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Author: Subject: 2b upper balljoint bolt. How is this done????
Mr Whippy

posted on 14/9/20 at 07:30 AM Reply With Quote
2b upper balljoint bolt. How is this done????

Hi,

I'm having to change the upper balljoints in the mushrooms due to knackered boots and they seem quite loose, however I was amazed to find the bolt inside canted over at such an angle that I can't see how I'm supposed to even get a socket in there! how are people managing this???

Cheers

(I have posted on the RHOCAR but just in case someone here has done this)






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nick205

posted on 14/9/20 at 09:01 AM Reply With Quote
I've dealt with a similar issue before by using an angle grider to "adjust" a cheap socket to make it fit. I highlight the word cheap as I took the view that if I knackered the socket it wouldn't have cost me too much. At the same time (as you'll be well aware) it's a suspension part you're dealing with so make sure you can get it done up to the correct torque without breaking the socket or slipping and injuring yourself.

Anoth Robin Hood owner may well have a more enlightening answer for you - lets' see what comes.

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steve m

posted on 14/9/20 at 09:19 AM Reply With Quote
I would second a cut down modified socket, as the nut looks from the photo to be more of a half nut than full size
And even normal sized sockets have a lot of redundent room above the nut

The socket may need the top tapering in as well

But thirdly, what a stupid design!!

steve





Thats was probably spelt wrong, or had some grammer, that the "grammer police have to have a moan at




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Mr Whippy

posted on 14/9/20 at 12:02 PM Reply With Quote
Thanks, I've found a 19mm socket (the size of the nut) and a 17mm 3/8 drive one and am going to slice up them up and weld the two together to make a custom socket with a wobbly 3/8 extension bar

Yeah this is not a great designed part at all but typical of this car...

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nick205

posted on 14/9/20 at 12:23 PM Reply With Quote
Thinking further Mr Whippy - could you replace what I assume to be a Transit drag link end with a Rose joint type arrangement? If you could geta permanebtly fixed (welded) pin in the RH part to fit the Rose type joint over with a nut from above you'd end up with a more serviceable solution longer term.

Maybe more effort than you want to go to, but it seems a tidier all round solution. You could apply the same solution to the other side of the car in due course as well.

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indykid

posted on 14/9/20 at 12:40 PM Reply With Quote
If you're chopping up sockets, a small offset crow's foot type arrangement should work better than keeping everything coaxial. I'm not sure there's room in there for a conventional crow's foot spanner.

Push the drive square off centre until you can get line of sight for the extension bar and leave a bit of room for rotation. It might take a while to get the nut off but it's less likely to slip off and muller the nut (or shear the wobble end off the extension bar).





me? ambivalent? well, yes and no

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James

posted on 14/9/20 at 01:30 PM Reply With Quote
The 'tube' doesn't need to be as long as it is does it? The MK ones I have are just as long (50-60mm) as the clamped part.

If you were to cut your tube down to the shorter length could you fit a normal socket in?

Alternatively, buy the MK-type inserts which are a nicely turned single piece of steel and ditch these horrors altogether!

Cheers!





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nick205

posted on 14/9/20 at 03:26 PM Reply With Quote
quote:
Originally posted by James
The 'tube' doesn't need to be as long as it is does it? The MK ones I have are just as long (50-60mm) as the clamped part.

If you were to cut your tube down to the shorter length could you fit a normal socket in?

Alternatively, buy the MK-type inserts which are a nicely turned single piece of steel and ditch these horrors altogether!

Cheers!



Good point - I built an MK Indy and used the same MK supplied parts you describe. I was able to tighten/loosen the nut with a normal socket and the tub section was only as deep as it had to be to be clamped by the Ford Sierra front uprights.

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adithorp

posted on 14/9/20 at 03:27 PM Reply With Quote
Trim the tube down. As said, it doesn't need to be that long.
If that doesn't let you get on I'd suggest a ball end extension set. Allows you to work at an angle and without the extra length of a uj extension (very useful and who doesn't like an excuse for new tools)... Or is it that there isn't room for the height of the socket? In which case stubby socket set (see previous excuse).





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Mr Whippy

posted on 14/9/20 at 03:51 PM Reply With Quote
Ah but one thing the RH wishbones don't have which makes this bit of bad design necessary is that if you look at the end of the MK one below it's angled down (the one in the pic is upsides down), this is to prevent the joint running out of travel. Because RH have made the threaded tube horizontal it meant they had to angle the mushroom instead! a hilarious oversight... which also means I can't use the MK mushroom... so I'm stuck with it



Although I do like the idea of a rosejoint I'll still have to make a tool to get this off so I'm not really any better off tbh and the transit links are quite cheap. I think the tube is a tad over length which I may shorten a bit although I did want to add a bolt on the underside as a safety lock to stop it ever being pulled out. The normal strut has a metal tab which prevents it being pulled out without the bolt being removed first.

Good ideas though, thanks



[Edited on 14/9/20 by Mr Whippy]

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40inches

posted on 14/9/20 at 05:07 PM Reply With Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Mr Whippy
Ah but one thing the RH wishbones don't have which makes this bit of bad design necessary is that if you look at the end of the MK one below it's angled down (the one in the pic is upsides down), this is to prevent the joint running out of travel. Because RH have made the threaded tube horizontal it meant they had to angle the mushroom instead! a hilarious oversight... which also means I can't use the MK mushroom... so I'm stuck with it



Although I do like the idea of a rosejoint I'll still have to make a tool to get this off so I'm not really any better off tbh and the transit links are quite cheap. I think the tube is a tad over length which I may shorten a bit although I did want to add a bolt on the underside as a safety lock to stop it ever being pulled out. The normal strut has a metal tab which prevents it being pulled out without the bolt being removed first.

Good ideas though, thanks



[Edited on 14/9/20 by Mr Whippy]


That pic is the correct way up.
This is mine Description
Description

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Mr Whippy

posted on 14/9/20 at 08:30 PM Reply With Quote
oh yeah, been a while since I had an MK

Solved the issue, I chopped a 19mm 1/2 drive and a 13mm 3/8 drive socket in half and welded them together. Then ground a 3/8 extension into a wobbly one

Worked perfectly nut off in a few seconds, one for the toolbox cheers for the suggestions






[Edited on 14/9/20 by Mr Whippy]

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nick205

posted on 15/9/20 at 12:47 PM Reply With Quote
Good to see you've got it sorted.

What I find strange though is there must be other Robin Hood owners out there that have faced the same problem (many that probably don't have tool modification skills) so how have they managed to get the part together and apart?

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SteveWalker

posted on 15/9/20 at 03:34 PM Reply With Quote
My series III uses similar mushrooms, but without the arms for cycle wings and I've had no problem (just a vague memory of a pretty tight fit). It is possible that they are a little shorter, but one thing that probably does make a difference, is that my socket set (Halfords Pro 150 piece set from 18 years ago), uses 3/8" drive for its 19mm socket anyway and there is a wobble bar in the set too - so you've probably picked on a solution that, by chance, I simply didn't need to look for.
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