iv posted about this before but really in need of some more advice before I start. im starting to turbo a gsxr 1000 k1 (hoping to achieve 7-9psi)

I have :2mm cometic head gasket
headers
t25 turbo
sytec fuel pressure regulator, variable pressure for turbo systems
external wastegate
bosch 500 fuel pump
intercooler - pipework etc
turbo smart bleed valve

my main question is will a power commander be good enough on its own to run it. or do you need the multi hub and 3 bar map sensor?

cheers for your time

I ran my zx10turbo on 9psi with power commander and was fine,

Decent intercooler and a begi fuel pressure reg sorted not probs,

Could as you say go with more to advance rimming etc, but mine ran fine and was at controlled the AFR no probs

so is the std map sensor up to the job? or is it best to use the multi hub and 3bar map sensor.. if this is the case and its best to use the hub and map sensor. do you buy the sensor and harness from dyno jet. (and does it direct replace the oem map sensor) im abit confused with the 3bar map sensor where it goes, direct replacement etc plug into std loom or the multi hub

sorry about all the questions

Why would you need a 3bar sensor, that's getting on for 45psi ?

A standard sensor will work with positive pressure for up to around 1 bar, 15psi without falling apart.

im only going on what people have told me, iv emailed holeshot racing and they say it needs a 3 bar map sensor

so will the turbo set up work with just a power commander 3(fpr etc) and no need for the muli hub? iv read that much today my head as gone

In short yes as mine did with std map sensor, also just a urbo smart bleed and as said ran 9psi, and 262 bhp,

This was as said a std power commander no hub,

Depending on your turbo and waste gate you may not even get to 6 psi as they spool up so quick the lowest boost I cold get was 9psi

thank you for your replies I no where im at now I just didn't want to do everything turn up at a rr day for them to say we cnt set it up as you have not done/got this etc etc

was going to use a t25-48/60ar as they are oil feed only so minimum plumbing in.

thanks again

3bar sensor is absolute pressure - so would be good for 2 bar boost above 1bar atmospheric.

So could you get away with a 2bar sensor if running less than 1bar. I think this is what I bought (but my BEC turbo (or SC) build hasn't started). The hub and map sensor add on isn't that expensive and I think it's a better way of doing it as you have more control but I haven't done it yet so my advice is somewhat devalued!

I'd imagine it's best to have a bit of headroom above your target boost otherwise the sensor will max out?

[Edited on 17/10/13 by hobbsy]

turbo side of things is the garrett t25 up to the job? I want it to operate through out the rev range and not to start dying near higher rpm's (also with the t25 its only oil cooled) they do a t25 .48ar and a t25 .60ar I think

cheers

The Mitubishi TD04HL-16T (from memory?) the sort of thing common on Volvo T5's etc are worth a look also.

cheers mate just thought it would be easier with a t25 as there only oil cooled

I might be wrong but I think you can block off the water cooling if you don't want it? Just need to be more careful with cooling down, but even then the main benefit would be if the water (and rad fan) continues to run after the engine switches off. I know a clever Dutchman who did exactly that on his 1.8T Libra

EDIT, maybe you do need the water, depending on the type of bearing, see here:

http://www.gcg.com.au/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=116:turbo-stuff&catid=41:turbo-stuff&Itemid=99

I've certainly seen the block off done before, but do your research!

[Edited on 17/10/13 by hobbsy]

I didn't even block off the water ports on my TD04, just leave them open.

very interesting thread, it may be worth starting a sticky on how to turbo a bike engine both for carb and efi setups.

so you can use a td04 16t and just block/leave the water holes open ? is it as easy as that

That's what I did, granted my turbo isn't under a bonnet and it is constant airflow so that helps keep temps down. But yeah, plenty of turbos don't use water cooling and they work fine.

Dave

right I now have a k4 gsxr 1000 and have most the bits to complete the turbo conversion (running a td04 16t ) I think im going to drop a set of forged pstons/rods in and would like to run 15 psi, my question is will the stock map sensor be ok? if not do you just buy a random 2 bar map sensor off ebay and connect it where the orig 1 is (with std loom)

thanks

Will your clutch and gearbox survive, 15psi will be a hefty dose of torque.

Using a non OE map sensor should only cause a problem if you are swapping maps with other people, as long as you get it rolling roaded I cannot see an issue with a generic sensor although for an extra £50 for the right item I would not scrimp myself. Last thing you want is a massive lean out blowing a hole in a piston.

Why are you looking at an air bleed, design for the power.

[Edited on 24/11/14 by mark chandler]

was going to look into a lockup clutch as I heard this is what some people do. and car would only be for road use with the odd blast out

so the std map sensor will be good for 15 psi. the car will be roaling roaded before I even drive it, and the plan was just to leave it set the way it was tuned. what do u mean by air bleed for power

You have a turbo smart bleed valve noted at the top, you use an air bleed to fool the waste gate into thinking the pressure is less than true so keeps the wastegate closed to provide higher boost, I would set up for 15psi, lose the air bleed and have a decent BOV so when you shut down it dumps the excess air quickly.

15psi is just over 1bar so as long as you do not spike the boost which should be taken care of by the BOV just use the MAP sensor you have.

ok thanks

2bar map sensor is good for 1bar of boost 14.7psi
3bar map sensor is good for slightly more than 2bar, around 29.7psi

quote:

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Originally posted by mark chandler
....I would set up for 15psi, lose the air bleed and have a decent BOV so when you shut down it dumps the excess air quickly.

15psi is just over 1bar so as long as you do not spike the boost which should be taken care of by the BOV just use the MAP sensor you have.

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just bought a td04 16t turbo what bhp do I exspect at say 9psi on a gsxr 1000. and does anyone know when the turbo is likely to kick in and out rpm's

thanks

I would expect around an additional 60-80bhp from 9psi, depends on the engine though.

I have a 13t turbo which has a little bit smaller compressor but I think it has the same exhaust housing as the 16t, Power from the turbo comes in at 6k rpm on my 900cc engine, So I would say around 5-6k rpm would be where the turbo would come in on your engine.

do you know roughly when it will fall off boost
thanks

I simply used a 3 bar sensor and a piggyback hub on the PCIII.

Worked extremely well, cost effective, reliable.

quote:

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Originally posted by jlayton
do you know roughly when it will fall off boost
thanks

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sorry, I mean if the turbo spools up at 5-6k would if stay on boost all the way to the end of the rev range or die off about 9-10k etc
cheers

if I use the multi hub and map sensor with input harness do I still need a ignition module as I have read you can adjust the timing with the multi hub and input harness is this right.

thanks

Sounds like a good project, what sort of power do you think you can achieve?