ChrisJ15
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| posted on 29/4/13 at 09:39 AM |
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Speedo Visibility for IVA
I'm looking at instruments for my J15 and I'm struggling to put the speedo where I can see all of it even if I use an 80mm one.
I'm using an old MX5 steering wheel which has a center pad and one of the horizontal spokes partly obscures the speedo.
I can see up to about 80 mph with the wheel in the straight ahead position.
Does the speedo only have to be visible up to 70mph as thats the national speed limit and I never exceed that (honest officer  )?
I plan to replace it with a wheel like this
http://www.demon-tweeks.co.uk/performance/steering-wheels/spa
rco-325-steering-wheel which will give much better visibility but I cant use that for the IVA because there's no pad available.
[Edited on 29/4/13 by ChrisJ15]
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pewe
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| posted on 29/4/13 at 10:04 AM |
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When mine was SVA'd the inspector insisted that the whole speedo be visible.
Even though I could see it all he reckoned with his height he couldn't see past 80mph.
Meant a lot of bodging to make it all visible from all seat adjustments but it was his word that counted.
Probably down to the individual but maybe best not to chance it?
If it helps I made up a pad for my steering wheel by using three or four thicknesses of camping matt stuck onto an ali plate slightly bigger than the
boss with ears that folded around the spokes. I covered it in vinyl fromWoolies
Horn push was replaced by using the push on the end of the Escort column stalks I was using but for IVA I reckon a push on the dash would be OK but
best check..
HTH.
Cheers, Pewe10
PS just as a secondary thought - my whole instrument panel is fitted around the centre of the dashboard i.e lined up with the centre line of the car,
similar to a modern Mini so must be IVA OK?
[Edited on 29/4/13 by pewe]
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adithorp
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| posted on 29/4/13 at 10:33 AM |
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It has to display up to the max design speed (declared on the IVA form) and be visable at all times. So you can't get away with the 70mph
argument. The example given for "visable at all times" is it being illuminated it doesn't exclude partially obscured. It also says
"temporary obstruction by the wheel is acceptable" so that kind of confirms any perminent obstruction isn't allowed.
"A witty saying proves nothing" Voltaire
http://jpsc.org.uk/forum/
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ChrisJ15
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| posted on 29/4/13 at 10:51 AM |
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So I could go with my better shaped wheel and make a pad I guess.
Maybe mount my steering wheel at an angle so its readable in a straight line, or buy a two spoke wheel and mount it north to south. 
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theprisioner
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| posted on 29/4/13 at 10:54 AM |
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Hi,
I went through all this at the same point in the build as you. I lowered my steering column (for other reasons) and used a Westfield steering
wheel for the protective rubber bit and a extended boss. The Westfield steering wheels appear to do the rounds off and on ebay as a means of getting
thru IVA and then recycled the same way.
http://www.locostbuilders.co.uk/forum/26/viewthread.php?tid=167671
My current dashboard waiting for IVA
http://sylvabuild.blogspot.co.uk/2013/03/catches-and-trim-panels.html
As you can see despite my efforts my speedo can be seen at all times but you have to move around a bit. The only sure fire answer is to use a digital
readout "but on a retro classic" design ug!
I don't think my speedo is any worse than others of similar approach. I will let you know, fingers crossed.
http://sylvabuild.blogspot.com/
http://austin7special.blogspot.co.uk/
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ChrisJ15
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| posted on 29/4/13 at 11:10 AM |
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I did some further re-jigging of my Mk6 column to improve the situation and though I was there but I know others had problems with the position due to
the depth of the gauges. I want to use Smiths International which I understand are 75mm deep including the retaining bracket so this affects where
they can go.
I have tried so hard not to have to modify the chassis.
I reckon I could have built another kit car in the time ive spend kerfercking around with my steering column.
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theprisioner
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| posted on 29/4/13 at 11:48 AM |
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+1
http://sylvabuild.blogspot.com/
http://austin7special.blogspot.co.uk/
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monkeyarms
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| posted on 29/4/13 at 12:04 PM |
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I am struggling to understand why people are having difficulties with the column and dash on J15s.
I used the MK4 fiesta column and a mk3 boss (smaller no airbag) and with 80mm etb gauges it was fine.
Has the chassis changed since i bought mine 2 years ago?
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ChrisJ15
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| posted on 29/4/13 at 12:16 PM |
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I used a Mk6 column as I didnt like the idea of my ignition key being behind the dash.
Also I didnt like the exposed steering lock mechanism, thought there was a risk of getting clothing or something stuck in there.
