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Do I need a little Van?

pigeondave - 6/1/21 at 10:18 AM

Hi all,

I'm looking for a bit of a discussion on if I need a little van.
I currently have an old ST170 as a daily which has done approx 160,000 miles. I should probably look at replacing it as the rust is starting to come through on the doors. I'm thinking little van.

I've started mountain biking again a couple of years ago and getting the bike in and out the car is ok, but it limits me to only being able to stick my bike in the back.

My thinking is, if i get a little van (L2 Transit connect) I can throw the bike and my nephews bike in the back and we can ride other places. Also the L2 can take a 8x4 sheet which will be useful at times as well as moving other bits and bobs.

Im also thinking I could one day get a trailer and do some trackdays with the Fury.

I only have a standard licence so am limited on towing weights.

It will be my daily driver so not really looking for a bigger van. Its only me, but would like 3 seats as it would give me the option to take both nephews riding.

Is a van the right answer or should i look at a space waggon type thing?

Ideas please.

myke pocock - 6/1/21 at 10:42 AM

If your not bothered about street cred why not look at a Berlingo Multispace. Option to take the back seats out if required and not a bad driver. I had three and towed my twin axle trailer with my Skoda Estelle trials car on it.

cliftyhanger - 6/1/21 at 11:58 AM

The downside of small vans is they cost a fortune to buy. Especially once you add VAT. I guess depreciation is less though?

sebastiaan - 6/1/21 at 12:17 PM

quote:
Originally posted by myke pocock
If your not bothered about street cred why not look at a Berlingo Multispace. Option to take the back seats out if required and not a bad driver. I had three and towed my twin axle trailer with my Skoda Estelle trials car on it.

This!

I've got one as well. Very useful thing, park/leave it anywhere worry-free and it'll swallow anything ;-)

Cheap as chips to buy and tough as nails as well.

Description

[Edited on 6/1/21 by sebastiaan]

theconrodkid - 6/1/21 at 12:36 PM

transit connects are the work of the devil, as others have said, a berlingo or similar would be my choice

pigeondave - 6/1/21 at 12:45 PM

We had a French van at the bakery before, electrics were never right. But that was a long time ago.

What's the issue with the blue oval which makes them so bad?

Also what sort of power should i be looking at?

steve m - 6/1/21 at 01:06 PM

Ive driven loads of Transit Customs, and if i had a need for a van, that is what i would go for,
The new incarnation of a transit, is nothing like a van, and drives like a big car,

pigeondave - 6/1/21 at 01:33 PM

quote:
Originally posted by steve m
Ive driven loads of Transit Customs, and if i had a need for a van, that is what i would go for,
The new incarnation of a transit, is nothing like a van, and drives like a big car,

Yeah i see the turning circle on the Custom is similar to the Connect. Its just it looks like a van when i take it to the shops, also I think it'll be over weight if i were to get a trailer.

nick205 - 6/1/21 at 01:34 PM

We had a Transit Connect SWB at work, 05 plate, had it from new until a couple of years ago. It was slow, niosy and laborious to drive. We had the load space ply lined, which made it easier getting stuff in and out - if I was going to load cycles in/out I'd consider at least having the floor ply covered.

We replaced it with a 3 year old Vauxhall Vivaro 1.6D, I've not driven it, but it seems more pleasant to be in and less noisy.

For MTB use have you considered a 4x4 pick-up, perhaps with a 5 seat crew cab?

You can get reasonably priced cover things to go over the tailgates so you stand bikes up with their front wheels hanging out over the tailgate. If you get a 4x4 one you'll open up a wider range of places you can get your bike to for decent MTBing. Pick-up load bay will take bits you may want to haul around on occaision as well.

pigeondave - 6/1/21 at 01:40 PM

quote:
Originally posted by nick205

For MTB use have you considered a 4x4 pick-up, perhaps with a 5 seat crew cab?

