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Author: Subject: Correct procedure for registering a radically altered vehicle
John Bonnett

posted on 12/2/20 at 08:42 AM Reply With Quote
Correct procedure for registering a radically altered vehicle

I'm just looking at the paths open to me and would appreciate the experience of anyone who has taken this route.

I understand that the vehicle must qualify for the mandatory 8 points and that form V627/1 needs to be completed too on which the origin of the major components are listed. Is this a self-assessment or is a third party confirmation required to check the accuracy of the declaration? Is any more information required other than that put on this form? I would expect the name of the vehicle would need to be changed but how is this achieved? I would imagine that anyone who has built a Sammio or something like it would be able to answer all the questions to keep me on the right track.

I would appreciate any feed back. Thank you.

John

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Mr Whippy

posted on 12/2/20 at 12:49 PM Reply With Quote
Is it on a new chassis? if not I'd just treat it as a re-body car, where possible I'd not get the DVLA involved at all

is this Sammio a spider kit or the alloy Spitfire you amazingly built with an insane amount of skill?

Their site says - The Sammio Spyder is a fibreglass body conversion designed to fit around a Triumph Herald, it can be adapted to fit other vehicles with a similar wheelbase for example the Citroen 2CV.

So then it's just a rebody, I'd not even tell them about it apart from a colour change etc. If your wanting to change the name, well you'll be opening a whole can of worms with the jobsworth pencil pushers. My first kit car was a vw beach buggy which I stupidly told the DVLA about, jumped through hoops, had the police come round to check up on it, was fed a load of lies from the local inspector only for the DVLA to just keep it as a VW Beetle on the logbook, what a waste of my time

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John Bonnett

posted on 12/2/20 at 01:22 PM Reply With Quote
Many thanks for your kind words about the Lightweight, a project that I thoroughly enjoyed and on the strength of that I'd like to go a stage further and produce from scratch a completely new sports estate aluminium body. For sure I could do nothing about changing what the V5 says but anyone with any knowledge would be able to see that a Reliant Kitten is isn't. Who the "Anybody" is is open to conjecture but obvious possibilities would be the Police and the MOT tester.
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pekwah1

posted on 12/2/20 at 05:00 PM Reply With Quote
I think from the DVLA website you would also need to complete the V55/5 form which is essentially registration of a new/used vehicle.
My understanding is you would send this in with make/model, built up inspection report, original V5 etc.

May be worth a quick call to DVLA to confirm though

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John Bonnett

posted on 12/2/20 at 05:08 PM Reply With Quote
quote:
Originally posted by pekwah1
I think from the DVLA website you would also need to complete the V55/5 form which is essentially registration of a new/used vehicle.
My understanding is you would send this in with make/model, built up inspection report, original V5 etc.

May be worth a quick call to DVLA to confirm though


Thank for that. I do intend to speak to the DVLA but I was interested to hear from anyone who has actually gone through the procedure and can highlight any difficulties that they encountered or things that I should be aware of.

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russbost

posted on 12/2/20 at 06:31 PM Reply With Quote
John, what you're doing doesn't class as a radically altered vehicle, unless you are going to cut or weld the chassis, anything radically alteredrequires IVA testing, & the V627/1 is the form you fill in for DVLA if you've gone the IVA route.

If you are keeping a complete chassis (I assume Kitten) then I think you just need to inform DVLA of the body change, I don't think you need to fill out the V55/5 as you would be keeping the reg as the actual "vehicle" has not changed, simply the body

To clarify I think a call to the DVLA defo required!





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John Bonnett

posted on 12/2/20 at 07:16 PM Reply With Quote
quote:
Originally posted by russbost
John, what you're doing doesn't class as a radically altered vehicle, unless you are going to cut or weld the chassis, anything radically alteredrequires IVA testing, & the V627/1 is the form you fill in for DVLA if you've gone the IVA route.

If you are keeping a complete chassis (I assume Kitten) then I think you just need to inform DVLA of the body change, I don't think you need to fill out the V55/5 as you would be keeping the reg as the actual "vehicle" has not changed, simply the body

To clarify I think a call to the DVLA defo required!



I suppose that one way of looking at it is that as I'm using a Reliant unmodified chassis worth 5 points, axles 2, steering 2 points making a total of 9, the car retains its identity and is still a Reliant. If that's a valid argument nothing more needs to be done.

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Mr Whippy

posted on 12/2/20 at 09:21 PM Reply With Quote
Ok so this is really a new body in an existing unmodified chassis and running gear. Nothing whatsoever needs done as far as the dvla is concerned, that's the beauty of chassis based cars. Just look at landys or classic bugs they can be very radically altered from stock and it makes no difference so long as they are roadworthy.

