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Author: Subject: Sticking handbrake - MK Indy
Smoot

posted on 2/2/17 at 10:50 PM Reply With Quote
Sticking handbrake - MK Indy

Evening all,

I applied my handbrake earlier when cleaning my car and when I came to release it , it seems the drivers side has 'stuck on' - this is my car to begin with:



So I took out the 'boot box and had a look at where the handbrake came through at:



At this point I decided to play with the adjustment screws on the drivers side where it comes through from the handbrake itself, this seemed to completely remove all tension when pulling the handbrake on, in hindsight I wish I didn't do this part haha!

I could tell that the drivers side was the issue when I tried to roll the car, but when pulling and releasing the handbreak a few times after, I could see the passenger side moving slightly and the drivers side not moving at all. This is the drivers side caliper and cable that runs in from the handbrake:



That is kind of where I am at so far with it, I tried loosening the bolt on the top near the thing that looks like a spring, but that didn't seem to do anything. The inside of the car has been carpeted nicely, and I don't want to start having to remove that, unless it is necessary, is this a caliper/cable problem? or is it possible to identify that from these pictures and this story?

EDIT: I think the running gear is based on a Cosworth, I have asked the previous owner for some more info

I'd be helpful for any assistance you guys might have on this matter as I have just gave the car a nice wash and I am dying to take it out again tomorrow/someday soon!

Many thanks,
Rich

[Edited on 2/2/17 by Smoot]

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Adamirish

posted on 2/2/17 at 11:46 PM Reply With Quote
The handbrake setup on these is utter crap. Mine is next to useless. For the last MOT I adjusted it up so the handbrake was on at about 3/4 of the lever travel, on the way to the test station the handbrake locked on. I had to lay underneath the car in a car park backing it off again. Now it will just about hold itself with the lever right at the top of its travel. Stupid STUPID thing.

As for your issue, I would check the return spring on the caliper isn't broken and not letting the arm return. Failing that maybe corrosion on the caliper piston itself.

I will watch this thread with interest and see if any improvement can be made!





MK Indy 1700 Xflow

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Nickp

posted on 3/2/17 at 06:13 AM Reply With Quote
So you've released the tension at the lever end. Is the cable now slack at the caliper ends? If not then your cable is sticking and will need freeing off (with oil down it) or replacing. If it is loose then your caliper's sticking and will need removing to free that off.
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ian locostzx9rc2

posted on 3/2/17 at 07:36 AM Reply With Quote
De adjust the cable the white knurled adjuster in your pic if it doesn't release the handbrake then it's the calliper end the calipers are not the most reliable.
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CosKev3

posted on 3/2/17 at 08:14 AM Reply With Quote
You need to remember if the calipers have not been refurbished they are off Sierra so are circa 30 years old!

I rebuilt mine,was a pain in the arse as there are some small really awkward circlips holding the handbrake mech inside the caliper, but they work spot on

I would be looking at getting them refurbished by someone like Biggred.

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Smoot

posted on 3/2/17 at 08:18 AM Reply With Quote
Thanks for these replies so far guys, very helpful!

Nickp - Yes I released tension at the lever end and it's still on, but is there an easy way to remove the cable at the caliper end? Is it that bolt on the top that is near the 'spring thing'? that way I could check it if was moving freely and oil it as you say (even if it was not the cable sticking this time, a good oiling might prevent the cable sticking in the future?)

ian locostzx9rc2- I think I de-adjusted is as much as I could, it seems completely slack when I lift the lever now, so using your idea, it is probably the caliper sticking. so this is jack car up, remove wheel, remove caliper, and try to force the pistons back in? is there anything I can do to maintain the caliper, such as oil/grease it? or when they stick is it a case of just replacing ASAP?

Thanks for this assistance so far guys, no doubt more simple questions to follow!

Rich





Very little experience, but lots of effort and ambition to learn!

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Smoot

posted on 3/2/17 at 08:23 AM Reply With Quote
quote:
Originally posted by CosKev3
You need to remember if the calipers have not been refurbished they are off Sierra so are circa 30 years old!

I rebuilt mine,was a pain in the arse as there are some small really awkward circlips holding the handbrake mech inside the caliper, but they work spot on

I would be looking at getting them refurbished by someone like Biggred.


If they are off a Sierra and 30 years old, then I guess I should be thankful they have lasted this long!

Is refurbishment the best option? or is there a similar sized caliper that is more 'modern' that I could simply replace it with if it kept sticking/couldn't be refurbed? Or does every drive around with 30 year old calipers in varies states of disrepair? haha

Rich





Very little experience, but lots of effort and ambition to learn!

