Guinness
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| posted on 20/8/09 at 08:12 AM |
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BEC to CEC Conversion Costs!
I know, I know!
But I need to know what my options are.
So, for example I decided to bin the whole BEC thing and convert to a CEC, what order of costs am I looking at?? (I'm ignoring anything Pinto /
x-flow related at this stage!)
Cheapest seems to be Zetec:-
Engine £200, Gearbox £50, Clutch £50?
Then I'd need a new exhaust £300, plus a set of throttle bodies £50 plus megasquirt £120, plus a fuel pump? Plus a new propshaft / modify my
current one. So an all up cost of about £800-900?
What other CEC options are there that produce decent reliable power?
Mike
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Steve Hignett
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| posted on 20/8/09 at 08:14 AM |
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quote:
Originally posted by Guinness
Cheapest seems to be Zetec:-
Engine £200, Gearbox £50, Clutch £50?
Then I'd need a new exhaust £300, plus a set of throttle bodies £50 plus megasquirt £120, plus a fuel pump? Plus a new propshaft / modify my
current one. So an all up cost of about £800-900?
SHAME = £Priceless.................
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cd.thomson
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| posted on 20/8/09 at 08:15 AM |
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XE, similar costs all round but factor in another £250-300 to get it up to a type 9 with a properly sorted sump.
looking at £300 worth of more power though 
Craig
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02GF74
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| posted on 20/8/09 at 08:24 AM |
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sounds about right but there'll be a couple hundred at least for little sundries like hoses, clips, engine mounts etc.
To maqke you feel not so bad, without adding it qall up as I think I will cry, I probably spent close to tht much on my 1300 -> 1600 crossflow
conversion!! 
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r1_pete
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| posted on 20/8/09 at 08:27 AM |
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^^
Can you really get MS for £120? where?
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jambojeef
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| posted on 20/8/09 at 08:28 AM |
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Im considering it too dude!
Im possibly going down the volvo t5 route over the winter - we'll see...
I think the costs would add up to more than those of a zetec but the tuning potential should be favourable.
I just wonder if we'd regret the extra weight in the front - on the roads round here the lightweight is what it makes all the difference of
course.
BMW straight six? Dunno if that would fit in an indy but alloy block and mega reliable in my experience (if you stay away from the puddles!)
Say a 2.8i engine and box? You could get a whole 328i for less than a grand and you've got all the donor bits you need?
Nice soundtrack - leccys will be a pain but you could 'squrt it....?
Wonder if you could get loads more power with a set of bike ITBs and megasquirt?
Forgot to say - have you been in a car with a type 9 box? The only time I have was in my old man's granada with a 2.0 litre pinto in it and the
shift was pretty slow - based on that narrow experience Id try to stay away from type 9s after you've been shifting sequentially for 3 years!
Geoff
[Edited on 20/8/09 by jambojeef]
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sonic
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| posted on 20/8/09 at 08:43 AM |
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Hi Guy's
Just to through a spanner in the works but your chassis may not be right!
CEC chassis has a bigger tranny tunnel for the gearbox etc were as a BEC one doesnt need it.
I think it is easier to convert a CEC to a BEC than the other way round.
I may be wrong though!
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speedyxjs
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| posted on 20/8/09 at 09:12 AM |
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quote:
Originally posted by r1_pete
^^
Can you really get MS for £120? where?
Exchange rate has improved. I looked the other day and it is now 120 quid but then need to add improt tax, delivery etc
How long can i resist the temptation to drop a V8 in?
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adithorp
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| posted on 20/8/09 at 09:31 AM |
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It'll cost you your... SELF RESPECT!!!
"A witty saying proves nothing" Voltaire
http://jpsc.org.uk/forum/
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mangogrooveworkshop
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| posted on 20/8/09 at 10:00 AM |
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My idea is to just swop a bec for the cec car of your choice. And save your self all the grief
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mangogrooveworkshop
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| posted on 20/8/09 at 10:04 AM |
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Oh my reasons for going CEC is one I still want a licence at the end of the year and we are road tripping to Sweden, Rome and Montecarlo next
year......
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Guinness
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| posted on 20/8/09 at 10:08 AM |
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Steve / Adithorp
I have no shame, nor self respect!  
