quote:
"Excellent job on the new book! I really like it. If it doesn't inspire hundreds of people to put their lives on hold and move into their garages I'll be amazed."
Bill Cardell
Has anybody had a read of it yet? How does it compare to "the book"? Is it worth having both? Is it a rip off for the US market?
Based on an MX5. They aren't quite in the same price bracket as Sierras over here!
notice how they always seem to manage to put the steering wheel in the wrong place
They have to put the steering wheel on that side, co's some stupid burk put the pedals in the wrong side.
Written by Keith Tanner and not yet published. Is he any relation to Den of Kit Car or Which Kit mag.
ATB
Simon
I had an email from this guy about a year ago, commenting on how similar looking our cars were. I think this book will probably be really great for US
builders from looking at his build at that time.
The main thing that annoyed me were the shots of the weather and empty roads!
Cheers
quote:
Originally posted by theconrodkid
notice how they always seem to manage to put the steering wheel in the wrong place
Keith is a great guy and arguably THE aftermarket Miata guru in North America. Whilst his book is aimed at the Miata donor, just from looking over his
build diaries I suspect that there will be a lot there, useful for any relatively new builder.
I hope that his book spurs the seven phenominon over here simply so that we'll have more guys with the same sort of car to race with. As it is,
in NASA (National Autosports Association) events in my region, typical attendance is 2-6 7esques, wheras you'll see more like 20-30 Cobra
replicas.
I'll post more when I receive my copy.
Mind if I chime in? I've read it 
I'm not really active in this forum but you'll find me on the US builder's email list. I
apologise if this comes across as an advert.
It's not intended to be a replacement of Champion's book. There's nothing in this about how to build a frame. However, it does have
technical information that covers the little stuff that Uncle Ron glossed over - such as how to design and build a brake system, building a proper
header, suspension set-up on the track, wiring, etc. It's also not donor-specific but includes the technical information you need to figure
things out for yourself.
For example, take brake proportioning. Instead of saying "use a set of 1990 MX5 brakes in the front, a set of 1994 brakes in the rear and the
factory proportioning valve from the 1990", it explains what brake proportioning is, why it matters and different ways of altering it. While the
book has a Locost on the cover (the same one that's in my garage of course!), it should help anyone who's trying to put together a kit or
homebuilt car.
And yes, there's the story of a build in there. It's to keep it interesting. You'll get to see what things go wrong and what goes
right. Think of it as inspiration.
All the photographs are colour and there are about 400 of them. You can see the whole build (and nearly 800 photos) on the website mentioned
earlier.
The book has been published. Amazon has delivered some copies already and I have a big box of them. I'm not sure why Amazon changed their minds
about that. Amazon UK carries it as well to avoid the hassles of international
shipping.
I'm not related to Den Tanner nor am I associated with Kit Car or Which Kit magazine.
Keith Tanner
I too recently purchased a copy ogf the new book. As mentioned above, it is not a replacement to 'the book', but instead it is
complementary, and includes a lot of the detail that is missing in Ron's book - brakes, bump steer, wiring etc. Sure you can find most of the
information you need on the net and this forum, but having a book in your hand is a refreshing change.
A good addition to the bookcase - I'm sure that I will put it to good use.
Rob
<Based on an MX5. They aren't quite in the same price bracket as Sierras over here!>
Don't take this as gospel - there are bargains to be found - I recently heard of a mk1 that was driven away taxed and tested for £600. If you go
to the right scrappy there are plenty - they tend to end up in the specialist Jap breakers (there's one in Rochdale that's nearest to me)
Also bear in mind that the quality of engineering and materials is generally far superior to the old sierra so a dead mx5 usually goes to a breakers
rather than a scrapyard. There's a healthy market in reasonably priced used parts to tap into if you visit the mx5 forums/mailing lists, I got a
complete set of uprights & brakes delivered for £150 and 4 alloys with (just) legal tyres for £40 - didn't even get my hands dirty. And
there really are lots around 'cos of all the grey imports. It is clearly an important donor vehicle in USA now, also Australia. I'm
surprised so few brits have cottoned on!
With sierra diffs appearing on ebay expecting to fetch a grand (!) (yeah - fat chance) & cortina hubs & escort axles going the way of
hen's teeth, the choice seemed clear to me when I started 2 years ago!
Bob
PS I only used the hubs/uprights/wheels - still got the sierra diff!
FWIW, The Pheonix is now MX-5 based...
