jlayton
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| posted on 16/10/13 at 06:53 PM |
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bec turbo question's
iv posted about this before but really in need of some more advice before I start. im starting to turbo a gsxr 1000 k1 (hoping to achieve 7-9psi)
I have :2mm cometic head gasket
headers
t25 turbo
sytec fuel pressure regulator, variable pressure for turbo systems
external wastegate
bosch 500 fuel pump
intercooler - pipework etc
turbo smart bleed valve
my main question is will a power commander be good enough on its own to run it. or do you need the multi hub and 3 bar map sensor?
cheers for your time
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INDY BIRD
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| posted on 16/10/13 at 07:46 PM |
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I ran my zx10turbo on 9psi with power commander and was fine,
Decent intercooler and a begi fuel pressure reg sorted not probs,
Could as you say go with more to advance rimming etc, but mine ran fine and was at controlled the AFR no probs
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jlayton
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| posted on 16/10/13 at 07:59 PM |
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so is the std map sensor up to the job? or is it best to use the multi hub and 3bar map sensor.. if this is the case and its best to use the hub and
map sensor. do you buy the sensor and harness from dyno jet. (and does it direct replace the oem map sensor) im abit confused with the 3bar map sensor
where it goes, direct replacement etc plug into std loom or the multi hub 
sorry about all the questions
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mark chandler
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| posted on 16/10/13 at 08:16 PM |
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Why would you need a 3bar sensor, that's getting on for 45psi ?
A standard sensor will work with positive pressure for up to around 1 bar, 15psi without falling apart.
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jlayton
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| posted on 16/10/13 at 08:24 PM |
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im only going on what people have told me, iv emailed holeshot racing and they say it needs a 3 bar map sensor
so will the turbo set up work with just a power commander 3(fpr etc) and no need for the muli hub? iv read that much today my head as gone
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INDY BIRD
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| posted on 16/10/13 at 08:47 PM |
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In short yes as mine did with std map sensor, also just a urbo smart bleed and as said ran 9psi, and 262 bhp,
This was as said a std power commander no hub,
Depending on your turbo and waste gate you may not even get to 6 psi as they spool up so quick the lowest boost I cold get was 9psi
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jlayton
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| posted on 16/10/13 at 08:51 PM |
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thank you for your replies I no where im at now  I just didn't want to do everything turn up at a rr day for them to say we cnt set it up as
you have not done/got this etc etc
was going to use a t25-48/60ar as they are oil feed only so minimum plumbing in.
thanks again
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hobbsy
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| posted on 17/10/13 at 12:17 AM |
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3bar sensor is absolute pressure - so would be good for 2 bar boost above 1bar atmospheric.
So could you get away with a 2bar sensor if running less than 1bar. I think this is what I bought (but my BEC turbo (or SC) build hasn't
started). The hub and map sensor add on isn't that expensive and I think it's a better way of doing it as you have more control but I
haven't done it yet so my advice is somewhat devalued!
I'd imagine it's best to have a bit of headroom above your target boost otherwise the sensor will max out?
[Edited on 17/10/13 by hobbsy]
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jlayton
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| posted on 17/10/13 at 07:51 PM |
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turbo side of things is the garrett t25 up to the job? I want it to operate through out the rev range and not to start dying near higher rpm's
(also with the t25 its only oil cooled) they do a t25 .48ar and a t25 .60ar I think
cheers
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hobbsy
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| posted on 17/10/13 at 08:06 PM |
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The Mitubishi TD04HL-16T (from memory?) the sort of thing common on Volvo T5's etc are worth a look also.
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jlayton
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| posted on 17/10/13 at 08:09 PM |
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cheers mate just thought it would be easier with a t25 as there only oil cooled
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hobbsy
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| posted on 17/10/13 at 08:15 PM |
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I might be wrong but I think you can block off the water cooling if you don't want it? Just need to be more careful with cooling down, but even
then the main benefit would be if the water (and rad fan) continues to run after the engine switches off. I know a clever Dutchman who did exactly
that on his 1.8T Libra
EDIT, maybe you do need the water, depending on the type of bearing, see here:
http://www.gcg.com.au/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=116:turbo-stuff&catid=41:turbo-stuff&Itemid=99
I've certainly seen the block off done before, but do your research!
