T66
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| posted on 8/3/11 at 04:34 PM |
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Police Pay
So here I am, a Cop of 20+ years.....
To put the record straight.....
Since the 13th April 1987 - 11% of my salary has gone into my pension. I started on £7800 a year and for the first four years received family income
benefit.
In the last 23 years .....
Assaulted 4 times that I can recall. Spat on lots, bitten once or twice + plenty attempts..
Attacked with - fencepost,knives, stool, hammer, spade, screwdriver, glass, shoe (s) , thats before I count all the times I have arrested criminals
when they have kicked off (very common). I have encountered guns personally on two ocaasions, thankfully the people we stopped decided not to shoot
us, the other incident they ran away and dropped their revolver.
PS - Just remebered the biker who filled me in when I was 23, stopped him for riding on a footpath. wearing his helmet, he grabbed my hair and
alternated between nutting me with the lid, and banging my face off his brass door knocker. When convicted I got £25 compensation, which I got in 25 x
£1 cheques, payable over 24 months which stretched out to nearly 36 months because he didnt pay it. My hair since then has never been long enough to
grab...
I have been due to strikes an ..
Ambulance driver
Fire service
Prison officer
All roles absolutely nothing to do with looking after communities, just expected by the government of the day as they fronted up their respective
unions.
I have had my house burgled by criminals who followed me home, and broke in when I had gone to work and my wife was in the house with the kids. This
was because my team focused on them and gave them a hard time.
A car thief tried to run me down when we disturbed them screwing a car, My Police car has been rammed by stolen cars on 3 occassions. An Audi Quattro,
a Golf GTI and a Astra GTE.
But as you read, can I please point out I am not writing for sympathy, this is my career/job choice and as such I expect to be on the shitty end of
societies anger and frustration.
I have no degree, I have school/college qualifications and do not see myself as well paid.
I can look forward to my pension with only 6 years before I retire, a pension I have paid for without any top ups from local Authority.
I have worked all the shift patterns you could dream up to shaft a family life.
I worked for a Tory government in the late 80s, then a Labour government, and now the current arrangement I didnt vote for.
Ive seen and heard all the bullshit about reducing paperwork for cops since 1987, NONE - NONE of the policies have made a jot of difference.
The only saving grace from all the current bashing from the press and government, well after they have stopped paying me overtime (when I
occassionally work it) I still have a job in these tough times.
I am in receipt of a competency payment, which Labour gave us for some reason, they also paid certain officers more money to work in certain posts.
These were seen by all as divisive and uneccessary. The only branch of Policing which should be in receipt of enhancement, are the public facing 24/7
posts, where your more likely to get murdered ! the rest (me included) who are not public facing (too often) should just recieve a decent income
without stupid divisive "perks". These posts always suffer with high turnover due to the high pressure & stress of these posts.
My pay will be reduced by around £150 a month, I will deal with it, at least I will have a job, Cops working for the Met Police in central London
stand to lose £4000 a year. Try buying a London flat on £24,000 a year. Not quite sure how that one will pan out.
The only incentive to get me out of bed when work rings me because someone has gone sick is the prospect of payment, if the current government cut me
recieving monetary reward for short notice working - I will stay in bed.
Dont know why the rest of you go to work before you start having a pop, but I go to work to earn money to pay bills, take my wife out for a pint and
try and enjoy my life. I didnt join the Police to work for time off in lieue (which I cannot take anyway).
When the police made me a prison officer after the Strangeways Prison riots, one of the inmates told me - " I hate detectives, but you lot
(uniform cops) keep the jungle in hand when Im in here" He was making direct reference to the care of his wife while he was in prison, folks it
is a jungle out there and it isnt getting any better...I have never forgotten his words.
I doff my hat to the families struggling to cope with the massive rise in day to day living costs , God Bless.
[Edited on 8/3/11 by T66]
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Jasongray5
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| posted on 8/3/11 at 04:53 PM |
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Big respect for you. Sounds like the police are going to get a hard time of it, funny they didnt mention that in the manifesto?
How hard can it be?
http://www.flickr.com/photos/33261515@N03/sets/72157611049241239/
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scootz
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| posted on 8/3/11 at 04:56 PM |
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Amen Ivan!
As you know, I'm no longer in 'the-job', but after nigh on 20 years of it, I can fully empathize with those that still are!
