escort_innit
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| posted on 25/4/07 at 08:50 AM |
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petition against the restriction of the use of older cars
I don't know how realistic it is that this might happen but I wouldn't put it past the EU. Apparently they want to ban or restrict the
use of cars older than 10 years. The consequences of this would be enormous, the whole idea is ridiculous, but if there is any chance that this might
happen it's worth speaking up against it!
petition
[Edited on 25/4/07 by escort_innit]
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chockymonster
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| posted on 25/4/07 at 08:51 AM |
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It already happens in some cities in europe. Stuttgart is one I believe.
PLEASE NOTE - Responses on Forum Threads may contain Sarcasm and may not be suitable for the hard of Thinking.
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mookaloid
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| posted on 25/4/07 at 08:58 AM |
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Working Linky
I've signed 
"That thing you're thinking - it wont be that."
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smart51
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| posted on 25/4/07 at 09:02 AM |
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That's crazy. Making a car produces more pollution than running it. About 5 time as much, so I've read. Environmentally then it is much
better to repair and maintain an old car than to scrap it and buy a new one. The problem is that too many people don't do the repair and
maintenance and so drive round in a smoky old rust bucket.
They don't even make more pollution than new cars. a 40 year old 40 MPG car makes as much pollution per mile as a 40 MPG euro 4 new car. The
new car's emmissions are more CO2 and less HC / CO so the pollution is "cleaner" but there's no less of it.
Keep old cars on the road!
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COREdevelopments
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| posted on 25/4/07 at 09:03 AM |
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signed!
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Mr Whippy
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| posted on 25/4/07 at 09:11 AM |
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signed, what a dumb ass government gettin well sick of these c%nts
Fame is when your old car is plastered all over the internet
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Bluemoon
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| posted on 25/4/07 at 09:35 AM |
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I have signed, but to be fair the argument for such a rule is not to due with climate change (CO2 emissions) but more for local pollution.
I.e. older cars emit stuff that is bad for your health, and cause a measured increase in deaths etc. A good example is particulates, live somewere
with "clean" air or somewere with high particulate levels has been shown to reduce the avrage life by 2 years (from memory would need to
check the reports)... It is this that will be used as an argument for..
Dispite the above I would argue against the rule as the number of 10+ years cars will decreasse rapidly with time. They may have a point for
buses/lorrys with a long service life.
Current discussions and scientific work in the cliamte/pollution world have reached the point of balancing local evnorment pollution vs global climate
change. For examle the same particulates might actualy dercrease global warming, by becoming clould nucli and increasing the number of clouds
reflecting more of the suns energy to space... A difficult choice.
Dan
[Edited on 25/4/07 by Bluemoon]
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Mr Whippy
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| posted on 25/4/07 at 09:48 AM |
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What do you think are the chances that motor manufacturers have some involvement in the proposal?
As for all the global warming bull being spouted out, like effects on cloud cover (did you know most cloud formation is infact caused by meteor dust,
or so they say) you get more sense from an episode of Startrek than the ravings I read in the science magazines most of which contradicts itself with
each new installment of ‘Global sudo-sience’. It's no wonder people are turning away from science as a career.
I have one mag claiming that the planet was going into a new ice age due to the particulates in the air causing extra clouds, even plane contrails
were claimed to be causing a measurable effect when the planes were taken out the sky's during 9/11. Oh well so much for global warming...
[Edited on 25/4/07 by Mr Whippy]
Fame is when your old car is plastered all over the internet
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smart51
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| posted on 25/4/07 at 09:54 AM |
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quote:
Originally posted by Mr Whippy
What do you think are the chances that motor manufacturers have some involvement in the proposal?
Wouldn't surprise me in the least. By proxy of course, I'm sure they wouldn't release a press statement saying that.
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02GF74
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| posted on 25/4/07 at 10:06 AM |
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quote:
Originally posted by Bluemoon
I have signed, but to be fair the argument for such a rule is not to due with climate change (CO2 emissions) but more for local pollution.
I.e. older cars emit stuff that is bad for your health, and cause a measured increase in deaths etc.
Is that really so? 10 yrs isn't that long ago.
My volvo 850 is 14 years old, has a cat fitted - I'd be interested to see any data comparing it to one that is new - or are you thinking of cars
from the 70s and before.
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escort_innit
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 posted on 25/4/07 at 10:15 AM |
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quote:
Originally posted by Bluemoon
Dispite the above I would argue against the rule as the number of 10+ years cars will decreasse rapidly with time. They may have a point for
buses/lorrys with a long service life.
[Edited on 25/4/07 by Bluemoon]
Buses and lorries are the worst culprits for belching out smoke!
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Mr Whippy
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| posted on 25/4/07 at 10:31 AM |
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As are all diesels.
Fame is when your old car is plastered all over the internet
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Fatgadget
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| posted on 25/4/07 at 10:48 AM |
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In Japan they have approached the matter somewhat differently.
It just doesn't make financial sense to run an old car.
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James
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| posted on 25/4/07 at 10:51 AM |
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Before some get all shouty....
Anyone actually got any evidence it's happening/been proposed?
I can't find it anywhere on Google (although I've not searched *that* extensively! ).
Cheers,
James
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
"The fight is won or lost far away from witnesses, behind the lines, in the gym and out there on the road, long before I dance under those lights."
