gasket999
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| posted on 2/10/15 at 10:34 AM |
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Iva and pre-1972 donors - black and silver plates?
Hoping for some help here. I have read everything I can find on the IVA process – as well as historic info on SVAs, but still have a couple of
questions.
I’ve started to gather the parts to build another Land Rover from scratch (rather than stripping and modifying an original), I would like to have an
age-related plate rather than a Q-plate. The vehicle will be made from classic parts and will not use any parts from later Defender models. As it will
be starting with a modified brand new chassis I am given to believe that the vehicle can not legitimately retain the donor's identity but an age
related plate could apply.
The chassis will be brand new from a major supplier who usually specialises in standard replacements. The chassis will include the engine, gearbox
mounts and associated crossmembers from another model. As such it will no longer be a like-for-like replacement.
· The bodywork (even though the DVLA aren’t interested in it) will be selected from a number of 1958-1971 donors.
· The suspension (leaf springs, hangers and dampers) will be from the a 1969 donor.
· The axle casings (which carry an stamped number) will be from the same 1969 donor (though I will be altering the internals and driveshafts
slightly).
· The gearbox is from a 1981 donor and carries an ID number.
· The engine is a 3.5V8 which I have yet to buy. It will likely be sourced from a mid ‘70s to mid ’90s donor – I can choose this carefully if
age affects things like emmissions, etc.
· The steering is a choice – I could fit the steering from the same 1969 donor or I could fit PAS from a 80s vehicle (the latter is my
preference and would require additional alterations to the chassis which are not a problem if included in the order).
All major components have an invoice, dated and signed by the seller – detailing the vehicle that supplied them.
I would like to class the vehicle as an amateur build (a kit car). This is unusual in Land Rover circles as IVA’s are avoided and all attempts are
made to keep the original vehicle identity, resulting in a lot of vehicles which would fall foul of an IVA if imposed. I would like to do this
legitimately.
My questions are:
1) If I build from parts – rather than trying to retain the 1969 logbook, what ‘model’ would the vehicle be on its new V5? Would a name for the
‘kit’ have to be created by the Chassis Manufacturer? Would I invent a name? or would it somehow be described as a Land Rover 'Special'
(which I quite like)
2) The vehicle will have 2 major components from the same 1969 vehicle (suspension and axles) – or 3 if I retain the original steering, 2 major
components from different cars of the 1980-90s (transmission from one and engine from another) and if I do go power steering then this could be
sourced from the engine donor. As such I have enough components to retain an age related plate certainly for 1969 possibly for the 1980s – would the
DVLA give me a choice as to which donor vehicle provides the date for the car, or would they insist on using the newest/oldest components? I'd
prefer the older.
3) If It is given an age-related number plate from 1969 – would it a) be eligible to carry a black and silver number-plate (allowed for vehicles
manufactured prior to 1st Jan 1973), also would it be tax exempt (really not concerned about this, Just curious).
4) Given that I know I am going to submit the vehicle for approval, is there any benefit in buying the (rotten) chassis and logbook from the 1969
donor? I would really prefer not to if possible, seems a bit ‘iffy’.
Many thanks indeed for any advice you can offer
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cliftyhanger
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| posted on 2/10/15 at 10:49 AM |
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I think you are going to make life very hard for yourself.
There is also the thing about bugatti's going on, that may not help you either.
How different is the chassis? Minor or major changes?? Can you not get a donor car that uses that chassis? and use that as teh basis for a legitimate
rebuild on a new chassis with some mechanical modifications?
Whatever, with just a handful of parts from the donor, and no V5, I doubt you will get to keep it as a 1969 registration. Or any dated registration,
I believe it would issue a q plate.
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slingshot2000
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| posted on 2/10/15 at 10:59 AM |
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I would imagine that a 1960s Land Rover would be almost impossible to get through an IVA, without and awful lots of thought and work. A Series 11
bulkhead would be an absolute nightmare with it all steel construction.
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gremlin1234
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| posted on 2/10/15 at 11:03 AM |
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certainly sound like Q plate.
however, there is a way of registering "reconstructed classic vehicles"
https://www.gov.uk/vehicle-registration/reconstructed-classic-vehicles
which seems to be similar to what you intend
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gasket999
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| posted on 2/10/15 at 11:26 AM |
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Oh, that's a surprise - I thought the age-related aspect was locked-in what with having a new chassis and three (rather than the minimum two)
major components from the 1969 donor (axles, steering and suspension)
The chassis of a landrover (in case anyone is unfamiliar) is two long rails connected with 6 cross members. The cross members are a slightly different
shape and spaced slightly differently on the 4 and 8-cylinder models this is to support the gearbox and to allow clearance for the props. My chassis
will be a 4-cylinder model fitted with the central three from the V8. The engine mounts will be located slightly differently to either chassis as it
is a V8 fitted to a short bell housing allowing the 4-cyl front bodywork to be retained.
Engine and gearbox will be changed but in all other respects the vehicle will appear to be standard - that's how I like them.
I thought that the DVLA has a black-and-white approach to chassis deviations from standard so I'm not sure if this is classed as a
'major' alteration to the chassis but I would like to do it legitimately.
The point about getting even a standard LR through an IVA is duly noted.
I could certainly buy the 1969 vehicle in its entirety including its V5. In my book it would be a slightly modified vehicle - there are thousands of
more extensively modified LRs on the road. I just wanted to do it by the book.
[Edited on 2/10/15 by gasket999]
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gasket999
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| posted on 2/10/15 at 11:48 AM |
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Another point is that the crossmember position and engine mount construction would be in line with Land Rover designs albeit on a different model.
The best example I could give is for MGB owners. You can order a new shell from British Motor Heritage and you have the choice of 4- or 8-cylinder
engine mounts - it's the same case here.
Should I approach the DVLA?
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adithorp
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| posted on 2/10/15 at 12:35 PM |
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Two things occure to me...
A) there's no way a series L/Rover will pass IVA. The edge radius requirements would be a nightmare to meet for starters.
B) If you want age related startus (and this is a registration/DVLA issue not IVA/VOSA) it'd have to have enough components from the donor to
qualify (sorrynot up to scatch on details) but you'd HAVE to have the donor V5 and chassis plates and that would be assigned as scrapped when
you register.
"A witty saying proves nothing" Voltaire
http://jpsc.org.uk/forum/
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mcerd1
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| posted on 2/10/15 at 01:13 PM |
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was there not something in the DVLA's stuff that says minor chassis mod like engine mounts don't count...... (I think this is in the
guidance leaflets they issue but I can't find it  )
besides the sort of mods to the chassis
in which case you may even be allowed to keep the donor's original reg (better than age related as you'd keep the tax excempt status, age
related ones don't qualify for this) if you've got enough other qualifying bits from the same donor of couse 
what ever you do stay well clear of IVA's and kit builds - since you've got a registered donor as your starting point you want to be
aiming for one of these schemes :
https://www.gov.uk/vehicle-registration/rebuilt-vehicles
https://www.gov.uk/vehicle-registration/radically-altered-vehicles
these are the ones the landrover guys use all the time - what your planning is nothing out of the ordinary 
I'm betting the landrover forums / mags are full of guides on chassis swaps....
[Edited on 2/10/2015 by mcerd1]
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gremlin1234
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| posted on 2/10/15 at 02:41 PM |
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quote:
Originally posted by mcerd1
was there not something in the DVLA's stuff that says minor chassis mod like engine mounts don't count...... (I think this is in the
guidance leaflets they issue but I can't find it )
besides the sort of mods to the chassis
see
http://www.the-ace.org.uk/chassis-and-monocoque-modification/
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