I think the majority of my problems have come from 3 main issues:-
1. The general age of the engines I'm using. They have all been at least 18 years old.
2. The source of the engines. Perhaps I'm too trusting, but some of the engines I've bought off ebay, whilst cheap have already had
"issues"  I bought one that had already lived a hard life in a grasser (found grass in the sump!???), one from a (at the time)
widely used and respected source of BEC engines, which had no 2nd gear etc etc.
3. The general lack of engineering ability / understanding / bodgeability of the idiot who built the car in the first place (me! )
The way I look at it, is I have done a little over 6,000 miles in the Indy in 3 1/2 years it's been finished.
If I decide to stay with the BEC ethos, a grand, or thereabouts will buy me a fairly modern / recent fi bike engine kit which I can fit and carry on
driving / tracking as I have done.
That same grand would allow me to convert to a CEC. Whether that would be as fast, more reliable, more regularly used, is open to debate.
Mike
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andy350z
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| posted on 20/8/09 at 10:10 AM |
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I've just upgraded from pinto to zetec
£700 brand new 2.0 blacktop
£370 raceline sump
£70 engine mounts
£180 lightened fly wheel
£50 clutch
£100 starter motor
£60 alternator
£40 alternator bracket
£110 inlet manifold for old carbs
£170 exhaust header
£470 omex ecu
£50 water rail and hoses
£75 arp con rod bolts
soon adds up!
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Guinness
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| posted on 20/8/09 at 10:30 AM |
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quote:
Originally posted by andy350z
I've just upgraded from pinto to zetec
£700 brand new 2.0 blacktop
£370 raceline sump
£70 engine mounts
£180 lightened fly wheel
£50 clutch
£100 starter motor
£60 alternator
£40 alternator bracket
£110 inlet manifold for old carbs
£170 exhaust header
£470 omex ecu
£50 water rail and hoses
£75 arp con rod bolts
soon adds up!
You're not kidding! That's nearly two and a half grand! I could get a busa for that!
Mike
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cd.thomson
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| posted on 20/8/09 at 10:36 AM |
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quote:
Originally posted by andy350z
I've just upgraded from pinto to zetec
£700 brand new 2.0 blacktop - £200 for quality XE/Zetec
£370 raceline sump - £50 DIY
£70 engine mounts - £10 do them yourself
£180 lightened fly wheel - £0
£50 clutch - £50
£100 starter motor - £0
£60 alternator - £0
£40 alternator bracket - £0
£110 inlet manifold for old carbs - £50 DIY
£170 exhaust header
£470 omex ecu - £120 DIY MS
£50 water rail and hoses - £0
£75 arp con rod bolts - £0
soon adds up!
everythings as expensive as you make it.
Craig
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Mr Whippy
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| posted on 20/8/09 at 10:45 AM |
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^ exactly
I get the distinct impression very few of you have ever been to a scrap yard
my local one charges £50 per engine and thats everything you take with it. There's cars in there that look almost new. Why buy brand new
everything for a car you hardly use?
[Edited on 20/8/09 by Mr Whippy]
Fame is when your old car is plastered all over the internet
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coozer
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| posted on 20/8/09 at 11:03 AM |
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Mike, since you have passed SVA you can get a 2L zetec for well under £100. 99p off the bay or £40~£50 from the scrappy.
You already have the carbs and filter off the ZZR so make an inlet manifold (free) and use Megajolt. £100.
A type 9, say £50 and a new prop. £110. Up to ASS for a manifold £350.
Then just hard work and jobs a good un. Tunnel is standard MK so wide enough for a type 9 I suspect.
Apart from the prop and manifold the rest can be had cheaper if you (and me) look hard enough.
Or spend the grand turboing the ZZR
Good luck,
Steve
1972 V8 Jago
1980 Z750
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RK
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| posted on 20/8/09 at 01:50 PM |
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OK, I'm not saying its the best option, but if you can get JDM engines, my Nissan CA18DET did 173 HP when new, and probably will do around 190
considering the 2 1/2 " exhaust and a filter for an intake to the turbo.
Yes, it does take a lot of room in the engine bay, but I got it for about 600 of your pounds, including the transmission, with 30 K kilometers on it.
