Kev999
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| posted on 24/7/03 at 08:20 PM |
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M3 power!
I'll keep this short.
Can I use a 285bhp M3 engine?
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Mark Allanson
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| posted on 24/7/03 at 08:39 PM |
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You can use any engine you like, but the more you deviate from the 'normal', the longer and more expensive the build will be.
I am fitting a pinto for ease (did I really say that?) and if I need more power later, with the SVA behind me (hopefully) I can go as wild as my
overdraft will let me
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ned
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| posted on 25/7/03 at 09:20 AM |
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i belive the bmw engine are on the slant, so may make it awkward fitting it in, and the gearbox and dif are heavier I understand, though no reason why
it can't e done, will just need modifications to the book I expect.
best of luck + welcome...
Ned.
beware, I've got yellow skin
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James
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| posted on 25/7/03 at 09:54 AM |
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Kev,
It'd be well worth measuring it from sump bottom to tappet or plenum top.
I've a feeling it's a pretty tall engine and if it's much taller than a Pinto it's gonna be a bit of a challenge to fit under
the bonnet!
Good Luck though!
James
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timf
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| posted on 25/7/03 at 09:57 AM |
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isn't the hippy using a bmw lump
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ned
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| posted on 25/7/03 at 10:40 AM |
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yeah, though he's 'non conformist' IIRC!!
Ned.
beware, I've got yellow skin
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Metal Hippy
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| posted on 25/7/03 at 02:09 PM |
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Aye.
Major chassis changes needed for our 3.5....
What block is the M3 engine?
The 3.5 M30 is a big lump of iron...
Cock off or cock on. You choose.
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James
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| posted on 25/7/03 at 02:56 PM |
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quote:
Originally posted by ned
yeah, though he's 'non conformist' IIRC!!
Ned.
He wishes! 
It's so rare to meet someone who's built a 'book' chassis with 'book' engine that by not following The Book
you're in fact conforming with The Pack!
The only non-conformists are those following the book to the letter! 
Sorry Hippy!
James
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ned
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| posted on 25/7/03 at 03:28 PM |
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so do the racers who build to the book all count as conformists or non conformists? or are they just conformists to the race regs?
Ned.
beware, I've got yellow skin
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Metal Hippy
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| posted on 25/7/03 at 05:43 PM |
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My non-conformism is based entirely on engine usage.
There are the usual engine types used by builders, not just based on the book x-flow...
Not many people (I know one or two do) use a BMW engine in such a car.
I put Liam in the same bracket as me. Timf aswell. Honda V6 and a big ass Yank V8...
So there.
Hippy.
Non-conformist and proud
Cock off or cock on. You choose.
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Stu16v
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| posted on 25/7/03 at 09:38 PM |
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quote:
The only non-conformists are those following the book to the letter!
Err, that is impossible anyway, innit?
Dont just build it.....make it!
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Liam
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| posted on 27/7/03 at 07:39 PM |
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Well an M3 engine has the correct number of cylinders - so good start!! Might need to stretch the engine bay, widen the tunnel and have a big bonnet
bulge. Make the chassis nice and stiff too. Luvvly jubbly.
Liam
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Macca
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| posted on 27/7/03 at 11:24 PM |
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Well an M3 engine has the correct number of cylinders - so good start!!
Four or six?
They did/do both.
Col
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Noodle
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| posted on 28/7/03 at 05:35 AM |
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quote:
Four or six?
They did/do both.
<Dons Anorak>
The original poster referred to 285bhp. The first E36 M3 (pre-EVO) was 286bhp and that's a straight six. Later ones were 326bhp. The earlier E30
four cyls varied from 195bhp to 238 (2.5 M3 Sport Evo) They have an iron block and aluminium head.
</Dons Anorak>
Neil.
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mranlet
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| posted on 28/7/03 at 04:41 PM |
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Speaking of non-conformists...
I'm starting my build with a 4 cylinder out of a Nissan pickup truck which will be replaced within a year: The first summer that my car (dubbed
the Kamikaze) is constructed, I will be heading from Florida to Arizona, USA, where it will be outfitted with either an RB26DETT with AWD or RB25DET
with RWD (depending on budget). Both of these 750+ hp capable monsters are from the Japan-spec Nissan Skyline!
