jonabonospen
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| posted on 3/9/12 at 09:14 AM |
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Twin engine Tiger Z100
Hello peeps.
I am currently a very avid biker, riding at the moment a KTM Superduke 990, and a 1978 Honda CB750 cafe racer that I have just finished building. I
saw a car for sale the other day though and it really grabbed my attention and got me looking in to 7-type kit cars as an alternative to biking.
The car in question was a Tiger Z100, the twin Kawasaki ZX9R engined car. Wow!! What can I say. It is something very different to the usual bike
engined or car engined kits. But it was a lot of money for a car that still needed some work and fettling to get set up right as it had stood for 5
years unused. Plus it wasn't road registered either.
Obviously from riding bikes which have previously included GSXR1000's and ZZR1400's and the likes, to looking at going to a kit car, I
want something with that excitement and blistering performance from a bike, so I really think bike engined cars are the way to go for me. I might even
then perhaps look at doing some sprints and things like that. But this just jumped out at me as being something a bit special. Something to talk about
and keep my interest, plus something that would require me to do some work on it to tart it up, which would help me learn about the car too. But I
just don't want to buy something that is likely to end up being totally unreliable to run, and end up being a money pit due to complexities of
the twin engines.
So my questions to you experienced kit car owners, builders, and drivers are;
- Are these twin engined cars a real pain compared to single bike engine cars?
- The car has lights fitted but is not road registered. Would it be feasable to get something like this registered on the road without MEGA
expense?
- Any pros and cons that you think about twin engined cars?
- Anybody own one or driven one?
- What's your opinion of them?
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FatChapChipChop
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| posted on 3/9/12 at 10:57 AM |
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The single-engined route is the simplest by far, and has been done by almost all of the manufacturers one way or the other, so lots of advice out
there as to how to go about it, what the costs are etc ... I'd say go for a road registered single engined car and fettle to your hearts content
..
The twin engined Tiger Z100 (which I've passengered in) was built by Chris Allanson at http://www.zcars.org.uk/ .. He also did a twin engined
Westfield .. If you want to know what it takes to build and register a twin engined machine, have a chat to them.
Cheers !!
Drive fast, don't look back!
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maccmike
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| posted on 3/9/12 at 11:17 AM |
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Hi, I personally would go single engine, I can forsee very difficult set up issues, syncing the engines for one; gear ratio, gear selector, power
etc.
If you have enough to buy a twin engined, buy single - ROAD REGISTERED already - and go nuts with an engine, turbo for example.
If your mechanically minded and have the time and money, buy a cheap registered kit, remove what ever engine it is, and go with a charged zx10/12 or
similar.
You'll be very impressed with the performance of a n/a single engined kit anyway, they'll get to 60 quicker than a bike purely because of
traction. And you'll be able to brake much later. Granted, the bits inbetween you'l miss your bike but if you went charged that wouldnt be
an issue.
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maccmike
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| posted on 3/9/12 at 11:18 AM |
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or do a trike like mine wah hahaha
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ReMan
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| posted on 3/9/12 at 11:40 AM |
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Been discusseed here before, a search should find it.
Do it becuase you can, you want to achieve something different and you have deep pockets.
Else tread a more conservative path that will still give you ballistic performance.
There was a really nice Twin R1 Mini at Donnington yetsreday foy £15k. ?
www.plusnine.co.uk
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jonabonospen
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| posted on 3/9/12 at 01:47 PM |
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quote:
Originally posted by maccmike
If you have enough to buy a twin engined, buy single - ROAD REGISTERED already - and go nuts with an engine, turbo for example.
If your mechanically minded and have the time and money, buy a cheap registered kit, remove what ever engine it is, and go with a charged zx10/12 or
similar.
How much could you be likely to spend though on sticking a turbo in to a bike engined car?
Put a new thread up about engine swaps, asking some questions.
Thanks.
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NOTE:This user is registered as a LocostBuilders trader and may offer commercial services to other users
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matt_gsxr
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| posted on 3/9/12 at 02:43 PM |
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Cost of turboing a BEC depend on how much you do yourself.