Its a case of jewels and tools for me. Not, "tools not jewels" as my mate keeps reminding me.
I'd ideally like to keep the bike inside the vehicle.
Also being coved will give me some scope to getting out of the rain and pulling on a dry pair of Y-fronts

it was considered though

Mash - 6/1/21 at 03:27 PM

I bought an ex RAC Transit 8 years ago. IT's orange of course, but apparently according to my younger mates with surf wagons, that's cool

I actually do use it as my daily driver as it's pretty bomb proof and we live half a mile down a really rough farm track. It's been absolutely invaluable to me, as I used it to carry all sorts of building materials, engines, axles, you name it. Plus I've used it to help Mates move house, and carry my push bike and my motor bike and it never struggles. It also has a tailgate, which is really handy for getting changed under after biking running/hiking trips.

I did swap the diff out for a 3.7 as the original 4.something was useless and I got a man I know to "play" with the ecu for economy, so that if I took it steady (and with a van you have to because of the speed limits) it would return high 30s mpg. (After he did his magic, it also raised the PS from 100 to an estimated 140 and on a closed track I've had over 100 mph out of it.

It is a 330 though(3.3 tonnes), so that may impinge on your towing allowances, but as I'm an old gimmer I can legally tow up to it's max train weight, which easily covers me towing my homemade twin axle caravan type trailer with my MK Indy on it, or my 3/4 ton digger.

It has had some expensive problems in the last 12 months though, fuel pump and cam chain tensioners, but considered over the time I've had it I can't complain.

pmc_3 - 6/1/21 at 03:34 PM

Also it can mess about with you NCB if you want to move back to a car in the future.

Mash - 6/1/21 at 03:39 PM

quote:
Originally posted by pmc_3
Also it can mess about with you NCB if you want to move back to a car in the future.

Never had a problem with mine, I use A plan and they have been fine with NCB

pmc_3 - 6/1/21 at 03:56 PM

When I used Adrian Flux to insure an Astra van they said it needed to be a commercial policy and my NCB would be converted. Mind you I don't think I had an issue when I changed back to a car.

Deckman001 - 6/1/21 at 04:15 PM

We've had Berlingos on 2 year leases for the last 12 years, all were brilliant apart from the last one which lasted 6 months before going back to the dealer with an intermittent electrical fault, it had to be returned to Citroen eventually as no dealer could find the fault and fix it so the lease was ended early with a very good refund.
We now use a full sized Transit full time instead. 130,000 miles in two and a half years and the only problem we've had is quite a lot of Blue additive needed.

Jason

Slimy38 - 6/1/21 at 04:55 PM

quote:
Originally posted by pmc_3
When I used Adrian Flux to insure an Astra van they said it needed to be a commercial policy and my NCB would be converted. Mind you I don't think I had an issue when I changed back to a car.

That was my friends issue, they would not accept that it was only for private use and insisted on a commercial policy. I think he went with a specialist in the end but it was still expensive for what it was.

That was one of the Ford small van things, basically a Fiesta estate with metal windows? I can't remember what they're called.

motorcycle_mayhem - 6/1/21 at 04:56 PM

My 2002 Transhit is my (only) daily driver, LWB high top, 3.5T, galactical mileage, extreme corrosion. It's noisy and slow (75 BHP), but the latter is everybody else's problem, not mine. It's my idea of perfect transport.
Not only would the MTB's fit in, but you can suit up in your Lycra in comfort inside, standing upright with you MAMIL mates!

Insurance - hmmm... there are plenty of Brokers that will not insure a 'Commercial Vehicle' for private use. The few that do are quite happy to quote on par with my partner's Mundaneo, the car is a similar age, slightly older. If the van is sign written, that excludes it.

nick205 - 7/1/21 at 10:18 AM

quote:
Originally posted by pigeondave

quote:
Originally posted by nick205

For MTB use have you considered a 4x4 pick-up, perhaps with a 5 seat crew cab?

Its a case of jewels and tools for me. Not, "tools not jewels" as my mate keeps reminding me.
I'd ideally like to keep the bike inside the vehicle.
Also being coved will give me some scope to getting out of the rain and pulling on a dry pair of Y-fronts

it was considered though

Good points - I'd have the same to consider myself. There's "Truckman" fibreglass tops you can get to fit over the load area. that would give you some cover/security. Albeit at more ŁŁŁ spent to get it though.