Most HP available for the least money in my research.
Zetec is more common though, and you can get things answered more readily if you have questions. For the Nissan, you have to frequent the Aussie
tuner sites for engine info.
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whitestu
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| posted on 20/8/09 at 02:25 PM |
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Just as a comparison my costs are:
£700 brand new 2.0 blacktop: £55 for 60k 2.0 Blacktop.
£370 raceline sump: Chopped blacktop sump for about £5
£70 engine mounts: Made own - £15
£180 lightened fly wheel: Used 1.8 CVH flywheel - [really light] £25
£50 clutch: Same
£100 starter motor: Came with CVH engine for free
£60 alternator: £30 for new Denso tractor alternator
£40 alternator bracket: Made own - £5
£110 inlet manifold for old carbs: Carb rubbers and ali plate - £25
£170 exhaust header :2nd hand CVH exhaust £120
£470 omex ecu: Megajolt & edis £110
£50 water rail and hoses: Same
£75 arp con rod bolts: didn't bother [not spending more than cost of engine on conrod bolts - has been past 8k rpm and hasn't blown up
yet!!].
Total £490.
Stu
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Andy D
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| posted on 20/8/09 at 02:55 PM |
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quote:
Originally posted by Guinness
I know, I know!
But I need to know what my options are.
So, for example I decided to bin the whole BEC thing and convert to a CEC, what order of costs am I looking at?? (I'm ignoring anything
Pinto / x-flow related at this stage!)
Cheapest seems to be Zetec:-
Engine £200, Gearbox £50, Clutch £50?
Then I'd need a new exhaust £300, plus a set of throttle bodies £50 plus megasquirt £120, plus a fuel pump? Plus a new propshaft / modify my
current one. So an all up cost of about £800-900?
What other CEC options are there that produce decent reliable power?
Mike
I've been alienated on page one! 
How about seeing if anyone wants to do a swap for a similar car engined Indy? ...with perhaps a little cash either way depending on details. 
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clairetoo
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| posted on 20/8/09 at 04:06 PM |
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When I went from a crossflow to a V6 -
£700 brand new 2.0 blacktop - V6 off ebay , £100
£370 raceline sump - chopped original steel sump , free
£70 engine mounts - made my own - free
£180 lightened fly wheel - home made ally , £50 for the ally
£50 clutch - £35 from a local clutch place
£100 starter motor - 99p off ebay
£60 alternator - same
£40 alternator bracket - home made - free
£110 inlet manifold for old carbs - home made adapter's for bike tb's - £10 for the ally
£170 exhaust header - standard manifolds , £50 for two stainless silencers at Newark show
£470 omex ecu - £310 megasquirt / edis / Lc1
£50 water rail and hoses - silicone bends off ebay , £110
£75 arp con rod bolts - no need
Plus.....2 sets of tb's - ebay , £65
Custom plug lead set - £125
Mx5 gearbox - ebay , £40
Larger radiator - Newark show , £15
Allty for adapter plate - ebay , £20
Mazda and Ford propshafts to make a suitable replacement - ebay , £25
Corsa slave cylinder and willwood master cylinder - ebay , £47
Total - £953
Result - a 200bhp , 8000 rpm screamer that is as docile as a production car at town speeds
Its cuz I is blond , innit
Claire xx
Will weld for food......
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Guinness
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| posted on 20/8/09 at 04:35 PM |
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Was waiting for your reply Claire!
Trouble is I can't weld and don't have a machine shop! So I'd be adding quite a bit to those costs.
Mike
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JimSpencer
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| posted on 20/8/09 at 04:37 PM |
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Hi
Without joining in the debate..
Assuming you put a type 9 in it, then add £30ish on for a quaife gear lever kit - it's worth every single penny every time you change gear,
truly HUGE difference
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hughpinder
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| posted on 20/8/09 at 04:38 PM |
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Dont forget you are putting more weight in the front of the car, so you may need new springs on those shockers!
Regards
Hugh
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coozer
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| posted on 20/8/09 at 04:40 PM |
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I reckon all you need to weld is 2 engine mounts and maybe 1 gearbox mount. I can help you out with that no problem
1972 V8 Jago
1980 Z750
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