I've got a friend with a 1990 MX5 (Jap Import Eunos Roadster), he paid £3k for it a year or so ago, thats not cheap enough to be used as a donor.
My girlfriend drives an MX5 that she paid $5k for. That doesn't mean there aren't donors available for much less. Mine was given to me. It
didn't look much like a car anymore but it had what I needed. There's also a good market for the stock body panels which helps repay the
cost, unlike something older and rusty.
My donor - the engine and transmission was elsewhere already.
Keith
Here in the US, if you look hard enough you can find miata's dirt cheap, less than 1k, especially if they have body damage, and I remember one on
ebay about a year ago that was rolled (aka no windshield) and the selling price reached a whoppin $300. It just takes time to find the right donor.
My rx7 only cost me $500
Oh yeh amazon here in the US is selling the new book fairly cheap, i paid 19.77 for my copy.
[Edited on 30/11/05 by derf]
Yeah, in California Miata (MX-5)'s are all over the place. I got a '94 M model (with LSD) for $500. They're the perfect donor if you
want to go with IRS. If not, you use all the other parts, throw in a 1st gen RX-7 rear and sell the Miata components on e-bay. If the power is
inadequate to your needs, the engine will support up to 250 HP via boost.
We don't need no stinking Sierras.
Oh yeah, and we like wrapping our RIGHT arm around our girls
during our year-round good weather. (Just rubbing it in)
Just an idea what they are worth over here
Rescued attachment MX5 prices.JPG
So, starting at 1385 for a donor then. Most of these tend to hit the scrapyards due to accidents instead of mechanical decrepitude which is handy for
us. And as I said, you can usually sell off enough non-required bits to bring your cost down to zero. Taillights, interior pieces, wings, doors,
control arms, indicator lights and misceallenous small pieces are all surprisingly valuable. I've sold a number of parts off my wreck after
building my car - and you wouldn't think there was anything left to sell!
Keith
Those are giude prices for runners . . . One of the attractions of the mx5 is that it's an 'interesting' rwd car so quite a few get
written off . . . . . . . ;^)
Bob
A Cat C will get about 25% of retail, not so cheap
"Decrepitude" wow what e great word, i've never heard that before, i don't think we use it this side of the pond but i like it.
Is it a real word?
quote:
I purchased Ron Champion's book and am hoping to build a lotus(like) seven from scratch. I am using a 1984 RX-7 GSL-SE with a 13b. Not sure about what I'll do for the front end yet...any ideas? If anyone else is doing a build like this or interested in the lotus 7 and in Hawaii, e-mail me.
Nate Clowar
The book:
Build your own Sports Car for as little as $250 - AND RACE IT! By Ron Champion
Another good book is:
How to Build a Cheap Sports Car by Keith Tanner
Like your Web Site. I have been looking at it Off and On Good Work.
Ordered the keith tanner book just after christmas and picked up yesterday,its very good with a lot of info that compliments the ron book.
I think its worth the £18.99 price tag
Have to agree with the exponents of the Mazda donor idea.
I know very little about them but the key is that yes, you may pay more for the donor, but you get more of a car in the end for it!
The "single sierra donor" is, in my opinion a totally flawed concept!
The sierra is mcpherson front end, and it's uprights (again in my opinion) look messy and clumsy when attached to double wishbones (skirting
carefully around the geometry arguments!), they also have heavy engines which will pretty much all need rebuilds now, too wide a track width, and many
parts totally unsuited to being 7 donor parts!
Now yes, you may well get a dead sierra for £50 and boast to yer mates at the pub about it, but you probably wont then tell them about the £300 you
spent making the engine give an acceptable level of performance, or the £50 getting the driveshafts shortened, or the steering rack shortening, or the
recon brake calipers you needed, or the new wheel bearings etc etc etc etc..........
It doesn't take long to work out that spending £750 on top of the donor car, just to get parts that a) fit and b) aren't knackered is not at
all uncommon.
Therefore, if you can get a donor with "ready" bits on it for £800 or so, then you are no worse off.
I just don't really get the whole "single sierra donor" thing because you end up with a car full of compromises, which costs no less
than building one from seperately salvaged parts, each tailored to the task in hand.
Donor brakes, for example, are rarely suited to the 7, and are rarely in serviceable condition on a £50 car! I don't mean the whole Haynes
"service it or you'll die" thing, but that old parts generally detract from the driving experience, and if you want to build the car,
it's better to spend a few quid more at the start to do it right than to have to do it all again later!