JamesyCottony
|
| posted on 30/9/15 at 09:52 AM |
|
|
Cooling
Right I'm trying to sort out the radiator and the Haynes manual is next to no help as it doesn't show all the components. I don't
need the heater radiator as I'm not having a heater, so does this diagram look correct?
Top View: (Top rad hose to top of pump, ONE thing the Haynes manual shows!!)
What are these 2 pipes for on the pump?
Bottom of pump to bottom of rad??
So where does the reservoir go? Diagram right or do both pipes of RES go to bottom or top pipe and does RES have to be above pipe its attached to
(gravity purposes)?
THANKS!! 
|
|
|
|
|
Slater
|
| posted on 30/9/15 at 10:54 AM |
|
|
This is what I did with my Zetec
[img]
 
Cooling Diagram
[/img]
Why do they call Port Harcourt "The Garden City"?...... Becauase they can't spell Stramash.
|
|
|
cliftyhanger
|
| posted on 30/9/15 at 10:56 AM |
|
|
Top connection is actually (as in pics) to the thermostat housing. And correct. The rad bottom hose goes to the pump, again correct.
The header tank top connector (usually small, 8-10mm) goes into the thermostat housing. The larger (16-19mm) connector on the header tank is Teed off
the bottom rad hose.
The pump sucks water from the rad, so sucks some water from the header, which in turn sucks water (and any trapped air) from the thermostat housing.
|
|
|
JamesyCottony
|
| posted on 30/9/15 at 11:45 AM |
|
|
Like So?  sorry for confusing diagram!!
|
|
|
JamesyCottony
|
| posted on 30/9/15 at 11:52 AM |
|
|
Sorry wrong, adjusted:
|
|
|
adithorp
|
| posted on 30/9/15 at 12:04 PM |
|
|
First off... the first picture of the pump is actually the thermostat housingg ( just helps avoid confusion if we're all talking about the same
thing to use the same names)
Thermostat big outlet goes to rad top.
W/pump big connection goes to rad bottom.
Thermostat small connection goes to bottle top.
Now the tricky bit... the 2 other medium size connections (on pump+stat) are heater hoses (from memory) Now you could...
(A) block the one on the thermostat and use the other to connect your bottle bottom pipe to.
(B) you cold connect them togther as a by-pass (so water can circulate when the stat is closed) and either have your bottle T'd into that or
into the bottom hose.
Bottle location is best so the thermostat bleed pipe slopes up to it (try and avoid dips) and the water level in the bottle is higher than the
'stat top... or at least level. It is possible to have it lower but it gets complicated requiring bleed valves etc .
"A witty saying proves nothing" Voltaire
http://jpsc.org.uk/forum/
|
|
|
Mr Whippy
|
| posted on 30/9/15 at 12:06 PM |
|
|
you should send these diagrams to Haynes for inclusion in the manual
All you do is put a hose across the two pipes that went to the heater matrix to bypass it which look like the two middles size fittings, one on the
thermostat housing and one on the water pump outlet. The very small one should go to your reservoir which needs to be a single feed pressurised
type.
this should be ok
you can tell I have been drinking too much coffee with my very wobbly lines!
[Edited on 30/9/15 by Mr Whippy]
|
|
|
JamesyCottony
|
| posted on 30/9/15 at 12:14 PM |
|
|
quote:
Originally posted by Mr Whippy
you should send these diagrams to Haynes for inclusion in the manual
All you do is put a hose across the two pipes that went to the heater matrix to bypass it which look like the two middles size fittings, one on the
thermostat housing and one on the water pump outlet. The very small one should go to your reservoir which needs to be a single feed pressurised
type.
this should be ok
you can tell I have been drinking too much coffee with my very wobbly lines!
[Edited on 30/9/15 by Mr Whippy]
Mr Whippy that top pipe on the bottom of the pump is Teed/welded off
[Edited on 30/9/15 by JamesyCottony]
|
|
|
adithorp
|
| posted on 30/9/15 at 01:24 PM |
|
|
Occured to me after I'd posted that the second outlet on the pump was a blank and the heater return went (T'd) into the bottom hose.
Think it was used on early models but my memoryis fading.
You could open it up (drill through) and use it. Or you'll have to T' the bottles bottom pipe into the bottom hose and (if you want a
by-pass) the medium size one from the stat housing into it as well.
"A witty saying proves nothing" Voltaire
http://jpsc.org.uk/forum/
|
|
|
JamesyCottony
|
| posted on 30/9/15 at 05:08 PM |
|
|
quote:
Originally posted by adithorp
Occured to me after I'd posted that the second outlet on the pump was a blank and the heater return went (T'd) into the bottom hose.
Think it was used on early models but my memoryis fading.