My advice is do not involve the DVLA, you'll end up with some halfwit who only knows how to type forms into computers and is just interested in checking your paying enough road tax leading you up the garden path.

[Edited on 12/2/20 by Mr Whippy]

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John Bonnett

posted on 12/2/20 at 09:26 PM Reply With Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Mr Whippy
Ok so this is really a new body in an existing unmodified chassis and running gear. Nothing whatsoever needs done as far as the dvla is concerned, that's the beauty of chassis based cars. Just look at landys or classic bugs they can be very radically altered from stock and it makes no difference so long as they are roadworthy.



I really hope you are right because if so that would simplify things enormously. Cheers

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russbost

posted on 13/2/20 at 08:08 AM Reply With Quote
"My advice is do not involve the DVLA, you'll end up with some halfwit who only knows how to type forms into computers and is just interested in checking your paying enough road tax leading you up the garden path."

Sorry, but couldn't disagree more with Mr Whippy on this point. You absolutely have to involve DVLA or you finish up with a vehicle registered as a Kitten which quite clearly isn't.

I don't believe any form filling is required, you simply inform DVLA that the body has been replaced & the make would remain as Reliant but model would change to "Bonnet xyz" or whatever. I believe they will ask for an engineers report which can be done by anyone with an engineering qualification or a garage on headed paper & you would need a fresh MoT giving the new model etc

As you describe above re chassis, axles etc. it is NOT a radically altered vehicle & should retain it's main identity & reg no.





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John Bonnett

posted on 13/2/20 at 08:42 AM Reply With Quote
quote:
Originally posted by russbost
"My advice is do not involve the DVLA, you'll end up with some halfwit who only knows how to type forms into computers and is just interested in checking your paying enough road tax leading you up the garden path."

Sorry, but couldn't disagree more with Mr Whippy on this point. You absolutely have to involve DVLA or you finish up with a vehicle registered as a Kitten which quite clearly isn't.

I don't believe any form filling is required, you simply inform DVLA that the body has been replaced & the make would remain as Reliant but model would change to "Bonnet xyz" or whatever. I believe they will ask for an engineers report which can be done by anyone with an engineering qualification or a garage on headed paper & you would need a fresh MoT giving the new model etc

As you describe above re chassis, axles etc. it is NOT a radically altered vehicle & should retain it's main identity & reg no.



Thank you Russ. There is a place on the V5C to notify body change so if that and an engineer's report are all that is necessary, happy days!

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Mr Whippy

posted on 13/2/20 at 12:53 PM Reply With Quote
Well just saying when I did it (and things haven't changed afaik) there is no requirement to change the vehicle name if you swap the body. I could fit a wooden shed to my landrovers chassis and so long as it's roadworthy and can pass an MOT, its fine and doesn't need a new name like Shedmobile. For chassis based cars the chassis is the cars whole identity, the body is just an extra part like a seat or wing etc

I mind reading about a guy who converted his old Golf to gull-wing hinged doors, made the mistake of telling the DVLA for some stupid reason and ended up needing an SVA he had so much fun.

Whats the chance of someone in the DVLA (or 99.9999% of the population) even knowing what a reliant kitten is anyway Think of a motorbike, the frame is the bike, not the fairing or anything else, it's the same with cars.



[Edited on 13/2/20 by Mr Whippy]

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John Bonnett

posted on 13/2/20 at 12:53 PM Reply With Quote
Following a telephone call to the DVLA I now know that the process is in fact a little more complicated than the suggestions above and does involve taking the radically altered route. The chap was helpful and promised to send information on how to do it.

I always intended to speak to them but I had hoped that somebody on here had been through this process themselves and would be willing to share their experience.

I will pass on the procedure to you once I receive the information in the hope that it might be of help to others.

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Mr Whippy

posted on 13/2/20 at 12:59 PM Reply With Quote
Are you altering the chassis from stock?
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John Bonnett

posted on 13/2/20 at 01:03 PM Reply With Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Mr Whippy
Are you altering the chassis from stock?



No as I stated above

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Mr Whippy

posted on 13/2/20 at 01:08 PM Reply With Quote
an interesting linky

especially the bit at the bottom...

I think you project is a rebuilt vehicle rather than radically altered one




[Edited on 13/2/20 by Mr Whippy]

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russbost

posted on 13/2/20 at 01:12 PM Reply With Quote
quote:
Originally posted by John Bonnett
Following a telephone call to the DVLA I now know that the process is in fact a little more complicated than the suggestions above and does involve taking the radically altered route. The chap was helpful and promised to send information on how to do it.