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CosKev3

posted on 3/2/17 at 08:26 AM Reply With Quote
You need to confirm if the cable is slack on the caliper end,just because it's slack at the lever it could still be sticking.

Don't undo the spring stop bolt!or you will have a nightmare getting it back in.

The cable is released off the caliper by slackening off the cable adjustment enough so you can pull the cable out at the caliper end to get enough slack to allow you to unhook the cable off the caliper arm.

I think the caliper will be stuck on,its probably over pulled the handbrake mechanism inside .

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mcerd1

posted on 3/2/17 at 09:53 AM Reply With Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Smoot
Is refurbishment the best option? or is there a similar sized caliper that is more 'modern' that I could simply replace it with if it kept sticking/couldn't be refurbed? Or does every drive around with 30 year old calipers in varies states of disrepair? haha

unless they are electric most of the newer calipers are made to a very similar design (and can have similar issues once they get old)
there are only a handful of makers for all the brake parts across all brands of cars (almost none make there own) ATE, Lucas, Bendix, Girling, Brembo, etc. and half of them seem to have merged these days - and most still base all the new designs off the same ones from 30 - 40 years ago.

so recon sierra ones should be like new and will work fine for years


I suspect that part of the issue is they won't be doing as many miles as they would on a tin-top - so they probably don't get used as much which won't help
winding them back properly and then readjusting them at every service should help keep everything free and moving, but its a bit of a faf


my 57 plate c-max ones are a similar style (ATE patter ones I think) and haven't stuck on (yet), but they keep threatening to not adjust and one of the pistons is a bit sticky.... so its due a recon caliper soon(ish)
but its not just fords, my mates 56 astra estate uses calipers that are also very similar and he's had stick pistons, adjusters and seized cables.
Also I had heard of more corrosion issues with the alloy bodied ones that VAG cars were using - and the electric calipers seem to have all kinds of interesting ways that they can fail


if you want a better handbrake with less issues then drum brakes are the answer


[Edited on 3/2/2017 by mcerd1]





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ian locostzx9rc2

posted on 3/2/17 at 05:27 PM Reply With Quote
If the cables slack at the calliper and it's sticking still the calliper u/s recon calipers aren't too expensive any motor factor should be able to supply one
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SteveWalker

posted on 3/2/17 at 10:42 PM Reply With Quote
quote:
Originally posted by mcerd1

if you want a better handbrake with less issues then drum brakes are the answer


[Edited on 3/2/2017 by mcerd1]


Even they stick. One thing that helps is when parking up long term ... don't put the handbrake on! Makes it much easier when working on other things in the garage too, as you can just push the car backwards and forwards when you need more space.

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Smoot

posted on 9/2/17 at 12:35 AM Reply With Quote
Evening guys,

It has been a few days until I could get a chance to look at this (sadly) but I have been out to assess what is going on, as per the advice offered earlier in the thread! (thanks again)

So I got out and got the wheels off the car to get a better look at the calipers then.

First thing I did was re-loosen the handbrake knobbly washer thing to see if it was the cable or the caliper sticking.

After loosening it, there was no change to the offending (drivers side) caliper.

I removed the screw and the spring (which looks to serve the purpose of retracting the cable again after the handbrake has been released.



I had a look at the other side caliper which is fine and the spring mechanism there is tight against the end of the cable and actually does pull the cable back after the handbrake is released. After a little more checking on the offending drivers side again, it doesn't seem to want to move at all.

I put the spring and screw back in again just to check, and the mechanism didn't move at all, it seems to be stuck out in this position, the picture below shows me wiggling the actual cable end here, which is a little bit loose, the cable isn't sticking and keeping the mechanism on, the mechanism is locked on by itself it seems?



I did give it a fair amount of WD40 on the mechanism in the hope that it might free off, but no movement happened...

I am thinking, this is what Coskev3 said about "I think the caliper will be stuck on,its probably over pulled the handbrake mechanism inside" - I guess my question then is, what do I do to reset this mechanism?

(in the event of having to remove a caliper, can someone link an idiots guide as to what to do to stop brake fluid leaking everywhere )

Just as a comparison, the image below is the passenger side caliper, mechanism is doing it's job and it seems to have pulled the cable nice and far back like it is supposed to, and when the handbrake is applied, it pulls the mechanism in.



Thanks in advance for any help you guys might have on this.
Rich





Very little experience, but lots of effort and ambition to learn!