[Edited on 17/10/13 by hobbsy]
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dave_424
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| posted on 17/10/13 at 10:14 PM |
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I didn't even block off the water ports on my TD04, just leave them open.
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Autoflock Motorsport
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| posted on 18/10/13 at 07:31 AM |
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very interesting thread, it may be worth starting a sticky on how to turbo a bike engine both for carb and efi setups.
Kind regards
Raj
http://www.locostbuilders.co.uk/forum/23/viewthread.php?tid=183445
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jlayton
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| posted on 18/10/13 at 09:57 AM |
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so you can use a td04 16t and just block/leave the water holes open ? is it as easy as that
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dave_424
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| posted on 18/10/13 at 10:03 AM |
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That's what I did, granted my turbo isn't under a bonnet and it is constant airflow so that helps keep temps down. But yeah, plenty of
turbos don't use water cooling and they work fine.
Dave
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jlayton
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| posted on 24/11/14 at 06:21 PM |
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right I now have a k4 gsxr 1000 and have most the bits to complete the turbo conversion (running a td04 16t ) I think im going to drop a set of forged
pstons/rods in and would like to run 15 psi, my question is will the stock map sensor be ok? if not do you just buy a random 2 bar map sensor off ebay
and connect it where the orig 1 is (with std loom)
thanks
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mark chandler
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| posted on 24/11/14 at 07:51 PM |
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Will your clutch and gearbox survive, 15psi will be a hefty dose of torque.
Using a non OE map sensor should only cause a problem if you are swapping maps with other people, as long as you get it rolling roaded I cannot see an
issue with a generic sensor although for an extra £50 for the right item I would not scrimp myself. Last thing you want is a massive lean out blowing
a hole in a piston.
Why are you looking at an air bleed, design for the power.
[Edited on 24/11/14 by mark chandler]
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jlayton
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| posted on 24/11/14 at 07:57 PM |
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was going to look into a lockup clutch as I heard this is what some people do. and car would only be for road use with the odd blast out
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jlayton
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| posted on 24/11/14 at 08:02 PM |
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so the std map sensor will be good for 15 psi. the car will be roaling roaded before I even drive it, and the plan was just to leave it set the way it
was tuned. what do u mean by air bleed for power
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mark chandler
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| posted on 24/11/14 at 08:16 PM |
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You have a turbo smart bleed valve noted at the top, you use an air bleed to fool the waste gate into thinking the pressure is less than true so keeps
the wastegate closed to provide higher boost, I would set up for 15psi, lose the air bleed and have a decent BOV so when you shut down it dumps the
excess air quickly.
15psi is just over 1bar so as long as you do not spike the boost which should be taken care of by the BOV just use the MAP sensor you have.
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jlayton
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| posted on 24/11/14 at 08:21 PM |
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ok thanks
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gaz_gaz
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| posted on 24/11/14 at 10:25 PM |
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2bar map sensor is good for 1bar of boost 14.7psi
3bar map sensor is good for slightly more than 2bar, around 29.7psi
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Davey D
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| posted on 25/11/14 at 06:32 AM |
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quote:
Originally posted by mark chandler
....I would set up for 15psi, lose the air bleed and have a decent BOV so when you shut down it dumps the excess air quickly.
15psi is just over 1bar so as long as you do not spike the boost which should be taken care of by the BOV just use the MAP sensor you have.
A bov doesn't stop boost spike. Boost spike is caused by your actuator taking too long to react to the pressure before opening
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jlayton
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| posted on 26/11/14 at 02:03 PM |
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just bought a td04 16t turbo what bhp do I exspect at say 9psi on a gsxr 1000. and does anyone know when the turbo is likely to kick in and out
rpm's
thanks
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