You could open it up (drill through) and use it. Or you'll have to T' the bottles bottom pipe into the bottom hose and (if you want a
by-pass) the medium size one from the stat housing into it as well.
So the diagram I did will work?
|
|
|
adithorp
|
| posted on 30/9/15 at 05:51 PM |
|
|
quote:
Originally posted by JamesyCottony
quote:
Originally posted by adithorp
Occured to me after I'd posted that the second outlet on the pump was a blank and the heater return went (T'd) into the bottom hose.
Think it was used on early models but my memoryis fading.
You could open it up (drill through) and use it. Or you'll have to T' the bottles bottom pipe into the bottom hose and (if you want a
by-pass) the medium size one from the stat housing into it as well.
So the diagram I did will work?
The corrected one you posted at 11:52 then YES
"A witty saying proves nothing" Voltaire
http://jpsc.org.uk/forum/
|
|
|
JamesyCottony
|
| posted on 30/9/15 at 07:47 PM |
|
|
quote:
Originally posted by adithorp
quote:
Originally posted by JamesyCottony
quote:
Originally posted by adithorp
Occured to me after I'd posted that the second outlet on the pump was a blank and the heater return went (T'd) into the bottom hose.
Think it was used on early models but my memoryis fading.
You could open it up (drill through) and use it. Or you'll have to T' the bottles bottom pipe into the bottom hose and (if you want a
by-pass) the medium size one from the stat housing into it as well.
So the diagram I did will work?
The corrected one you posted at 11:52 then YES
Ok brilliant, thanks everyone for all your help!!
|
|
|
JamesyCottony
|
| posted on 6/10/15 at 04:11 PM |
|
|
Ok so I have been looking at silicone hose online and people are saying that it leaks fluid? If this is the case would I be better off getting normal
rubber hose as it is cheaper as well? or is silicone really that much better? Cheers
|
|
|
JamesyCottony
|
| posted on 6/10/15 at 07:41 PM |
|
|
quote:
Originally posted by JamesyCottony
Ok so I have been looking at silicone hose online and people are saying that it leaks fluid? If this is the case would I be better off getting normal
rubber hose as it is cheaper as well? or is silicone really that much better? Cheers
Anyone?
This ok? Rubber EPDM SAEJ20R3 Radiator Hose - Car Heater Coolant Engine Water Pipe
[Edited on 6/10/15 by JamesyCottony]
|
|
|
adithorp
|
| posted on 6/10/15 at 08:34 PM |
|
|
Is silicone hose better or worth the money...? Depends who you ask.
Rubber works fine, it's just not as "bling". Silicones leaking is about how well it's clamped. It doesn't compress the
same as rubber. Use the right size hose clips and you shouldn't have issues. Use (worm-drive) clips that are for a larger diameter and
it'll create a couple of pinch points at either end of the screw housing where it might leak.
"A witty saying proves nothing" Voltaire
http://jpsc.org.uk/forum/
|
|
|
JamesyCottony
|
| posted on 6/10/15 at 08:37 PM |
|
|
quote:
Originally posted by adithorp
Is silicone hose better or worth the money...? Depends who you ask.
Rubber works fine, it's just not as "bling". Silicones leaking is about how well it's clamped. It doesn't compress the
same as rubber. Use the right size hose clips and you shouldn't have issues. Use (worm-drive) clips that are for a larger diameter and
it'll create a couple of pinch points at either end of the screw housing where it might leak.
Thanks for your reply, went for the rubber in the end was half the price!!
|
|
|
JamesyCottony
|
| posted on 7/10/15 at 05:21 PM |
|
|
Its looking like the topup bottle will have to be lower than the thermostat, so I know you said it is complicated but is there a way of doing it?
|
|
|
Angel Acevedo
|
| posted on 7/10/15 at 05:43 PM |
|
|
quote:
Originally posted by JamesyCottony
Its looking like the topup bottle will have to be lower than the thermostat, so I know you said it is complicated but is there a way of doing it?
Complicatedd no, you need to ensure that you have means to purge the system.
On my series 1 BMW there were a couple of purge points on the system. So, not uncommon to have purge points different than the header tank.
Beware of what you wish.. for it may come true....
|
|
|
JamesyCottony
|
| posted on 7/10/15 at 05:46 PM |
|
|
quote:
Originally posted by Angel Acevedo
quote:
Originally posted by JamesyCottony
Its looking like the topup bottle will have to be lower than the thermostat, so I know you said it is complicated but is there a way of doing it?
Complicatedd no, you need to ensure that you have means to purge the system.
On my series 1 BMW there were a couple of purge points on the system. So, not uncommon to have purge points different than the header tank.