Expensive route would be TTS or Big CC.
Cheap route would be DIY (which is what I did, here http://www.locostbuilders.co.uk/viewthread.php?tid=150801 )
Matt
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Fieldy
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| posted on 3/9/12 at 03:18 PM |
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Out of curiosity what experience do you have driving cars?
I’ve got an R1 and my Locost has an R1 engine in it, the Locost is really quick and for me was a real handful to start with! So much so that I span it
and broke a wishbone and a few other bits on day 3…
The point I’m making is you might actually find that a N/A bike engined car will do you for the time being, save up and turbo it once you’ve got used
to it…
Equally if you a racing driver ignore my points
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maccmike
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| posted on 3/9/12 at 03:39 PM |
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Good point that, Iv had mine a year and still not gone full throttle.
In my defense it has only got one back wheel and wheel spin is incredibly easy.
Had it spinning at 70 in a straight line.
I need a track day me thinks...
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jonabonospen
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| posted on 3/9/12 at 03:47 PM |
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I don't have any major driving experience of super fast cars. Had plenty of super fast bikes and also driven a few Porsche's on occasion,
then other than that it is just 90's hot hatches and a couple of track driving experiences with TVR's and Ferrari's and the like. I
am no racing driver by any means. I do lots of driving through work though, in the UK and on the continent, and have probably averaged 35k miles a
year for the last 10 years.
I wasn't initially thinking of a turbo car anyway, it was just a point raised by someone on here so thought I would ask the question about
turbo's so I could think about getting the right car to start with so that I wouldn't have to change in a year if I wanted to make some
alterations or something and the car I had wouldn't accept them or it would be financially prohibitive.
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NOTE:This user is registered as a LocostBuilders trader and may offer commercial services to other users
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Fieldy
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| posted on 3/9/12 at 04:06 PM |
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Have you been in a 7 type car? If not I wonder if anyone local to you would take you for a spin??
I’m not knocking turbo cars by any means, if I had the cash now I wouldn’t hesitate to turbo mine.. but I think I would have killed myself if id
brought/built a turbo’d 7 as my first car. I have had other cars either front wheel four wheel drive but there is no comparison to the 7, it’s a total
different beast.
In summary 2 engines sounds like an absolute mission to me so I would definitely go single bike engine, but do consider buying something that can be
boosted if you get bored of the power!
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Irony
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| posted on 3/9/12 at 04:21 PM |
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Wasn't it a twin engined tiger that Tiff Needell mangled the gearbox in??? Seems to me that twin engined anything is all about the gearbox or
gearboxes.
Never driven a bike engined car but I have been a passenger in a few and they are scary fast.
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maccmike
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| posted on 3/9/12 at 04:45 PM |
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Yeah he was trying to break the 0-60 time. Think, think it was twin birds
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zilspeed
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| posted on 3/9/12 at 05:26 PM |
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quote:
Originally posted by maccmike
Yeah he was trying to break the 0-60 time. Think, think it was twin birds
Kawsaki engines as I recall.
To the original poster.
You mention doing some sprints.
Some championships specifically exclude twin engines.
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snapper
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| posted on 3/9/12 at 07:01 PM |
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Big money but there is a V8 made from 2 bike engines
2L, 2.2L or 2.4L 300+ bhp @ 10,200 rpm
Seen these in an Exege and a Caterham
I eat to survive
I drink to forget
I breath to pi55 my ex wife off (and now my ex partner)
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Minicooper
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| posted on 3/9/12 at 07:07 PM |
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I really like the idea of a supercharged TTS hayabusa, one day. In the mean time if anyone wants to donate a turbo Hayabusa that will do for now.
I've seen twin engined stuff at Hillclimbs, sprints and stuff so there must be a class for them, even if they run by themselves in that class
Cheers
David
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jonabonospen
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| posted on 3/9/12 at 07:57 PM |
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quote:
Originally posted by Fieldy
Have you been in a 7 type car? If not I wonder if anyone local to you would take you for a spin??