Each government from the early-90's forward has shafted the Police. They've allowed bureaucracy to spiral to unmanageable levels and
they've allowed ridiculous human-rights / diversity led issues to undermine the role of the front-line Officer (particularly in relation to
sorting out anti-social behavior and investigating 'real crimes' ).
End-result = low moral + poor public service (despite many Officers best intentions)!
Many folk don't know that the Police cannot withhold their labour (strike). So they have no negotiating powers with the Government. They just
change the rules and it's tough-sh*t... !!!
Most folk also don't realize that Police Officers pay 11% of their wage into their pension fund. It's not the gold-lined gratuity that
many think it is! I understand that many Cops joining in the last 10 years have opted-out of the pension-scheme because they simply can't
afford to pay it and still put food on their families table!
I hope this one doesn't descend into a 'bad apples' debate... yes, they exist, but every job has it's arseholes! Most of the
boys and girls do a very good job in very trying circumstances.
It's Evolution Baby!
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emsfactory
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| posted on 8/3/11 at 04:56 PM |
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Wish my misses drank pints.
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T66
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| posted on 8/3/11 at 05:01 PM |
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quote:
Originally posted by emsfactory
Wish my misses drank pints.
Its only down to household austerity cuts, the pint is mine she drinks...
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emsfactory
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| posted on 8/3/11 at 05:03 PM |
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.
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Mix
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| posted on 8/3/11 at 05:12 PM |
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Hi
I have every sympathy for your situation and concerns for its future.
When I was a nipper my family impressed on me that if I needed help, 'ask a policeman'. That advice I've passed on to my, (now
adult), kids.
I feel the Police force should be held in higher regard to that which it apears to be nowadays - after all, how many of us would undertake their
responsibilities?
Before anyone gets on the speed camera case - I'd like to state my view, if I'm caught speeding I accept that I am breaking the law and as
such deserved to be punished. If penalising speeding motorists is a means to fund the force then thats fine by me as long as this does not detract
from placing focus on other areas of concern.
Regards Mick
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T66
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| posted on 8/3/11 at 05:26 PM |
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quote:
Originally posted by Mix
Hi
I have every sympathy for your situation and concerns for its future.
When I was a nipper my family impressed on me that if I needed help, 'ask a policeman'. That advice I've passed on to my, (now
adult), kids.
I feel the Police force should be held in higher regard to that which it apears to be nowadays - after all, how many of us would undertake their
responsibilities?
Before anyone gets on the speed camera case - I'd like to state my view, if I'm caught speeding I accept that I am breaking the law and as
such deserved to be punished. If penalising speeding motorists is a means to fund the force then thats fine by me as long as this does not detract
from placing focus on other areas of concern.
Regards Mick
camera enforcement has its place, and catches all believe me. Quite what it does for road safety I am not certain, as with a lot of police realted
tasks it is hard to measure. The only easy way to measure the task is to count how many drivers they prosecute, this mentality was applied to police
officers in the early 90s.
Cops who arrested the most were the best in the eyes of the bean counters, while those who didnt play the numbers game were seen to be bad apples.
How do you measure my uniform presence in a street ? Simply you cannot...Did your Granny feel safe because I was there and chatted with her for ten
minutes about rhubarb, or on the other side of the coin because on Tuesday I didnt arrest anyone I am letting the team down with the performance
indicators.
So speed cameras are hated yes, I am one of their biggest critics, because like most things related to policing they are brought in to replace Cops
wandering about doing what they do, not their to support their function, its about doing it on the cheap.
In my view camera enforcement is more about acheiving an easy performance indicator target than revenue income.
sadly- the sarcastic (some of them)much hated traffic officer, is the person who will coach/bollick & prosecute motorists who choose to step
outside the line, not the camera partnership, cso, hato, vosa, la la la .....
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mookaloid
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| posted on 8/3/11 at 05:27 PM |
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That really worries me - how can we expect the police to stay honest, protect us from the bad guys and keep us safe if we don't pay them enough
to live?
edit - speeling correction
[Edited on 8/3/11 by mookaloid]
"That thing you're thinking - it wont be that."
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Mix
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| posted on 8/3/11 at 05:34 PM |
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Hi
Maybe I'm old fashioned - but I feel the benefit of the 'Bobby on the beat' is sadly underestimated these days.