I always intended to speak to them but I had hoped that somebody on here had been through this process themselves and would be willing to share their experience.

I will pass on the procedure to you once I receive the information in the hope that it might be of help to others.


If the chassis is unaltered & you're retaining (at least initially) the main running gear then that advice from DVLA is incorrect, as it is NOT a radically altered vehicle.

Think about the crazy piece of junk Topgear slung together as a "hybrid" a few years back - some horrific pop rivetted ali body on a TVR chassis, would never have passed an IVA, but didn't need to as it retained the TVR identity

Mr Whippy's example of the Golf above may well have classed as such because to make the doors operate as gull wing I'm guessing you'd need to cut the monocoque.
I think Mr Whippy is technically correct that you don't HAVE to change the name on the V5, but I suspect you might be causing yourself a lot more bother by not doing so, in that an MoT tester is going to take one look & say "That's not a Kitten" as would Mr Plod should they happen to pull you up. You'd also get loads of people saying "that's a ringer" (incorrectly!) when you came to sell You'd obviously need to tell your insurers anyway so why not give it a new model name & have done with it

What you are doing is no different to a Sammio body on a Spitfire chassis, or rebodying a Scimitar chassis





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Don't forget Stainless Steel Braided brake hoses, made to your exact requirements in any of around 16 colours. http://shop.ebay.co.uk/furoreproducts/m.html?_dmd=1&_ipg=50&_sop=12&_rdc=1

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John Bonnett

posted on 13/2/20 at 01:26 PM Reply With Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Mr Whippy
an interesting linky

especially the bit at the bottom...

I think you project is a rebuilt vehicle rather than radically altered one




[Edited on 13/2/20 by Mr Whippy]


The article pretty much agrees with what I was told by the DVLA. My project clearly isn't a rebuild which is why it falls into the radically altered category; the only other option.

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russbost

posted on 13/2/20 at 01:53 PM Reply With Quote
Completely disagree, yours would clearly be a rebuilt vehicle:-

For rebuilt vehicles, the rules state that in order to retain the original registration mark:

Cars and car-derived vans must use:-

The original unmodified chassis - which you are using

And two other major components from the original vehicle - ie suspension (front & back); steering assembly; axles (both); transmission or engine - again, which you are using

Hence it is a rebuilt vehicle, or, more simply a bodywork swap - problem with DVLA is that it's run by children that don't know one end of the car from another & wouldn't recognise a chassis if it jumped out & bit them!!!

Even under the radically altered rules, you still retain the original identity & avoid IVA - just add up the points

"For radically altered vehicles a points system is used. Vehicle must score eight or more points to retain the original identity and avoid the need for an SVA test. The following values are allocated to the major components used:

chassis or body shell (body and chassis as one unit - monocoque ie direct replacement from the manufacturer) (original or new) = 5 points

suspension = 2 points

axles = 2 points

transmission = 2 points

steering assembly = 2 points

engine = 1 point"





Furore Formula Car - the only two seater modern Formula Car lookalike. I no longer run Furore Products or Furore Cars Ltd, but would still highly recommend them for Acewell dashes, projector headlights, dominator headlights, indicators, mirrors etc, best prices in the UK! Take a look at http://www.furoreproducts.co.uk/ or find more parts on Ebay, user names furoreltd & furoreproducts, discounts available for LCB users.
Don't forget Stainless Steel Braided brake hoses, made to your exact requirements in any of around 16 colours. http://shop.ebay.co.uk/furoreproducts/m.html?_dmd=1&_ipg=50&_sop=12&_rdc=1

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ReMan

posted on 13/2/20 at 10:43 PM Reply With Quote
Ah the speak to the DVLA sketch.
I wouldn't trust them as far as... well you know.
The rules as are being quoted are difficult enough to decipher and if we can't interpret them from paper correcly why should they





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Mr Whippy

posted on 14/2/20 at 08:11 AM Reply With Quote
yip as above it's a rebuilt vehicle as you have not modified the chassis that's the key and what the article was referring to cos folk were dumping old series landrover body's on newer shortened range rover chassis and then trying to claim they were road tax free, very naughty

It's up to you, you'll keep the reg that's for sure and you can call the car anything you want (the Rabid Tiger...grrr) if you feel it's worth the effort then why not. I was just saying the technically you don't need to do anything. Hopefully you'll do a build blog.

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John Bonnett

posted on 14/2/20 at 09:25 AM Reply With Quote
I think we're ready to close off this thread now but I would like to thank you all for your input and opinions.

I have already started writing up the build in the Projects section so anyone who is really bored with nothing better to do can find it there.

I'm building an Estate body and the V5 says it is an Estate so I expect you can see my line of thinking.

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