If I knew what a b@ll ache it was going to be I would have manufactured my own and used an immobiliser for the IVA.
In fact if I knew how difficult the J15 was going to be I would have built another kit!!
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monkeyarms
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| posted on 29/4/13 at 12:38 PM |
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My key is in the switch panel to the right, so avoided the issue of being behind the dash, using the ford ecu means i kept the ford PATS too which all
worked really well. I have no steering lock.
I dont think the J15 is a difficult build, this is my first kit car and i passed IVA first time last week!
What other issues are you having Chris?
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loggyboy
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| posted on 29/4/13 at 12:42 PM |
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quote:
Originally posted by monkeyarms
I am struggling to understand why people are having difficulties with the column and dash on J15s.
I used the MK4 fiesta column and a mk3 boss (smaller no airbag) and with 80mm etb gauges it was fine.
Has the chassis changed since i bought mine 2 years ago?
Unless your 9ft tall or you stand up whilst driving it must be impossble to see the lower half of your dials when driving.
Mistral Motorsport
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ChrisJ15
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| posted on 29/4/13 at 01:09 PM |
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Other problems - how long have you got?
Induction - I used the Duratec (my own fault I know - but in my defense someone else had gone this route before) and there's very little room in
front of the engine for Throttle bodies/filter. I've managed to squeeze some Titan roller barrel TBs in there with short trumpets.
I wanted 14" Minilites like JPs demo car and I used the Rally Design OEM handbrake calipers (VW Audi group). I had to machine a lot of material
off these to make them fit. The banjo for these calipers is very close indeed to the metal band securing the boot around the CV. If there's
uneven wear there could be contact. I've seen the banjo from a VW Passat and its a low level 'block' one but I cant find any of
these to get my hose changed. I couldn't find a way of routing the handbrake cable past the driveshaft and the spring so ended up stripping the
caliper internals out and swapping them so the actuating lever operated below the driveshaft which was an education! Nice neat handbrake route now
though.
Standard Duratec wont fit under the rear clam so needed to buy the Raceline one. It looks great but was a bit painful paying more for a cam cover than
my motor cost me! Again my fault for going with the Duratec.
I put my hand up to being naive when I started this project. I guess I was thinking more of a Westfield type build where you do your own thing or just
buy parts from the manufacturer that will fit. I now know that you are really buying a chassis with some ideas on what might fit. Also its a new
design which hasnt had the opportunity to learn from peoples problems. I also think I'm too much of a perfectionist at times and sometimes I
just need to do something that will work and doesnt necessarily look really neat. To be fair it is immensely satisfying when something does go well
and the really tricky jobs are the most satisfying when an elegant solution is found.
loggyboy you said 'Unless your 9ft tall or you stand up whilst driving it must be impossble to see the lower half of your dials when
driving' but have you passed your IVA or is it track only? If you read what others have said here surely that would be a fail because of the
speedo.
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monkeyarms
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| posted on 29/4/13 at 01:56 PM |
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Stick at it, sounds like you are solving problems you encounter though.
quote:
Originally posted by ChrisJ15
loggyboy you said 'Unless your 9ft tall or you stand up whilst driving it must be impossble to see the lower half of your dials when
driving' but have you passed your IVA or is it track only? If you read what others have said here surely that would be a fail because of the
speedo.
What loggyboy said isnt right, at "only" 6 foot you can see all the dials OK. Passed IVA fine. The tester even set my programable speedo
for me, so must have been fine. The photo isnt what the eyes see sat in the car.
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theprisioner
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| posted on 29/4/13 at 02:08 PM |
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The J15 is a difficult build, my advice don't give up. Some of your choices have not been ideal but then don't keep going down a dead end
and banging your head off a wall. Here are some thoughts based on your comments.
1) Is it totally impossible to put in a Sigma at this stage and sell the Duratec? It may be cost nueutral. My donor car cost me £500 inc engine. Great
little engine.
2) 14" Wheels are not a bad choice, my banjo bolts are close so I put them in a lathe and too 2m off. Interesting what you say about the VW
banjo must have a look at that in case I fail.
3) Move your top rail (lower the steering column) or fit a digital dash and make things easier for yourself.
4) Going for IVA is an exercise in paying £450 for an exceptions list. They can only inspect the second time for what they failed you the first
time.
5) The handbrake routing is a bitch see my solution, not that difficult, your bleed nipples will be upside down turn them the right way up. see:
http://sylvabuild.blogspot.co.uk/2013/01/handbrake-cable-routing.html
All you need now is a plumbers bending machine not very expensive from ebay. My handbrake is now great.