How would I do that then? Sorry this stuff confuses me 
|
|
|
Angel Acevedo
|
| posted on 7/10/15 at 06:22 PM |
|
|
You need to find the highest points on the system and install an arrangement that allows to vent air.
I have just googled BMW coolant purge images and there are several ideas.
One might be on a high point on the water Jacket or Thermostat housing, and anothe may be on a hose.
HTH.
[Edited on 10/7/2015 by Angel Acevedo]
Beware of what you wish.. for it may come true....
|
|
|
JamesyCottony
|
| posted on 7/10/15 at 07:29 PM |
|
|
quote:
Originally posted by Angel Acevedo
You need to find the highest points on the system and install an arrangement that allows to vent air.
I have just googled BMW coolant purge images and there are several ideas.
One might be on a high point on the water Jacket or Thermostat housing, and anothe may be on a hose.
HTH.
[Edited on 10/7/2015 by Angel Acevedo]
Thanks for that, I have had a little muck around and managed to get the reservoir bottle about 30mm above the thermostat, will this be enough as long
as there are no droops in the hose?
|
|
|
adithorp
|
| posted on 7/10/15 at 08:26 PM |
|
|
As long as the level in the bottle is at least the same height as the top of the stat you should be OK. I think mine is only just above by about
10-20mm. Just ask yourself, if you were a bubble of air anywhere in the system, would you rise/flow up to the bottle?
If the bottle level is lower, then you have to NOT have a bleed pipe back to it (or it'll just fill up) and bleed off valves you can open/close
at the highest points instead. Some BMW's and Fiats to name just 2 are like this so it is a well trodden path but there's a reason
Punto's eat headgaskets! There are 3 issues...
1) Filling; You need to fill the bottle and then have some way to pressurise it (just sticking your gob over it and blowing can be enough) while the
bleeds are opened. Then close them off as water comes out.
2) Once "full" any air trapped around the system will find it's way to the bleed points once it runs and you need to bleed that off.
Simply opening the bleed when there's pressure in the system will do it but beware of getting scalded (so do it just as it starts to warm up,
has a bit of pressure but not hot). Then top the bottle up AFTER.Taking the cap off won't cause an issue as long as the bleeds are closed but
open a blee and the bottle will fill and the engine empty.
3) If it loses any water then it may not show in the bottle or if it does (it'll have lost a lot) then just topping up the bottle won't
refill (thats the mistake Fiat owners made and cooked their h/gasket).
"A witty saying proves nothing" Voltaire
http://jpsc.org.uk/forum/
|
|
|
JamesyCottony
|
| posted on 7/10/15 at 09:14 PM |
|
|
quote:
Originally posted by adithorp
As long as the level in the bottle is at least the same height as the top of the stat you should be OK. I think mine is only just above by about
10-20mm. Just ask yourself, if you were a bubble of air anywhere in the system, would you rise/flow up to the bottle?
If the bottle level is lower, then you have to NOT have a bleed pipe back to it (or it'll just fill up) and bleed off valves you can open/close
at the highest points instead. Some BMW's and Fiats to name just 2 are like this so it is a well trodden path but there's a reason
Punto's eat headgaskets! There are 3 issues...
1) Filling; You need to fill the bottle and then have some way to pressurise it (just sticking your gob over it and blowing can be enough) while the
bleeds are opened. Then close them off as water comes out.
2) Once "full" any air trapped around the system will find it's way to the bleed points once it runs and you need to bleed that off.
Simply opening the bleed when there's pressure in the system will do it but beware of getting scalded (so do it just as it starts to warm up,
has a bit of pressure but not hot). Then top the bottle up AFTER.Taking the cap off won't cause an issue as long as the bleeds are closed but
open a blee and the bottle will fill and the engine empty.
3) If it loses any water then it may not show in the bottle or if it does (it'll have lost a lot) then just topping up the bottle won't
refill (thats the mistake Fiat owners made and cooked their h/gasket).
Seems complicated :p I'll just try and keep the bottle above the thermostat :p. What coolant should i use for a classic engine? People are
saying that new OAT coolants ruin Austin seals, so what ones are safe?
|
|
|
BaileyPerformance
|
| posted on 8/10/15 at 01:13 PM |
|
|
Slightly off topic, but if your into your A series engines...
https://www.facebook.com/media/set/?set=a.499229003592143.1073741871.308612122653833&type=3
|
NOTE:This user is registered as a LocostBuilders trader and may offer commercial services to other users
|
adithorp
|
| posted on 8/10/15 at 04:14 PM |
|
|
OAT should be fine but if you're worried use normal ethelene-glycol.
"A witty saying proves nothing" Voltaire
http://jpsc.org.uk/forum/
|
|
|
