Breaker
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| posted on 18/1/10 at 05:28 PM |
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Eurotunnel: legal help wanted
18th December of last year I picked up my kit at MK and everything was fine untill we arrived in Folkestone. Oh yes, I was one of the lucky people
that were stuck in the queue for Eurotunnel to get back to France. My passenger and I arrived 2 hours before check-in so we were hoping to catch an
earlier train. But instead of this we queued for more then 5 hours. When we finally arrived at the check-in (after midnight) they only told us there
were no trains and we should come back the day after (although they were not sure there would be trains the day after) and then sent us to the exit
without futher information.
At the exit,lots of drivers parked their cars to the side of the road to get some sleep(even with young children in them). As it was freezing outside
we looked for a hotel and after the third try we found a free room.
The next morning we called the Eurotunnel infoline for dozens of times, but no luck to get a human on the line. Then it became clear to us the
Eurotunnel's information skills really s**k.
The hotel manager also helped us and we could contact Eurostar who were very helpfull to give us some telephone numbers of ferry-lines. They
couldn't help us with the the Eurotunnel story as Eurostar and Eurotunnel are a different enterprise.
We were lucky to book a ferry from Ramsgate to Ostend (Belgium). When I got home (more then 28 hours behind schedule) I sent a mail to Eurotunnel to
get a refund for the trip back. But didn't get an answer untill now.
I received a standard letter from them last week where they apologised for the "small" delay/inconvenience and stating it is not their
fault there were no trains. Not a word regarding the refund (70€ for the trip back).
This joke has cost me extra : 109€ for the ferry; 70€ for the hotel and 145€ extra for the van I hired (I returned it much too late, duh) to pick up
my kit. I have invoices for all of this.
Now my question is: how should I (as I'm not native English spoken or legal expert) write to Eurotunnel on a polite,official but firm way
that I want some decent financial compensation for this within 2 weeks or else I will sue their a**  . And should I write this to them by mail or
registered letter ?
[Edited on 18/1/10 by Breaker]
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mookaloid
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| posted on 18/1/10 at 05:39 PM |
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I suspect it depends on thier published terms and condition of sale.
Have a look on their website to see if you can get a copy and see what they commit to in terms of service level and decide if they broke the terms or
not.
"That thing you're thinking - it wont be that."
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blakep82
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| posted on 18/1/10 at 05:42 PM |
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^ i think he's going to be right on this. it'll be all over their terms and conditions, and will probably work in eurotunnels favor.
basically, you might be able to get some refund on the cost of the ticket if they're feeling generous. but i think their view will be, they
never said you couldn't go on the train when they were working again, so it was your choice to take the ferry insead, it was your choice to get
a hotel (you may bbe able to get a basic refund for some of it, but maybe not the full amount), and your choice to take a hired van
i really think you'll struggle.
here's the bit about refunds off eurotunnels T&Cs
"6. Refunds
6.1 Refunds on unused Tickets or any part thereof are not available as of right, but Eurotunnel will give reasonable consideration to applications for
refunds, provided that such applications are made in writing (enclosing the Ticket) to Eurotunnel within 3 months of the date of expiry of the unused
Ticket."
[Edited on 18/1/10 by blakep82]
________________________
IVA manual link http://www.businesslink.gov.uk/bdotg/action/detail?type=RESOURCES&itemId=1081997083
don't write OT on a new thread title, you're creating the topic, everything you write is very much ON topic!
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gottabedone
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| posted on 18/1/10 at 05:43 PM |
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Breaker,
I'm not a legal person but this may (or may not) help. It appeared on the
BBC news site today.
good luck
Steve
...................oh and I wouldn't worry about your english as it's better than a lot who have it as their first language
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JoelP
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| posted on 18/1/10 at 05:46 PM |
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in england (and possibly all europe) there is something called 'unfair terms in consumer contracts', which basically means that unfair
terms arent enforcable even if you signed to agree with them.
In this instance, they have clearly failed to fulfill their end of the deal. I dont see how anything in the terms and conditions could change this.
The hotel was unavoidable too. They may argue about the ferry trip, as you probably have no proof that they would not arrange a train for the next
day.
However, i would be optimistic that their first letter is simply a sly way to put off a good percentage of claims, so do keep on at them.
I would not mention a 2 week deadline myself, merely say that delaying the refund will result in increased legal fees.
But i would seek proper legal advice about this, theres only so much you can get from an internet forum!
