stevegough
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 posted on 7/1/11 at 11:03 AM |
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When is a foglight not a foglight?
Bought a 'matched set' of lights from CBS in july - 'SVA compliant'.
CBS light set link
My car failed the IVA on about 11 points -one of which was the foglight lens was not IVA compliant.
Apparently, the foglight has to be brighter than the brake lights, and the way this is done, the lens is constructed differently so that it makes a
parrallel beam. (this is also the reason it is the only light which has to be perpendicular to the horizontal to be IVA compliant.
Be warned that the above light is NOT IVA compliant. I wrote to CBS and their reply said:
___________________________________________________________________________________________________
"Hi Stephen
The lamps were indeed SVA OK - no B or F was required. However, I believe marking requirement was changed when IVA was introduced. Our latest
catalogue listing states the E mark only.
We have an LED rear fog #RLT12 that should fit the housings and has the correct marking. We will be happy to refund the purchase price if you return
it in 'as new' condition.
Cheers
for now
Neil
___________________________________________________________________________________________________
Their replacement they are quoting about is £40 + vat + delivery.
I have had no problems with CBS in the past, but I think this is a bit naughty. - As I said, I bought these lights in july last year - 14 months
after IVA had replaced SVA.
I have shopped around a bit, but have ended up ordering this from CBS.
Luego Locost C20XE.
Build start: October 6th 2008.
IVA passed Jan 28th 2011.
First drive Feb 10th 2011.
First show: Stoneleigh 1st/2nd May 2011.
'Used up' first engine may 3rd 2011!
Back on the road with 2nd engine may 24th
First PASA mad drive 26/7/11
Sold to Mike in Methyr Tydvil 19/03/14
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dan8400
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| posted on 7/1/11 at 11:32 AM |
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I agree it's a bit naughty. Surely they should put the LED replacement part in the set and put the price up (if need be). Not very fair to be
let down on the day. Imagine it being the only thing you failed on!! Would be an expensive re-test for the sake of a fog light
Dan
Hey - That's Journey!!!
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loggyboy
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| posted on 7/1/11 at 11:42 AM |
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I would expect a direct swap with no extra to pay (except maybe some postage).
I was hugely shocked how slow the industry was to replace and update their catalogues and supplies with IVA compliant products. I still look through
magazines and even online and see 'SVA' compliant - its a bit like selling Betamax tapes.
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dan8400
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| posted on 7/1/11 at 11:58 AM |
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+1 on the free swap
Dan
Hey - That's Journey!!!
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Bluemoon
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| posted on 7/1/11 at 11:58 AM |
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The best thing you can do is not believe the compliance claims, it's also a bit of marketing (i.e. most lights actually have the correct
markings anyway). If you read the IVA manual (and can understand it!) you can figure out if an item is IVA compliant. The thing is CBS don't
have to refund anything as you failed the IVA not SVA, so they are not making false claims about the product. If you had failed the SVA and need the
other Fog light then I would expect them to replace or refund for the fog light.
Dan
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SPYDER
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| posted on 7/1/11 at 12:27 PM |
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Surely the only salient point is IVA compliance.
Products currently on sale are either IVA compliant or they are not.
Claiming compliance with SVA is now as meaningless as being compliant with "Lighting Regulations 1923"
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adithorp
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| posted on 7/1/11 at 12:32 PM |
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If it doesn't say IVA compliant then I'd not assume they are. If I saw SVA compliant then I'd have asked about IVA. Fog lights have
always been different to stop lights but SVA didn't observe the difference.
"A witty saying proves nothing" Voltaire
http://jpsc.org.uk/forum/
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blakep82
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| posted on 7/1/11 at 12:33 PM |
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quote:
Originally posted by SPYDER
Surely the only salient point is IVA compliance.
Products currently on sale are either IVA compliant or they are not.
Claiming compliance with SVA is now as meaningless as being compliant with "Lighting Regulations 1923"
exactly the point, they never claimed it was IVA compliant. only SVA.
________________________
IVA manual link http://www.businesslink.gov.uk/bdotg/action/detail?type=RESOURCES&itemId=1081997083
don't write OT on a new thread title, you're creating the topic, everything you write is very much ON topic!