- Muhammad Ali
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Mr Whippy
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| posted on 25/4/07 at 11:13 AM |
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answer is nope but did find this -
http://www.bernama.com.my/bernama/v3/news.php?id=258625
another greeny nut -
http://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/columnists/virginia-ironside/article2420584.ece
Fame is when your old car is plastered all over the internet
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speedyxjs
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 posted on 25/4/07 at 11:19 AM |
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Iv signed. How stupid is this? What happens to us who run an old car for a hobby? I cant imagine they would ban older cars, they would most likely
restrict them to a certain number of miles in a year. Out of curiosity is anyone for this rediculus proposal?
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smart51
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| posted on 25/4/07 at 11:32 AM |
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quote:
Originally posted by Fatgadget
In Japan they have approached the matter somewhat differently.
It just doesn't make financial sense to run an old car.
In Japan, all cars have to meet current emissions standards at MOT - Kind of like your 1989 Ford Sierra having to pass Euro4 emmissions limits. You
have a choice of upgrading your car to pass or getting rid of your car.
The Japanese do a good line in exporting middle aged cars overseas to third world contries who have age related emmissions standards, like Hong Kong,
South Korea and the UK. (Anyone here bought a Eunos rather than an MX5). It is stupid though because the old cars still exist and are still
producing exhaust emissions, only you've used a big polluting ship to transport them around the world.
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Confused but excited.
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| posted on 25/4/07 at 11:49 AM |
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quote:
Originally posted by James
Before some get all shouty....
Anyone actually got any evidence it's happening/been proposed?
I can't find it anywhere on Google (although I've not searched *that* extensively! ).
Cheers,
James
Signed anyway.
BACK OFF BRUSSELS!
To the Goverments of the World:
If you are so worried about atmospheric pollution, have a word with China before you start griping about my little car!
Tell them about the bent treacle edges!
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Mr Whippy
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| posted on 25/4/07 at 11:54 AM |
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they should see the smoke my old digger produces now that is a problem  cough!
Fame is when your old car is plastered all over the internet
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SixedUp
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| posted on 25/4/07 at 12:08 PM |
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quote:
Originally posted by Bluemoon
Dispite the above I would argue against the rule as the number of 10+ years cars will decreasse rapidly with time. They may have a point for
buses/lorrys with a long service life.
Isn't this the wrong way around? In my experience there are more and more cars around that are over 10 years old because they seem to last so
much longer. I assume thats because they are built better now, with proper rust-proofing, better materials, etc etc. You regularly see cars that are
20+ years old, with *huge* mileages on them - I'm sure that wasn't the case in (say) the 70's ...
And as for buses and lorries ... they often seem to be the smokiest things on the roads!
Cheers
Richard
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trikerneil
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| posted on 25/4/07 at 12:10 PM |
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Signed
ACE Cafe - Just say No.
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Fatgadget
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| posted on 25/4/07 at 12:18 PM |
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quote:
Originally posted by smart51
quote:
Originally posted by Fatgadget
In Japan they have approached the matter somewhat differently.
It just doesn't make financial sense to run an old car.
In Japan, all cars have to meet current emissions standards at MOT - Kind of like your 1989 Ford Sierra having to pass Euro4 emmissions limits. You
have a choice of upgrading your car to pass or getting rid of your car.
The Japanese do a good line in exporting middle aged cars overseas to third world contries who have age related emmissions standards, like Hong Kong,
South Korea and the UK. (Anyone here bought a Eunos rather than an MX5). It is stupid though because the old cars still exist and are still
producing exhaust emissions, only you've used a big polluting ship to transport them around the world.
Incidentally the vast majority of these Japanese cars end up in Africa these days and there they run and run and run. This can only be a good thing
surely rather than scrapping something that can be useful to someone who otherwise hasn't got the means of acquiring the latest vehicles?
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mcerd1
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| posted on 25/4/07 at 01:05 PM |
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I've signed
I've got 3 cars +2 donors, the kit (), a scimitar (next project) and my everyday pug 106
All of them are older than 15 year now !
I was looking at a "new" car for every day, but new to me just means less than 10 years old its much cheeper that way
If they want to get rid of old rust buckets couldn't they just introduce a higher pass standard for the MOTs ? (all cars not just old ones -
I've seen 2 year old cars that shouldn't be on the road!)
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andyps
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| posted on 25/4/07 at 01:54 PM |
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I am pretty sure it is all down to local pollution but that is all about the usual not in my back yard syndrome. I have heard about the proposals and
if Edinburgh pass this rule I would love to see how they plan to police it - would there be officials on every road into the centre turning away older
cars, and how would they know anyway. What if I had a very late Mini from 1999 but had a personal plate on it making it appear older?
I've signed the petition though.
Andy
An expert is someone who knows more and more about less and less
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Mr Whippy
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| posted on 25/4/07 at 02:09 PM |
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quote:
Originally posted by andyps
I am pretty sure it is all down to local pollution but that is all about the usual not in my back yard syndrome. I have heard about the proposals and
if Edinburgh pass this rule I would love to see how they plan to police it - would there be officials on every road into the centre turning away older
cars, and how would they know anyway. What if I had a very late Mini from 1999 but had a personal plate on it making it appear older?
I've signed the petition though.
They would use the DVLA database and the network of registration reading cameras to track you movements and once you have reached your cars limit,
your insurance company will be automatically informed that the car is on the road that so they can immediately cancel your insurance. Then bollards
will spring out of the road in front of you to wipe out your car. You’ll then have to pay compensation for scratching the bollards and the
pre-arranged scrap lorry and of course the huge fine.
Fame is when your old car is plastered all over the internet
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