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Author: Subject: Warner R4 Build Diary
cloudy

posted on 1/11/06 at 12:26 PM Reply With Quote
The angle isn't far off the angle most sevens seem to use at the front, perhaps I could compensate by using rising rate springs?

Obviously the angle is a trade off, the further you lean it the more travel at the wheel you get. where does 10cm sit compared regards "normal" middy travel?


as regards bracing, yes theres a tube that goes horiztontally from the top shock mount across to the other



[Edited on 1/11/06 by cloudy]

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Doug68

posted on 1/11/06 at 01:11 PM Reply With Quote
Just because most 7's do it doesn't make it the best way to do it.
If you look at the front end of a 7 either you have 3 choices:
1. Do what most people do now.
2. Use a push rod type suspension.
3. Build a really ugly frame out the side of the nose to get the shock more upright.

So given the choices I can understand why most people go for choice 1.

10cm (4" is exactly what I'm working around myself and basically what you get from a book built Locost also.

I expect ~5cm to be used by the static load of the car leaving ~5cm movement left for bump absorption.

Doug.

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cloudy

posted on 1/11/06 at 01:34 PM Reply With Quote
that's pretty much how it is, i'll go with it for now, I can always redo it later with longer shocks so they can be upright - the beauty of having no bodywork!

James

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Fred W B

posted on 1/11/06 at 02:51 PM Reply With Quote
quote:

3. Build a really ugly frame out the side of the nose to get the shock more upright.



Like this - note this is VERY rough mock up work

Cheers

Fred W B

rough upright
rough upright


[Edited on 1/11/06 by Fred W B]

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cloudy

posted on 6/11/06 at 09:30 AM Reply With Quote
Anyone know of anywhere to get high range top joints for cortina hubs? I've heard these discussed before. Basically it jams up before the bump stops will be reached, which of course is pretty dangerous.

James

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cloudy

posted on 17/11/06 at 05:14 PM Reply With Quote
I'm starting to have reservations on the design so far - it looks malproptioned a little when I wheel it out of garage.

I'm still not 100% happy that the design is the best shape I could choose, what's the general feeling about taking off roof and using a roll hoop design as below, allows the main body to sit much lower....


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cloudy

posted on 17/11/06 at 10:45 PM Reply With Quote
haven't seen any responses so i've progressed a litte, what do you think?


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cloudy

posted on 18/11/06 at 12:15 AM Reply With Quote
plan view


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ZEN

posted on 18/11/06 at 12:26 AM Reply With Quote
This one loks MUCH better and MUCH more professional looking styling.
Aren't the side bards to close to the drivers and passenger heads on the bottom 2 pics?
I think it would look rely nice with just the side pannels, air intake at the front F1 "nose up" style and opend rear like the Porsche 917 racing car.
What software are you using for the design?




[Edited on 18/11/06 by ZEN]





http://www.metalurgija.org

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iank

posted on 18/11/06 at 12:52 AM Reply With Quote
Looks very nice, but I thought the original looked good

The side bars do seem very close to the drivers head - not good in an accident. The optional ones on the sylva r10t and full cages on 7's tend to kick out as far as practical.

Also it won't be as ridged as the full cage version, but it looks close to a balsa model I made a while back which was pretty good.

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cloudy

posted on 18/11/06 at 01:31 AM Reply With Quote
cheers guys, it's 3dsmax 7 i'm using, given up trying to figure out solidworks! you are right on the proximity to head - will have to mull that one over...

The old design looked very odd at certain angles (especially the back) , so far this is OK from all

Here's a slightly more refined version, still not happy with the shape of roll bar, and obviously it can't sit on the middle of a tube as per the current design...


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Doug68

posted on 18/11/06 at 09:10 AM Reply With Quote
Firstly I applaud your desire to be original, there's not enough of that these days.

Maybe its the angle of the view but the roll bar looks too low to touch down before the occupants head does.
On the same vein either the seats are too short or those are big wheels?

I'd push the roll tube back to match up with the rear bulkhead then it can be one tube all the way up over and down again. You can then cut holes for the side tubes to pass through. which means even if the welds fail it can't come apart.

I do like the concept though, I had thought of doing a similar thing at one point using flat ally or carbon panels screwed in between the tubes to form the body work.

I've been using Solid Edge which due to my CAE background didn't take too long to work out. The 'arty' packages are still a mystery having tried Studio Tools PLE etc. As at some point I'm going to have to go back and have a look again, did you settle on 3DSMax for a reason, or was it just what came to hand?