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ian locostzx9rc2

posted on 9/2/17 at 06:22 AM Reply With Quote
Looks like you need a new (recon) calliper
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CosKev3

posted on 9/2/17 at 07:44 AM Reply With Quote
That caliper doesn't look that old tbf,judging by the coating on it.

I would get a hammer and chisel/drift and hit the lever towards the off position to see if it will release,be easier to remove the caliper if you can at least get it to release off the disc

Ref the fluid I would get the new caliper ready and just swap it over as fast as you can,you can't clamp steel braided hoses to stop the fluid draining.
Or the other option is to make up a blanking plug,this will require a brake fitting that's the same thread as the braided flexi pipe being screwed on to the end once you unscrew the pipe from caliper

[Edited on 9/2/17 by CosKev3]

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Smoot

posted on 9/2/17 at 10:24 AM Reply With Quote
Hi CosKev3,

Yeah I was thinking that it will be hard to replace with the caliper stuck on the wheel! So I guess my only option is the hammer and chisel to try and get it off, if that fails and the mechanism is definitely not going anywhere.. how in the world do I get it off? it is clamped completely!

Also is there a preferred guy to recon these? someone said Biggred earlier?

I was looking at one company:

http://www.larkspeed.com/category/view/EBCCALIPFORD/EBC-Brake-Calipe rs-Ford-

Is there a known re-seller of these too, as the only other company I found was:

http://www.kitcardirect.co.uk/ford-sierra-rear-caliper-pair.html

Which look very pricey for 2 new ones, and they don't sell separate

From anyone's knowledge, are the Sierra calipers on these Indy's shared amongst many Sierra models? The one on the link above looks correct, but doesn't state what year/model it comes from? I was thinking about trying round local scrappies/yards?

Rich

[Edited on 9/2/17 by Smoot]





Very little experience, but lots of effort and ambition to learn!

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jps

posted on 9/2/17 at 11:42 AM Reply With Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Smoot
From anyone's knowledge, are the Sierra calipers on these Indy's shared amongst many Sierra models? The one on the link above looks correct, but doesn't state what year/model it comes from? I was thinking about trying round local scrappies/yards?

Rich

[Edited on 9/2/17 by Smoot]


I think you'd be VERY lucky to find a Sierra in a scrap yard nowadays! Plus you'd likely need to recon a caliper off a scrapped car anyway...

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mcerd1

posted on 9/2/17 at 12:55 PM Reply With Quote
http://www.biggred.co.uk/

give them a call these guys are very helpful and will sell you the bits to rebuild it yourself (assuming you'd be confident doing that - tells you how in the old edition of the sierra Haynes manual)

[Edited on 9/2/2017 by mcerd1]





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CosKev3

posted on 9/2/17 at 03:51 PM Reply With Quote
Any of your local motor factors will be able to get you a recon caliper

They are not easy to rebuild yourself IMO, I've rebuilt a few types of calipers and my Sierra rears were by far the most complicated/fiddly to do.

If the caliper won't release you should be able to knock it off with a lump hammer imo once it's unbolted

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ian locostzx9rc2

posted on 9/2/17 at 06:19 PM Reply With Quote
As said any motor factors will be able to get one there still available. If your running solid discs on the back then there was only one option.

[Edited on 9/2/17 by ian locostzx9rc2]

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Smoot

posted on 9/2/17 at 07:55 PM Reply With Quote
Excellent,

So looking for local motor factors then that sell 'Sierra Cosworth' calipers like these:

http://www.mksportscars.com/parts-c3/brakes-c4/brake-kits-c60/new-sierra-rear-calipers-p5

Will I have to quote a certain year when calling up/browsing for these? the website above is the exact one I need but doesn't say what year/model they are from (other than of course Cosworth)

Thanks
Rich





Very little experience, but lots of effort and ambition to learn!

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bonzoronnie

posted on 9/2/17 at 08:15 PM Reply With Quote
Are your disks solid or vented ones ?

The Mk prices seem to be very steep .
Bear in mind, just because they state they are new does not mean they are not aftermarket parts .

If you have solid disks, a pair of calipers can be had from Big Red for half that price.

The word cosworth is often tagged onto standard Sierra parts as a way to add a price premium.

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CosKev3

posted on 9/2/17 at 08:15 PM Reply With Quote
Solid disc or vented disc is the only thing to makesure you get right.

Pretty sure it was only 4x4 Saph Cosworths and Escort Cosworths that use vented discs.

Xr4X4,3 door Cosworths(mk1) and 2wd Saph Cosworths all use solid discs

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CosKev3

posted on 14/2/17 at 08:12 AM Reply With Quote
https://www.locostbuilders.co.uk/viewthread.php?tid=207764
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