I'm seeing your logic in a small van.

A neighbour of mine (self-employed sparky by trade) has just bought an ex British Gas VW Caddy (Hi-Top I think) with 13k miles on it. It looks pretty much new and is like a car inside. No idea what he paid for it, but he chanced his arm and bought at auction - seems to have lucked out!

The Transit Connect SWB he was replacing had failed it's MoT and was rapidly disappearing to the tin worm around him - went to the scrapper.

pigeondave - 7/1/21 at 11:04 AM

quote:
Originally posted by motorcycle_mayhem

Not only would the MTB's fit in, but you can suit up in your Lycra in comfort inside, standing upright with you MAMIL mates!

Its MTBing I don't wear Lycra, although the Y-fronts are a bit tight at times

nick205 - 8/1/21 at 10:20 AM

quote:
Originally posted by pigeondave

quote:
Originally posted by motorcycle_mayhem

Not only would the MTB's fit in, but you can suit up in your Lycra in comfort inside, standing upright with you MAMIL mates!

Its MTBing I don't wear Lycra, although the Y-fronts are a bit tight at times

MTB younger "dudes" seem to shun the lycra. I can ubderstand that to an extent. Myself I always wear lycra cycling shorts for any type of cycling, just find them the most comfortable and best fitting. I may chose to wear another layer over the top if it's cold, but that's usually snug fitting cycling leggings - again comfortable and they don't drag unecessary clods of mud around with me. General preference for snug fitting clothes to minimise the flapping and drag (and chances of catching foliage when off road).

pigeondave - 8/1/21 at 10:28 AM

quote:
Originally posted by nick205

MTB younger "dudes" seem to shun the lycra. I can ubderstand that to an extent. Myself I always wear lycra cycling shorts for any type of cycling, just find them the most comfortable and best fitting. I may chose to wear another layer over the top if it's cold, but that's usually snug fitting cycling leggings - again comfortable and they don't drag unecessary clods of mud around with me. General preference for snug fitting clothes to minimise the flapping and drag (and chances of catching foliage when off road).

I'm young but not cool, I have mudhuggers front AND REAR this keeps the mud down. I'm on a Bird Zero AM so the rear guard is fairly easy to fit.

Only time I'm in any form of Lycra its when I was lifting, but I've not been down the gym for months nearly a year.

nick205 - 8/1/21 at 11:49 AM

quote:
Originally posted by pigeondave

quote:
Originally posted by nick205

MTB younger "dudes" seem to shun the lycra. I can ubderstand that to an extent. Myself I always wear lycra cycling shorts for any type of cycling, just find them the most comfortable and best fitting. I may chose to wear another layer over the top if it's cold, but that's usually snug fitting cycling leggings - again comfortable and they don't drag unecessary clods of mud around with me. General preference for snug fitting clothes to minimise the flapping and drag (and chances of catching foliage when off road).

I'm young but not cool, I have mudhuggers front AND REAR this keeps the mud down. I'm on a Bird Zero AM so the rear guard is fairly easy to fit.

Only time I'm in any form of Lycra its when I was lifting, but I've not been down the gym for months nearly a year.

Mud huggers are always a good idea IMHO - I have Crud Catcher's front and rear on my MTB to keep the mud at bay.

I'm not familiar with the Bird bikes, but the Bird Zero AM looks good. I too am a firm hardtail fan (lower mass and less servicing).

02GF74 - 8/1/21 at 05:48 PM

Another option is an estate car, which is exactly why I bought my volvo 850.

This was after seeing a geezer sleep in the back of a metro (who is old enough to remember them?) instead of in a tent.

I didn't think it fully through as although there is room for me in the back, the bike will not fit.

For trips, two 29in bikes fit in the back without having to remove the wheels but room for only two people in the front.

Something like a Discovery may fit more people and bikes.