Both of these motors are straight 6's, so fitting them into such a small car will be tricky - the RB26's twin turbo system will need to be
removed and bolted back on once the engine, due to the fact that frame members have been positioned so that they snake between the engine block and
the turbos. On top of that, I will have to fabricate an exhaust system because the pipes leading off of the turbos would invade my footwell as they
lie in stock layout. The same goes for the intake manifold, which will additionally have to be reworked in order to fit. Extensive work will also
go into the intercooler orientation and piping, as well as the contorted exhaust (which may wind being a dual-side exit setup flowing through a
scratchbuilt muffler in order to save room).
Rather than have the motor sit in a framed-in box, I'm having the frame extend right alongside the motor much in the style of the TVR Speed 12.
Ordinarily, this setup would be stupid, but since there will only be one shape of engine in the car (the only difference in size between the RB25 and
RB26 is the single turbo versus twin turbo), I know exactly where frame members can and can't go.
I have chosen not to elongate the engine bay - instead I'm moving the horizontal footwell cover portion of the firewall rearward. This will
maintain the 50/50 weight distribution and also keep the wheelbase at a cool 98 inches. If you're going to try and make something like a BMW 6
fit, you might want to consider this option as well. My car is to be covered by a full fiberglass body (as well as a truck/hatchback bed in the rear)
so fitting the engine under the hood will be no problem, especially with a cowl.
Moral of the story: I will wind up with an AWD 320-hp beast that is able to be tuned anywhere fron 500hp to 1000hp (for race-only) for virtually no
increase in vehicle size.
-MR
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Rorty
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| posted on 29/7/03 at 05:05 AM |
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mranlet:
quote:
I will wind up with an AWD 320-hp beast that is able to be tuned anywhere fron 500hp to 1000hp
I take it you're not opting for the Escort MK II rear axle then?
How much are BF Goodrich charging you for making the one-off tyres to get all that power onto the road?
Cheers, Rorty.
"Faster than a speeding Pullet".
PLEASE DON'T U2U ME IF YOU WANT A QUICK RESPONSE. TRY EMAILING ME INSTEAD!
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mranlet
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| posted on 29/7/03 at 12:32 PM |
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No, it's DEFINATELY not going to have the dinky MK II axle...
The 320hp is the stock horsepower output from the RB26DETT which comes with the ATESSA AWD system for the very purpose of applying the power. For
ratings that high it would be suicide to install anything less than computer-controlled AWD. ATESSA uses the rear wheels for the majority of everyday
driving, but when the sensors detect rear wheel spin the system quickly re-directs power (up to 30%) to the front differential. This gives the
neutral feel of a RWD car but with added stability that is only possible in AWD cars. Therefore, the AWD serves mainly as a traction and launch
control. This AWD requires the use of Nissan's differential because of the abundance of sensors which are imdedded within it, which becomes a
mixed blessing: it mandates a somewhat large expendature ($1500-$2000 for computer package and drivetrain) but also ensures that I won't make
any engine/differential matchups that I will later regret - not that I would do anything like that anyway
As far as the stock rear ends are concerned, the RWD-only driveline that is produced in combination with the RB25DET is capable of supporting figures
through 500hp at the wheels and can support even 1000hp with very little modification. I know that running with only the rear wheels driving the car
will quickly become the scarriest thing in the world to drive. However, the RB25 produces "only" about 250-275hp in stock form and has a
very smooth torque curve. Depending on what pans out, I may make the car a dedicated circuit drifter or simply sell it in order to fund another
project (this obviousally being a while from now). If that were to be the case I would most certianly go with a more mild setup for street use, such
as a 4-cylinder AWD layout from a Lancer, Celica GT-Four, Subaru, or our US Eclipse/Laser/Talon. However, I want to have a complete build under my
belt before attempting a unorthodox design such as the transverse AWD layout...
Speaking of which, does anyone know of any transverse-engined (preferable front mounted) AWD self-assembled car or builder?
Thanks for your input!
-MR
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JoelP
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| posted on 29/7/03 at 06:49 PM |
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I had a smashed legacy turbo that was destined for big things but couldn't store it for as long as it would have needed to get used... sold it
for a 3er, which i may well regret when i get the current one finished. that would have been gr8, a 4by with 200hp. ah well, time and tide....
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