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dan8400
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| posted on 7/1/11 at 12:57 PM |
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Surely alot of these companies need to wake up. Things should say and be IVA compliant. It's no use advertising SVA compliance anymore. I know
these points have been made, but I think some responsibility should lie with the manufacturers to keep up
Dan
Hey - That's Journey!!!
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loggyboy
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| posted on 7/1/11 at 01:06 PM |
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Its just down to ignorance, laziness, and/or lack of accountablity. Most either dont know, cant be bothered or dont care.
One of the contributing factors to my build status
<------------------------
[Edited on 7/1/11 by loggyboy]
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blue2cv
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| posted on 7/1/11 at 01:31 PM |
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Surely if i understand correctly that it didnt state IVA compliant in ad and assuming that you the buyer didnt tell them it was for a new build and
needed to be IVA'd, then CBS have not done anything wrong, the lamps are E marked and perfectly legal for use and would imagine are retro fitted
by lots of people, why not just fit a legal cheapo fog lamp for IVA and do what no end of others do, alter it after. They have even offered a refund
and you still whinge, youre building the car not CBS, its up to you to make sure whatever you fit is suitable,, pass the popcorn
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SPYDER
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| posted on 7/1/11 at 01:53 PM |
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They won't be as tardy when it comes to updating price lists to take account of the VAT rise.
The ones who still insist on pricing everything "plus VAT" won't have to lift a finger though.
It's increasingly becoming an online world.
I don't buy any kit car mags any more. The amount of new content in any given issue doesn't justify the cover price IMHO.
I do go to pretty much ALL of the shows. In between these ( and that must be 75% of the year) I shop online.
I look for advice and inspiration online, often on LCB.
Maybe the suppliers haven't properly cottoned on to the internet yet.
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stevegough
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| posted on 7/1/11 at 03:51 PM |
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quote:
Originally posted by blue2cv
Surely if i understand correctly that it didnt state IVA compliant in ad and assuming that you the buyer didnt tell them it was for a new build and
needed to be IVA'd, then CBS have not done anything wrong, the lamps are E marked and perfectly legal for use and would imagine are retro fitted
by lots of people, why not just fit a legal cheapo fog lamp for IVA and do what no end of others do, alter it after. They have even offered a refund
and you still whinge, youre building the car not CBS, its up to you to make sure whatever you fit is suitable,, pass the popcorn
You are quite right, they haven't done anything wrong, and the point of my posting it on here is not to 'whinge' as you put it, just
simply to make the other 9000 plus members of the forum aware of the trap I've fallen foul of, so they don't suffer the same fate!
Further point - go ahead and find me a 'legal cheapo fog lamp' which is IVA compliant - preferably 95mm diam to fit my existing set up.
Believe me, I've tried.
To all the other commenters on this thread, thanks for your replies - the only other point I'd like to make is that it is almost certain
I'll never use the car in fog - they are difficult enough to see even with 100% visibility!
Luego Locost C20XE.
Build start: October 6th 2008.
IVA passed Jan 28th 2011.
First drive Feb 10th 2011.
First show: Stoneleigh 1st/2nd May 2011.
'Used up' first engine may 3rd 2011!
Back on the road with 2nd engine may 24th
First PASA mad drive 26/7/11
Sold to Mike in Methyr Tydvil 19/03/14
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blue2cv
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| posted on 7/1/11 at 03:59 PM |
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Surely if its a temporary mod it doesnt have to fit exactly the mounting housing, just has to 'passable' . To be fair it did to me read
like a whinge
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stevegough
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 posted on 16/1/11 at 09:04 AM |
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Update!
Since I posted this thread 9 days ago - and wrote to them - they have changed their website.
CBS rear lights
AND the 'SVA compliant' wording has been removed. However, they are still selling the same set of lights with the non-compliant foglight,
but as they don't claim compliance anymore - its back to 'buyer beware' situation.
Luego Locost C20XE.
Build start: October 6th 2008.
IVA passed Jan 28th 2011.
First drive Feb 10th 2011.