BTW I wear lycra shorts, a throwback to my road riding days.

coyoteboy - 10/1/21 at 11:45 AM

quote:
Originally posted by nick205
For MTB use have you considered a 4x4 pick-up, perhaps with a 5 seat crew cab?

I've been through this thought process myself.

Larger vans are speed limited and cost if you want ti visit the council dump or go over bridges. They're really not comfy for long drives (at least the ones I've driven for work).

I'm not a fan of pickups for mtb, totally insecure and open to the elements. This means you can't park anywhere and dodge in for a sarnie without the worry that someone will have cut your locks and run. Or that on your motorway trip home you've pushed tons of water into your bearings (less of a concern, and has the positive of washing your bike lol)

I stuck with a Hilux Surf with tinted windows and spend my days drinking fuel 😂

Irony - 10/1/21 at 11:12 PM

Another vote for the Citroen Berlingo or Peogeot Partner. I have a 2004 Peogeot Partner Quicksilver, my elderly Dad gave it to me. it was 14 years old with 37k on the clock. Garaged all its life. Cam belt was 4 years past changing and the tires perished. It now has 100K with very very few repairs. Those repairs were due to lack of use.

Good Points:

Cheap as chips - 2.0HDi engine is in a million cars. Literally dirt cheap
Reliable as anything else.
Simple engineering, even the fuel primer is a hand pump!
So awful you don't give a crap - I've had grass, manure, broken concrete, cement, rubble, hardcore (arf arf), chickens and timber in the back.
No one will ever nick it.
Old folk let you out at junctions.
So many pockets and compartment in the interior, 32 in my quicksilver edition.
Nice chats with other owners in car parks to discuss how awful our vans are.
Huge, huge rear space with oodles of height for bikes.
Cheap insurance due to people never driving them at the speed limit.
Lift up boot lid so huge two people in chairs can shelter from rain.
Wife will not drive it.
Costs less per year than most cars per month.

Bad Points:

No street credibility what-so-ever, literally a step up from a mobility scooter.
Wife will not drive it
Anyone in the rear seats feels like the Pope.
Mates take the piss, literally all the time.

Irony - 10/1/21 at 11:16 PM

I would not advise a pickup in anyway for any reason personally. I drive these all the time at work. They are utterly average on road, utterly average off road (for a 4x4). Poxy rear space, horrendous fuel consumption and it is NOT A WORK VEHICLE if you cannot get a 8ft length of timber or pipe in.

All in my opinion of course.

nick205 - 11/1/21 at 10:22 AM

quote:
Originally posted by Irony
Another vote for the Citroen Berlingo or Peogeot Partner. I have a 2004 Peogeot Partner Quicksilver, my elderly Dad gave it to me. it was 14 years old with 37k on the clock. Garaged all its life. Cam belt was 4 years past changing and the tires perished. It now has 100K with very very few repairs. Those repairs were due to lack of use.

Good Points:

Cheap as chips - 2.0HDi engine is in a million cars. Literally dirt cheap
Reliable as anything else.
Simple engineering, even the fuel primer is a hand pump!
So awful you don't give a crap - I've had grass, manure, broken concrete, cement, rubble, hardcore (arf arf), chickens and timber in the back.
No one will ever nick it.
Old folk let you out at junctions.
So many pockets and compartment in the interior, 32 in my quicksilver edition.
Nice chats with other owners in car parks to discuss how awful our vans are.
Huge, huge rear space with oodles of height for bikes.
Cheap insurance due to people never driving them at the speed limit.
Lift up boot lid so huge two people in chairs can shelter from rain.
Wife will not drive it.
Costs less per year than most cars per month.

Bad Points:

No street credibility what-so-ever, literally a step up from a mobility scooter.
Wife will not drive it
Anyone in the rear seats feels like the Pope.
Mates take the piss, literally all the time.

Pretty good call!

We had a Peugeot 306 2.0 HDI a few years ago. Inexpensive to buy and run, reliable and it just pootled on for a long time. Serviced at home by me, SWMBO used it to haul our 3 kids (including twins) around for a number of years with a twin push chair. I loaded it up with all sorts (engines, rubble, rubbish dump trips etc.).