Keep us posted!
Beware! Bourettes is binfectious.
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carpmart
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| posted on 18/1/10 at 05:53 PM |
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I think you will struggle to apply 'consequential loss' claims to a ticket you purchased on Eurotunnel.
I suspect that at best you will be able to get the tunnel ticket price refunded but nothing else.
There will be a clause in the T's and C's which says that Eurotunnel will refund only up to the purchase price of the ticket and that is
their maximum liability.
You only live once - make the most of it!
Radical Clubsport, Kwaker motor
'94 MX5 MK1, 1.8
F10 M5 - 600bhp Daily Hack 
Range Rover Sport - Wife's Car
Mercedes A class - Son's Car
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plantman
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| posted on 18/1/10 at 06:12 PM |
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personally i would send them a letter setting out the problems you experienced, whith photocopies of ALL the extra costs that you incurred. I,d tell
them you expect a full and complete refund plus what ever you decide is resonable for the extra stess and trouble, and wait and see what they say.
If you don't ask you don't get!!
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blakep82
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| posted on 18/1/10 at 06:17 PM |
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just had a look through the whole booking thing, it does offer you travel insurance to cover these things (as far as i can see by a quick look
through. it mentions personal libility, late departure, cancellations etc.
http://www.eurotunnel.com/NR/rdonlyres/64AA8133-A2AF-4355-A528-A1B24FC2DAD4/0/FSAInsuranceConditions.pdf
and as part of the booking you had to click a button saying you either
1) understand the risk of travelling without insurance
or
2) you have other arrangements in place
the insurance is by eurotunnel personal travel insurance and underwritten by someone else. i suspect the compensation payout thing mentioned above
will be through the insurance pay outs
________________________
IVA manual link http://www.businesslink.gov.uk/bdotg/action/detail?type=RESOURCES&itemId=1081997083
don't write OT on a new thread title, you're creating the topic, everything you write is very much ON topic!
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prawnabie
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| posted on 18/1/10 at 06:38 PM |
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It was on the radio that they are expected to give £££££££'s in compensation because of the fiasco.
Hope you get what you are owed
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Breaker
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| posted on 18/1/10 at 06:41 PM |
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quote:
Originally posted by JoelP
They may argue about the ferry trip, as you probably have no proof that they would not arrange a train for the next day.
Ok, but Eurotunnel also failed to inform me there would be trains the next day. No info via telephone, no info on their website. I could again have
queued for several hours just to hear again the problem isn't solved yet and I should come back "later". I would have queued the day
after If they could confirm there was a train, but I got no info whatsoever...
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andyharding
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| posted on 18/1/10 at 06:45 PM |
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http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/england/kent/8465845.stm
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Breaker
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| posted on 18/1/10 at 06:51 PM |
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quote:
Originally posted by andyharding
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/england/kent/8465845.stm
I hope this also counts for Eurotunnel (car-transport). Eurostar (people-transport) is a separate enterprise...
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theconrodkid
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| posted on 18/1/10 at 07:10 PM |
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sorry to hear about your troubles,i have used this site a couple of times,the info is FREE
http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/
who cares who wins
pass the pork pies
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JoelP
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| posted on 18/1/10 at 07:34 PM |
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well personally i think their terms and conditions are irrelevant. A loss was incured by their failure to provide the agreed services.
if you need any letters proof reading in english, just ask.
Beware! Bourettes is binfectious.
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MakeEverything
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| posted on 18/1/10 at 08:18 PM |
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is this not what travel insurance is for???
Check your bank, household insurance and any other financial moneygrabber that you use, as they may cover it.
Failing that, i doubt youll get anything unless you appoint a solicitor but even then, it looks a bit bleak. Sorry to hear the news.
Kindest Regards,
Richard.
...You can make it foolProof, but youll never make it Idiot Proof!...
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JoelP
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| posted on 18/1/10 at 08:29 PM |
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so if i sell someone something and fail to deliver, they must claim on their insurance and they cannot sue me? Nice, time to list the ferraris on ebay
then! I'll just put something suitable in the terms and conditions
Beware! Bourettes is binfectious.
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MakeEverything
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| posted on 18/1/10 at 09:59 PM |
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quote:
Originally posted by JoelP
so if i sell someone something and fail to deliver, they must claim on their insurance and they cannot sue me?