6) My approach to the steering wheel is simple bearing in mind 4) I will have another steering wheel (in production) that may give me a better view,
will not look as good as the Westfield part but may get me through the IVA. One thing you have contributed today is to make me rethink my choice of
steering wheel may not be ideal. While I am waiting on a date I can at least think about it.
7) If all else fails get on train and look at mine if it helps.
Whatever happens don't give up!!!!
http://sylvabuild.blogspot.com/
http://austin7special.blogspot.co.uk/
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ChrisJ15
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| posted on 29/4/13 at 02:27 PM |
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TBH engine wise I'm sorted now. Induction is sorted and the cam cover means no cutting of the rear clam required. The gear change is cable but
works a treat.
I know if I didnt have to comply with everything for IVA (steering wheel pad etc) I could get a good solution. I'm hopeful I can get a
reasonable solution without resorting to welding.
If I'd seen your solution to the calipers I would certainly have gone that route. My solution resulted in an inbalance between each wheel on the
handbrake but I think I've adjusted it out with the cable adjusters. Hopefully the hydraulic side is even.
Thanks for the offer of seeing your J15. One thing I've learnt during this build is that there are a huge number of people who are prepared to
help you and I certainly wouldnt have got this far without that help!
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theduck
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| posted on 29/4/13 at 03:04 PM |
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Useful thread. I might have to rotate my speedo a bit to be able to see up to max design speed.
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deeceee09
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| posted on 29/4/13 at 04:08 PM |
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Chris
Have you tried raising the drivers seat? I lifted mine by two inches and it made a big difference. As a result it proved a bit marginal on the upper
seat belt mounting positions during the test but I am not sure why. I had not looked at that in the manual before the test.
On which subject now that I (her indoors actually!) have moulded a foam seat with my bum on the floor the shoulder strap mounts are above my
shoulders. Not ideal. I am 5' 9" so should not really be an issue.
Don't know how anyone fits ETB 80 mm instruments without spacing them out from the dash.
Treachery and old age will always triumph over youthful enthusiasm.
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ChrisJ15
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| posted on 29/4/13 at 05:09 PM |
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Thanks, I'd forgotten you did this. Having a cr@p memory doesnt help with this build either! 
Its a simple fix for the IVA and then I can adjust again when I put my other wheel on.
I'll keep my fingers crossed for a 6'6" examiner too!
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pewe
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| posted on 29/4/13 at 06:28 PM |
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Don't worry about the crap memory.
I reckon as third of us on here are suffering some sort of dementia, the other third are dyslexic and the other third are engineers - explains
everything........
Now what was I meant to be doing - oh yes cook the dinner.......
Cheers, Pewe10 
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deeceee09
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| posted on 29/4/13 at 06:37 PM |
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So am I, wife went out to girly lunch and doesn't want any!
Treachery and old age will always triumph over youthful enthusiasm.
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nickm
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| posted on 30/4/13 at 07:30 PM |
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Hi
Remember the end result it is a fantastic looking car and should handle like a Riot !
I have the same prob with gaiter clip and banjo but the shaft cant move back or forward at that point (he says)
I have a real problem i havent chosen red its Oxford blue with primrose yellow chassis( my feminine side coming out) but then she is called Nell.
Nick M
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ChrisJ15
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| posted on 1/5/13 at 06:30 AM |
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Hi Nick,
I see you are still moonlighting in motivational speaking!
I often do track days with friends (none have kit cars) and that leaves a big grin on your face, I'm sure it's even bigger when you have
built the car.
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nickm
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| posted on 1/5/13 at 07:05 PM |
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Hi Chris
Good to see you are getting there and will probably be finished before me, i also tend to over engineer everything( mind you if i was an engineer it
would have been finished 18 months ago)
When you go for that first track day bet the others cant keep up with you especially with that duratec !
Enjoy
Nick M
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ChrisJ15
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| posted on 2/5/13 at 09:32 AM |
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Looks like I'm there now. With a combination of raising the center mounting for the column, which drops the steering wheel, and raising the seat
slightly I can see enough of the speedo gauge for its range from 0 to it's max design speed of 90mph.
Not sure what I would put for it's max design speed to be honest. I'm sure you can adjust that to your favour as long as you don't
take the p!ss!
Thanks for all the suggestions and much needed motivation!
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deeceee09
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| posted on 2/5/13 at 09:59 AM |
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There you are Chris one more thing ticked off the list
Treachery and old age will always triumph over youthful enthusiasm.
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