Regards Mick
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scootz
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| posted on 8/3/11 at 05:41 PM |
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quote:
Originally posted by mookaloid
That really worries me - how can we expect the police to stay honest, protect us from the bad guys and keep us safe if we don't pay them enough
to live?
Point worth noting... the countries with the worst police recruits and highest corruption levels are those who pay poorly!
I appreciate that the country needs to make cuts and there are undoubtedly ways that Police budgets could be reduced, but IMHO, lowering Police wages
will be disastrous!
It's Evolution Baby!
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T66
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| posted on 8/3/11 at 05:47 PM |
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quote:
Originally posted by Mix
Hi
Maybe I'm old fashioned - but I feel the benefit of the 'Bobby on the beat' is sadly underestimated these days.
Regards Mick
In the late 60s the Police lost a lot of contact with the public, this came about because of efficiency, Cops could cover bigger areas more
efficiently in a "Panda"
Then the police realised in the 80s they had lost touch with the public, so brought back cops patrolling on foot.
And gradually through the 90s the footman (or woman) has become a rare sight, as much to do with cops not wanting to walk while they are at work, as
the job wanting them to gather up and wade through the reams of calls recieved each day.
I am old school, and cannot sing highly enough the work of a motivated Cop operating on foot in his/her patch.
Patrolling skills now tend to mean where you drive your car and how, as opposed to where to go lurking on foot at 3am to catch the lurkers....I was
shown the way by old time cops, and believe me they were sneaky, a craft much sidelined.
Like I said previously, how do you measure the impact on a street after I have walked down it, spoke to the kids playing footy, chatted about rhubarb
with Doris and bollicked the dross for something they have irritated me about.
You cannot ! So what you do is measure the easy stuff - arrests, intel submissions, summons, tickets etc.
A Cop on foot is accessible, should be approachable and better still a common face in the area.
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Mix
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| posted on 8/3/11 at 05:53 PM |
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Hi
We are singing from the same song sheet - the most accurate measure of police efficiency should be the lack of crime, ie prevention is better than
cure not the ability to catch the perpretator after the fact.
regards Mick
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AndyW
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| posted on 8/3/11 at 06:02 PM |
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sorry deleted my own post as too many people will over react
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T66
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| posted on 8/3/11 at 06:04 PM |
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quote:
Originally posted by AndyW
sorry deleted my own post as too many people will over react
??
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Rod Ends
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| posted on 8/3/11 at 06:06 PM |
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quote:
Once the police forces of this country could have relied on fierce public support
against cuts in their funds and manpower. Now I think they will get very little.
For years I have said they should sell the helicopters and fast cars and get back on foot.
I said they should reopen police stations and man them.
I said they should remember that the middle classes are their friends.
And almost all I heard in return was moaning that I was anti-police and unfair to a fine body of men.
Piffle
www.dailymail.co.uk/debate/article-1313247/PETER-HITCHENS-Will-turn-dust-ashes-just-like-Soviet-roubles.html
quote:
When I wrote about the just nature of the police's pay demand, I had little sympathy from readers.
The tone of the complaints was consistent. They are good at catching errant drivers,
but less good at burglaries and muggings.
They are invisible on our unsafe streets. When encountering the public, many are charmless, even rude.
They enforce not the law, but political correctness.
In short, the law-abiding public regard them as not on their side.
www.telegraph.co.uk/comment/columnists/simonheffer/3554319/Why-majority-see-the-police-as-their-enemy.html
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mcerd1
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| posted on 8/3/11 at 06:08 PM |
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I know quite a few guys that have joined up in the last few years, so I'm hearing alot about this just now...
one of my best mates just got his foot in the door before they stopped recruting all together up here
but he only joined the force properly as his previous job was as a civilian custody officer in the police cells and he couldn't get transfered
out of it because no one else wanted the job - after 2 - 3 years he'd had enough of being assulted, cut, spat at by every scumbag that was
dragged throught the doors (and having to get tested for HIV, hepatitis etc. every other month) it wasn't much fun 
in the end it was so bad he took an 8k/year pay cut just to get out  (and he loves working for the police in general)
all I can say is - at the end of the day he's getting a better deal than his brother in the marines
[Edited on 8/3/2011 by mcerd1]
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T66
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| posted on 8/3/11 at 06:11 PM |
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And the BBC have just said....