No, Travel insurance pays out for the alternatives required during these problems, additional cash (Sometimes) and covers the cost of cancelled
travel.
As above, most travel operators refuse to refund or transfer - hence the need for travel insurance in the first place.
If you sell a product to someone, and its in the clause that you are not accountable for damage or loss in the post, if the persons signs it to say
they accept these terms, then you cannot reasonably be held responsible.
Note the term "Reasonably". A key word that any claims court of judge will use quite readily.
[Edited on 18/1/10 by MakeEverything]
Kindest Regards,
Richard.
...You can make it foolProof, but youll never make it Idiot Proof!...
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morcus
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| posted on 18/1/10 at 10:31 PM |
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At best your get your ticket money back from Eurotunnel, as said before, check to see if you've got any kind of insurance that covers this.
Its unfortunate but as you said there were hundreds of other people so they couldn't have phoned every one to say there were trains going, and
they can't opperate in a way thats unsafe so the trains couldn't run.
Its proably to late now but your hire company might have cut you a break if you'd argued it wasn't your fault.
I wouldn't cross the channel by any method without some sort of insurance because this sort of thing happens all the time (And buggers up most
of Kent when it does).
I'm not saying what they did was right, or that your wrong to want compensation, I just don't think you'll get much unless
you've got insurance.
In a White Room, With Black Curtains, By the Station.
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iank
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| posted on 18/1/10 at 10:42 PM |
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quote:
Originally posted by JoelP
so if i sell someone something and fail to deliver, they must claim on their insurance and they cannot sue me? Nice, time to list the ferraris on ebay
then! I'll just put something suitable in the terms and conditions
Transport is a service not a product. If they fail to provide the service then they should certainly refund the ticket value.
Getting them to pay for consequential expenses is more difficult, at best it's going to be limited. (What if you put yourself up in a 5* hotel
for the night and emptied the minibar, should they pick that up? What if the van hire firm decided to charge £10k for the overdue van?)
Not saying they are right or wrong, but it's not black and white and may require proper lawyers. I suspect they'll pay towards some
reasonable expenses if pushed just to avoid the publicity and legal costs, but it will be on a case by case basis.
--
Never argue with an idiot. They drag you down to their level, then beat you with experience.
Anonymous
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Ninehigh
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| posted on 18/1/10 at 10:52 PM |
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Was your ticket for a particular train (you said you turned up early in the hope of an earlier train)?
If so I reckon you can get the ticket refunded as you paid for a train that didn't exist.
Either way you're probably knackered for the hotel and van unless you have a darn good solicitor
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Brommers
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| posted on 19/1/10 at 12:59 AM |
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quote:
Originally posted by Ninehigh
Either way you're probably knackered for the hotel and van unless you have a darn good solicitor
Darn good solicitors would say apply for a refund of the ticket price, forget the rest and move on. Because a darn good solicitor would know that the
T&Cs do matter, and you wouldn't have a leg to stand on in claiming hotel and alternative travel costs. Fair? Well, maybe not, but
that's the way it works.
Trust me, I'm a lawyer - albeit not a solicitor...
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Brommers
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| posted on 19/1/10 at 12:59 AM |
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Bugger, double post...
[Edited on 19/1/10 by Brommers]
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RK
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| posted on 19/1/10 at 02:06 AM |
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It's not like there's a lot of competition for tunnels under the Channel, so best of luck to you!
Tu peux toujours essayer d'ecrire en francais, si c'est plus facile pour toi.
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Breaker
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| posted on 25/2/10 at 01:14 PM |
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Finally got an answer from Eurotunnel.
I sent them a mail with all my extra expenses and they are only willing to refund my not travelled trip back to France.
Regarding refund of the not travelled trip; I quote :"We hope that this goes someway towards restoring your faith in our
Service"
You call this service ??? Only got a refund after more then 2 months and several reminders from my side. I would consider a refund (without me asking)
of a not travelled trip (because of srew up on their side) a normal thing.
I even did not get some vouchers or whatever; just some blablabla about their Conditions of carriage.
I hope they drown in their tunnel, next time I'll be taking a boat ! 
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cd.thomson
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| posted on 25/2/10 at 01:18 PM |
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Not read the whole thread but just spotted it.
I'm actually personal friends with Richard Brown's son and went travelling in South America with him. Spent many evenings over at their
house back when I was at school.
Its a shame this has all bitten him on the ass so hard, he really is a genuine bloke.
Craig
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