First show: Stoneleigh 1st/2nd May 2011.
'Used up' first engine may 3rd 2011!
Back on the road with 2nd engine may 24th
First PASA mad drive 26/7/11
Sold to Mike in Methyr Tydvil 19/03/14
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handyandy
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| posted on 16/1/11 at 09:57 AM |
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I,m about to buy fog & reverse lights, have seen alot for sale that claim to be SVA ok but was dubious about being ok for the IVA,
one thing that did spring to mind was the LED set on CBS site at £42 seems very expensive for 1 light ( i freely admit I,m tight  ) but when you
consider that its possible to buy a PAIR of headlights for £35 ( kit parts direct ) then the price for the ONE fog lamp does seem expensive, my
thought being......is the price high cos they know that builders in a way are "cornered" into buying it due to the new IVA regs?
I,ve found a fog light on the SVC website that claims to have the "E" & "F" markings & only costs IIRC about £9,
admittedly its a square light & not the round type that would look right with my NAS style indicators/stop/tail lights......hhmmm might be a case
of using the cheaper SVC light just to ensure it passes IVA & at a reasonable cost, tho I,d prefer a round style fog & reverse light.
Steve.......good luck with the retest
cheers
andy
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martyn_16v
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| posted on 16/1/11 at 10:02 AM |
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quote:
Originally posted by stevegough
[Further point - go ahead and find me a 'legal cheapo fog lamp' which is IVA compliant - preferably 95mm diam to fit my existing set up.
Believe me, I've tried.
eBay Item , most motor factors sell the same one as well. Fit it for IVA, take it straight off after. It's got all the right
markings, I had one on mine for the test. You just need to blunt the edge of the black surround a little, 2 min with a file.
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rb968
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| posted on 19/1/11 at 10:07 AM |
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So I am in this boat having bought a full set of 70mm land rover style WIPAC lights (and fitted them). Now it appears the stop tail red lens is not
correctly marked but can anyone tell me exactly what I am looking for on the lens to be compliant?
The manual states:
12. All rear fog lamps must display an “e” or “E” mark with a “B” or “F” (see note 2)
Here is an example cheap Ring style rear fog light available and hopefully you can see its markings. Where would the B or F be?
 
Rear Fog Light Example
If I am changing it I'd like to make sure its right even if its just for the test then switch it back.
Cheers
Rich
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stevegough
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| posted on 19/1/11 at 10:57 AM |
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looks to have two 'F' s in the bottom right corner. Mine has a tiny 'F' near the bottom. I have tried to photograph it, but it
is not clear.
 
Description
But, I am well impressed with the LED output - see the pic - the tail, brake and fog are all on in this pic.
 
Description
Luego Locost C20XE.
Build start: October 6th 2008.
IVA passed Jan 28th 2011.
First drive Feb 10th 2011.
First show: Stoneleigh 1st/2nd May 2011.
'Used up' first engine may 3rd 2011!
Back on the road with 2nd engine may 24th
First PASA mad drive 26/7/11
Sold to Mike in Methyr Tydvil 19/03/14
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blakep82
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| posted on 19/1/11 at 12:21 PM |
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quote:
Originally posted by rb968
So I am in this boat having bought a full set of 70mm land rover style WIPAC lights (and fitted them). Now it appears the stop tail red lens is not
correctly marked but can anyone tell me exactly what I am looking for on the lens to be compliant?
The manual states:
12. All rear fog lamps must display an “e” or “E” mark with a “B” or “F” (see note 2)
Here is an example cheap Ring style rear fog light available and hopefully you can see its markings. Where would the B or F be?
Rear Fog Light Example
If I am changing it I'd like to make sure its right even if its just for the test then switch it back.
Cheers
Rich
bottom, just off centre, E3, and above that F
________________________
IVA manual link http://www.businesslink.gov.uk/bdotg/action/detail?type=RESOURCES&itemId=1081997083
don't write OT on a new thread title, you're creating the topic, everything you write is very much ON topic!
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rb968
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| posted on 19/1/11 at 04:42 PM |
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Ah above the 00?
Got it. Dead clear isn't it 
Cheers as ever.
Rich
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