

posted on 1/1/19 at 09:06 PM Reply With Quote
What about upgrading to an ST170 engine? Much cheaper / simpler than completely re-engineering the car
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perksy

posted on 1/1/19 at 09:49 PM Reply With Quote
Might be worth trying a Bec first and see how it feels ?

You *might* decide to stick with the car engine afterwards or you might still believe its the right choice

To be fair in a light car like the Striker a Bike engine works well, but once fitted its a done deal, so perhaps try one first?

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pekwah1

posted on 1/1/19 at 10:06 PM Reply With Quote
Thanks for the comments all, yes I think going out in one would be a good idea.

Iím just playing with ideas really and deciding what to do.
Options so far have been;

1. BEC
2. Turbo the existing blacktop
3. ST170 (although have heard the actual power is not quite as stated)
4. 2ZZ-GE

Itís not something Iím itching to do right now, just deciding which way I might go.
For a car engine hoping for somewhere close to 200hp for now

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AdamR20

posted on 1/1/19 at 10:11 PM Reply With Quote
Depends how you use the car I guess, but IMO bike engine is the best route.

I too have English axle and 3.54 diff with a CBR1000 gives 120mph top end and just over 60 in 1st, perfect IMO. Have a spare crown wheel and pinion if you need one.

Conversion cost is quite a lot though, starting with an engine for 2k you'll be at 5k easily before its all running properly. Cheaper to swap car entirely, but I know some people (such as me) like the engineering challenge!

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pekwah1

posted on 2/1/19 at 12:09 AM Reply With Quote
Thanks, yeh really fancy a bike engine but just aware itís a bit more involved and the cost will be a factor.
I chose my zetec upgrade (from cvh) as it only cost me about 500-600 all in to get installed.

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Nickp

posted on 2/1/19 at 05:40 AM Reply With Quote
quote:
Originally posted by pekwah1

3. ST170 (although have heard the actual power is not quite as stated)




An ST170 should make 180-200bhp, on bike carbs or throttle bodies, with correctly set up fuel/ign/VVT.
This obviously depends on which rolling road you believe
Mine cost me £100 and goes very well indeed

PS I used to be a biker, and love bike engines, in bikes. It's all down to personal choice though.

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motorcycle_mayhem

posted on 2/1/19 at 10:27 AM Reply With Quote
I still have the majority of my Westfield (now gone) GSXR 750/1000 installation. Engines (750, several 1000's in various states of motorsport tune), loom, exhaust system, etc.
Not the usual questionable equipment, so it won't be as cheap as you'd want and therefore probably undesirable, but it seemed prudent to let you know it's still available.

How it all fits
How it all fits

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big_wasa

posted on 2/1/19 at 12:07 PM Reply With Quote
Are you still on Oem managment ?

Don't get me wrong I love it but ditching it in favour of throttle bodies, some cams and head work would really wake the car up.

I am half way through charging mine. Even on the cheap its anything but.

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Daf

posted on 2/1/19 at 02:22 PM Reply With Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Nickp
quote:
Originally posted by pekwah1

3. ST170 (although have heard the actual power is not quite as stated)




An ST170 should make 180-200bhp, on bike carbs or throttle bodies, with correctly set up fuel/ign/VVT.
This obviously depends on which rolling road you believe
Mine cost me £100 and goes very well indeed

PS I used to be a biker, and love bike engines, in bikes. It's all down to personal choice though.


Totally agree with this - I have an ST170 in mine and on Emeralds rolling road it made 178bhp, stock engine on Throttle bodies. I'm hoping to extract more from it by playing with the VVT set up.

I'm also a biker and think bike engines belong in bikes!

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Nickp

posted on 2/1/19 at 04:38 PM Reply With Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Daf

Totally agree with this - I have an ST170 in mine and on Emeralds rolling road it made 178bhp, stock engine on Throttle bodies. I'm hoping to extract more from it by playing with the VVT set up.




What are you currently doing with the VVT? Is it operating properly, switching or fixed?

[Edited on 2/1/19 by Nickp]

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jossey

posted on 2/1/19 at 06:09 PM Reply With Quote
I did a cheap conversion on my tiger Avon zetec to a 893 fireblade engine. Costs below as follows.


Engine ecu airbox and wiring 280 very cheap at time for good engine
Exhaust manifold and exhaust 280
Fuel pump 20
Prop 180 second hand
Metal for mounts and cradle 25
New oil plugs etc for engine 45
Prop adaptor 45
Gear change mech using cable and lever 45

So for a very cheap 115hp engine I paid over £900

Great fun but more than I expected.

Then as mentioned above I needed a diff so that was another 150 quid 5 years ago for a 3.38 and rebuilt for 100 quid.

The next time I did a conversion I bought a whole damaged bike and sold the bits so the engine was free.

Much more cost involved to do a cbr1000 or powerful engine.

Good luck with the build

[Edited on 2/1/19 by jossey]





Thanks



David Johnson

Building my tiger avon slowly but surely.

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Daf

posted on 3/1/19 at 09:28 AM Reply With Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Nickp
quote:
Originally posted by Daf

Totally agree with this - I have an ST170 in mine and on Emeralds rolling road it made 178bhp, stock engine on Throttle bodies. I'm hoping to extract more from it by playing with the VVT set up.




What are you currently doing with the VVT? Is it operating properly, switching or fixed?

[Edited on 2/1/19 by Nickp]


Bodged at the moment by switching it on and off Ė however Iím planning on trying the VVT pro from MS electronics, failing that I might ditch it and go over to a set of verniers. Iíll let you know how I get on

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Ugg10

posted on 3/1/19 at 02:46 PM Reply With Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Daf
quote:
Originally posted by Nickp
quote:
Originally posted by Daf

Totally agree with this - I have an ST170 in mine and on Emeralds rolling road it made 178bhp, stock engine on Throttle bodies. I'm hoping to extract more from it by playing with the VVT set up.




What are you currently doing with the VVT? Is it operating properly, switching or fixed?

[Edited on 2/1/19 by Nickp]


Bodged at the moment by switching it on and off Ė however Iím planning on trying the VVT pro from MS electronics, failing that I might ditch it and go over to a set of verniers. Iíll let you know how I get on


What ECU are you running. If it is Emerald K6, depending on the serial number they can do a firmware fix to allow it to run full VCT control. I am doing this at the moment for my Puma 1.7 VCT engine, still waiting for a file from Emerald.





---------------------------------------------------------------
1968 Ford Anglia 105e, 1.7 Zetec SE, Mk2 Escort Workd Cup front end, 5 link rear
Build Blog - http://Anglia1968.weebly.com

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Freestyle_998

posted on 3/1/19 at 04:35 PM Reply With Quote
I'm enjoying my bike engine build, looking on for "track bikes" can net you something lower outlay but with plenty of bits to sell off to cover the cost of the motor.

Torque is the question I guess, GSXR 1100, Hayabusa, R1, etc

I have a 5VY R1, primarily to avoid carbs () Will i wish I stumped up the hefty premium for the 'busa? can always upgrade next time


The only downside I can see is bleeding ears!

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