If a police officer works on a Sunday, he receives double time.....
Not true, if its my rostered day at work I get the standard hourly rate.
If my Sunday rest day is cancelled with less than 5 days notice I get double time.
If my Sunday rest day is cancelled with between 5-14 days notice I get time and a half
If my Sunday rest day is cancelled with more than 30 days notice I get my rest day re-rostered.
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designer
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| posted on 8/3/11 at 06:15 PM |
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Where was all this talk when the engineers, ship workers, mill workers and coal miners were taking pay freezes, pay cuts and job losses at the
minimum redundancy payments?
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T66
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| posted on 8/3/11 at 06:18 PM |
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quote:
Originally posted by Rod Ends
quote:
Once the police forces of this country could have relied on fierce public support
against cuts in their funds and manpower. Now I think they will get very little.
For years I have said they should sell the helicopters and fast cars and get back on foot.
I said they should reopen police stations and man them.
I said they should remember that the middle classes are their friends.
And almost all I heard in return was moaning that I was anti-police and unfair to a fine body of men.
Piffle
www.dailymail.co.uk/debate/article-1313247/PETER-HITCHENS-Will-turn-dust-ashes-just-like-Soviet-roubles.html
quote:
When I wrote about the just nature of the police's pay demand, I had little sympathy from readers.
The tone of the complaints was consistent. They are good at catching errant drivers,
but less good at burglaries and muggings.
They are invisible on our unsafe streets. When encountering the public, many are charmless, even rude.
They enforce not the law, but political correctness.
In short, the law-abiding public regard them as not on their side.
www.telegraph.co.uk/comment/columnists/simonheffer/3554319/Why-majority-see-the-police-as-their-enemy.html
I wont reply to a quote from the daily Mail....
The telegraph - I agree completely
Labour party driven performance indicators, and cops with all discretion stripped from them. I refer to my earlier posts, good cops are the ones who
arrest the most, ticket the most, summons the most....
rudeness has no place, arrogance either.
Like most corporations we employ a cross section of society, and as such have both good and bad amongst our fold.
Fast cars and helicopter, dogs and horses and black guns are all Policing tools, all are required to support the frontline uniform officer in his or
her role of protecting the public.
I policed Tyneside in the late 80s and fast cars, guns and helicopters were definitely needed !! Just as much as the much hated much maligned uniform
cop...
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macc man
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| posted on 8/3/11 at 06:20 PM |
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Not wishing to make light of police woes but many nurses face similar daily abuse from the public and are poorly paid for the work they do. If my wife
works extra hours she does not get paid but has time owed to her. Trouble is being short staffed
she often never gets the time back. We all have to accept that the country is screwed and just get on with life.
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ali f27
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| posted on 8/3/11 at 06:48 PM |
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Hi guys i sympathse with anybody whos having a hard time as many are in every industry but have to say public sympathy for offices will be limeted not
thier fault but if you get robbed no police as thier bosses have them all out trying to catch somebody on a mobile etc cutting numbers wont make any
difference to use in rural areas we have had no police presance for 20 years saying that still in your corner lads
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ali f27
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| posted on 8/3/11 at 06:51 PM |
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Ps to be fair i thing its just a maggie clone having his own back
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richardh
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| posted on 8/3/11 at 07:08 PM |
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these cuts are too deep and far too fast.
i agree with the first post wholehartedly. i left after 18 months for much th same reasons back in mid 1990's
Time for a change!
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norfolkluego
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| posted on 8/3/11 at 07:14 PM |
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quote:
Originally posted by scootz
Amen Ivan!
Each government from the early-90's forward has shafted the Police.
I think they've shafted everbody EXCEPT mindless thugs, the workshy, bogus assylum seekers, would be terrorists living on benefits, Health and
Safety Nazis, the 'Green' Brigade, serial complainers, opponents of free speech, twats who abuse our Armed Forces, mums with 28 kids by 28
fathers, you name it, if you don't deserve it you'll get it, if you do you won't
In reply to the OP, the Goverment is reacting in exactly the same way as any big organisation when money is tight, redundancies, pay freeze/cuts,
taking pension rights etc. They always see their employees as the problem, never the way the bloody place is run
[Edited on 8/3/11 by norfolkluego]
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