I once had a modified Dutton Pheaton that had a 2.1 Pinto in it but it was a real pile of junk and after driving it about 20 miles it broke down and I
never repaired it, just sold it on as didn't have the time, space, or knowledge to get it fixed, plus I was so pished off with the thing as the
seller gave no assistance or anything to help me or to admit he had sold me a pile of junk, that I just wanted it out of my sight.
If someone near me (West Yorkshire) has a BEC and would be willing to take me for a little spin I would love that, just so I can see what its like.
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NOTE:This user is registered as a LocostBuilders trader and may offer commercial services to other users
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NigeEss
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| posted on 3/9/12 at 09:50 PM |
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quote:
Originally posted by Irony
Wasn't it a twin engined tiger that Tiff Needell mangled the gearbox in???
It was the 4wd Z100WR, two Kwak ZX1200s facing opposite directions one driving each axle. It was the
engine that failed throwing a conrod through the block.
[Edited on 3/9/12 by NigeEss]
Time is an illusion. Lunchtime doubly so.................Douglas Adams.
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Minicooper
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| posted on 3/9/12 at 09:58 PM |
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Twin ZX12rs, the engine failed because it was mechanically forced through the rev limit by the engines being in different gears. That what Chris from
Zcars told me anyway and he wasn't very polite about tif at all
Cheers
David
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Dangle_kt
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| posted on 3/9/12 at 10:00 PM |
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I'm an avid biker, I got the kit car as a way to be a bit safer (two kids arrived) and to be able to take the wife out in it, as she
doesn't like the bike.
She hated it, and with kids we hardly have many lazy afternoons we could have gone for a ride alone together anyway!
But I loved the kit car - very fast, and I felt much happier sticking it into a corner a bit hot, and pinning the throttle on the way out than I ever
would on a bike on the road!
Had to sell up due to a house move, and I miss the BEC.
I would just add that a BEC is a very specific car, for very specific roads - a bit like a supermoto. great fun on the twisties, but a ball ache most
anywhere else. Go into it knowing that and you will be happier.
oh, and I just bought a track bike to get my adreneline pumping again 
[Edited on 3/9/12 by Dangle_kt]
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maccmike
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| posted on 3/9/12 at 10:22 PM |
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Tiff going banzai
Z cars Tiger twin kwacky's 1200
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keithn1963
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| posted on 4/10/12 at 12:33 PM |
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Hi all,
I can confirm that the tiger Z100WR that tiff N blew up was twin ZX12-R engines, I know cos its sitting in my garage!!
To the originator of this thread, if your not a tinkerer, dont go down the twin engine route, although mine is technically road legal, it is really a
race toy that happens to be road legal. It is rather brutal, every time out in it results in a full spanner check to tighten all the bits that have
vibrated loose, and a visit to the dentist to have all your teeth that have rattled loose re-set.
It really is an enthusiasts car.
I shudder to think the fun you'd have to get one approved for the road these days!!
Nor is it the best handling car, dont get me wrong, it handles well, but I have done sprints with it, lap times around a course or circuit are
marginally less than a single engine seven as the extra weight compromises the balance/handling, but the extra grunt on the straight goes some way to
making up for it.
All that said though, for ultimate grin and "oh my god!!!!!!" factor, it cant be beat. You change gear using your in built human shift
light, basically when your eye-balls are rattling to the point when you cant focus!!
And the sound track!!!!!...........two ZX12-R motors on full chat through straight through exhausts, the thing wet dreams are made of...
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fesycresy
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| posted on 4/10/12 at 12:42 PM |
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In the beginning of the video, isn't that the guy from Z Cars?
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
The sooner you fall behind, the more time you'll have to catch up.
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zilspeed
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| posted on 4/10/12 at 12:46 PM |
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That is indeed Chris Allanson.
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keithn1963
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| posted on 4/10/12 at 11:26 PM |
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Chris is a bit of a Guru, there are no things he cant do, only things he hasn't quite worked out how to do yet!!!!
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