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akumabito

posted on 18/11/06 at 02:03 PM Reply With Quote
Wow! I think this new design looks damn sexy! I already like the original, but it just gets better and better every time you alter the design!

*joins the requests for an entry-level kit*

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Peteff

posted on 18/11/06 at 02:24 PM Reply With Quote
If the roll bar is level with the driver's eye which it looks like there you will need a hoist to get in and out of the car. Your vision will be severely restricted by the bar in front of you as well. The roll bar and seats look out of proportion.

[Edited on 18/11/06 by Peteff]





yours, Pete

I went into the RSPCA office the other day. It was so small you could hardly swing a cat in there.

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cloudy

posted on 18/11/06 at 03:27 PM Reply With Quote
yeah, still progressing with the design - took the grinder to the chassis this morning took off the old roof

Sat in it to get head height measurement, and therefore the roll bar height required...


James

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cloudy

posted on 18/11/06 at 05:21 PM Reply With Quote
OK, the bars along shoulders are now further apart - and the roll bar is the correct height.

Not sure on the shape? would a plain hoop be better? or maybe two hoops?



James

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dr-fastlane

posted on 19/11/06 at 03:28 PM Reply With Quote
Hello Cloudy,

The new design looks much better than the one with the roof on it. And very original I must say. In my opinion build a plain hoop.
One question, how do you get in the car? Climbing over the upper frame tubes doesn’t seems practical.

Greets Roy.





------------------------------
I have not failed once. I have successfully found ways that will not work!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wy6HajWH_Ew

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akumabito

posted on 19/11/06 at 05:22 PM Reply With Quote
I love the design! Leave the hoop as it is now, it looks great! However, are you sure the scale of the seats/driver is correct in respect to the rest of the car? Or are you running 24 inch wheels? It just seems a bit off..
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cloudy

posted on 19/11/06 at 06:38 PM Reply With Quote
Yes i'll be just climbing in over the chassis! Shoulda seen me trying to get in the roofed one! I'll go with the old standard plain hoop - I won't be able to make the bendy one with the bender i've got access to anyway...

I've measured it simulating the recline of the replacement seat, the 3d copy man is probably a little on the small side!

Here's a pic I took, however these seats are going in favour of some more reclined ones, i've used this lower measurement in the 3d copy



[Edited on 19/11/06 by cloudy]

[Edited on 19/11/06 by cloudy]

[Edited on 19/11/06 by cloudy]

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sgraber

posted on 19/11/06 at 09:18 PM Reply With Quote
The chassis has a very sexy line to it. But I must caution you on the use of the upper frame tube in it's current position. It is too close to the head. A side impact and the bar will definitely impinge on the head. You simply cannot forsee that everyone driving this vehicle would wear a helmet and it's possible that even with a helmet, a side impact of medium or large intensity will cause serious neck and or head injury. Please re-evaluate this!

Graber





Steve Graber
http://www.grabercars.com/

"Quickness through lightness"

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akumabito

posted on 19/11/06 at 09:29 PM Reply With Quote
Wouldn't that problem be fixed by fitting those rally seats that keep the head in place? (ya know, like a bucket seat but with extra 'flaps' to keep the head/helmet from bouncing all over the place for when the going gets rough...)

Sortof like this:



Only way less ugly and probably a helluvalot cheaper that $1,700.

Or this:


Ohh well, ya get the idea..

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cloudy

posted on 19/11/06 at 11:59 PM Reply With Quote
I taken your comments on board, i'll look into a solution

James

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Doug68

posted on 20/11/06 at 12:57 AM Reply With Quote
I think SVA would throw a fit if you try to use seats with the side restraints, due to the reduced peripheral vision.

In the picture what the heck is the remote controlled do-dad with the camera strapped to then?

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akumabito

posted on 20/11/06 at 03:11 PM Reply With Quote
Hmm... maybe you could simply cover those bars with rollbar padding? It looks kinda cool without any body panels. Just add padding to the chassis around the driver area.
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cloudy

posted on 20/11/06 at 05:26 PM Reply With Quote
the doodad is a (now) PC tele operated exploration robot I built, tested 1km range - theoretical 5km range

some video from the field trials

http://www.digital-car.co.uk/video/trials.wmv

I built it in the times the car was giving me grief and I needed something else to work on....

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