aerosam
|
 posted on 5/11/08 at 05:17 PM |
|
|
IT'S ALL GONE WRONG... NOTHING FITS AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA!!!!
Ok, this afternoon I tried to lower the engine and gearbox into the half built chassis to take measurements for the transmission/prop tunnel.
The gearbox is too tall and doesn't fit between tubes Q and C.
The oil filter housing, mounted on the front left cylinder head makes the front of the engine to wide to fit in the bay. Even if it did fit the whole
lump is o big there is no room for anything else in there!
Can I cut tube Q (about 10" from the middle) and sort of bridge the gap over the gearbox? Or would that seriously weaken the chassis? Same thing
with tube J1, can i make a cutout from one side, plate the hole over and add some srtrengethening on the outside, or will that seriously weaken it
too?
Why oh why did I think I could make something interesting out of a (insert profanity here) BMW.
Not my best day in the garage today.
|
|
|
|
|
Humbug
|
| posted on 5/11/08 at 05:24 PM |
|
|
I feel sorry for you mate, but did you really think a BM V8 would just drop in 
It doesn't sound like it is totally insurmountable, though (I am sure someone with relevant chassis/welding knowledge will be along soon with
some advice), and just think of what you'll have when (not if...) you finish it.
Good luck
Simon
|
|
|
IDONTBELEIVEIT
|
| posted on 5/11/08 at 06:07 PM |
|
|
read your title and thought you had brought a westfield in kit form
regards wayno westy megablade owner
Are We There Yet, Are We There Yet!!!!
|
|
|
Ivan
|
| posted on 5/11/08 at 06:20 PM |
|
|
Thats the joy of trying to fit a quart in a pint pot and being a trailblazer.
Don't just stand there and swear at it - go down to the pub, have a pint or two, sleep on it for a few nights and the answer will come to you.
 If it doesnt its time for the big hammer and a hacksaw. 
Sorry - this doesn't answer your question but then i don't know what tube Q is as I'm sitting in the middle of a game park and
don't have the book with me but I do suspect that there are very few redundant members in the chassis so you better make sure you replace the
strength lost by altering any members or redirect the loads through some other suitably reinforced members.
[Edited on 5/11/08 by Ivan]
|
|
|
Daimo_45
|
| posted on 5/11/08 at 06:22 PM |
|
|
That is what heppens when you go against the 7 ethos. Add lightness, not a big whopping engine!
|
|
|
dinosaurjuice
|
| posted on 5/11/08 at 06:28 PM |
|
|
go down the tractor root and use the engine/transmission as a stressed member.
bolt/weld the suspension to either end of it, sorted
|
|
|
skodaman
|
| posted on 5/11/08 at 06:34 PM |
|
|
Never mind it'll be well worth the effort in the end, and it beats the easy way of fitting one of those tiny bike engine things.
Skodaman
|
|
|
aerosam
|
| posted on 5/11/08 at 06:43 PM |
|
|
Thanks guys - i'm feeling much better about it now.
Can I cut tube Q (about 10" from the middle) and sort of bridge the gap over the gearbox? Or would that seriously weaken the chassis? Same thing
with tube J1, can i make a cutout from one side, plate the hole over and add some srtrengethening on the outside, or will that seriously weaken it
too?
|
|
|
mr henderson
|
| posted on 5/11/08 at 06:51 PM |
|
|
It would help if you posted some pics. Apart from anything else, without a diagram handy, it's difficult to know whiich tubes you mean
John
|
|
|
Simon
|
| posted on 5/11/08 at 07:40 PM |
|
|
quote:
Originally posted by Daimo_45
That is what happens when you go against the 7 ethos. Add lightness, not a big whopping engine!
That's crap We aren't building 7's, we're building Locosts (mostly) which is completely different and means if you want to
build a car that weighs 200kgs powered by a hairdryer engine, then I'll take the pee, but help if I can, and conversly if I, or the op want to
build car to sink a battleship then we expect the same
aerosam,
I'm sure someone has already done something along these lines, but you'll have to ensure your structure is rigid - maybe sheeted.
I'll try and think who it was and put up links.
ATB
Simon
[Edited on 5/11/08 by Simon]
[Edited on 5/11/08 by Simon]
|
|
|
mark chandler
|
| posted on 5/11/08 at 07:47 PM |
|
|
Diagrams would indeed be helpful, You can chop about loads of stuff if you want, the secret is in triangulation.
So assuming Q is the bar over the top of the gearbox that sounds like a fundemental tube, but if you were to remove you could replace with a V brace
going back to the tube behind.
Then add a few gussetts for good measure, something like this.
Alternatively make a matchstick model, chop out the bits you need to lose and see how it flexes, add in some additional bars until it feels good
again.
 
Rescued attachment Drawing1.jpg
|
|
|
C10CoryM
|
| posted on 5/11/08 at 08:28 PM |
|
|
Don't forget you can use bolt in tubing as well. I have 6 diagonals (some attached to ea other) that are bolt in to allow me to remove my
engine/trans. And yes, my engine/trans are far bigger than req'd  .
Cheers.
"Our watchword evermore shall be: The Maple Leaf Forever!"
|
|
|
speedyxjs
|
| posted on 5/11/08 at 08:30 PM |
|
|
I had the same problem but did as above. You may find there are other tubes that are in the way. All you do is make sure you have enough triangulation
around to make up for the lost strength 
How long can i resist the temptation to drop a V8 in?
|
|
|
RK
|
| posted on 5/11/08 at 08:33 PM |
|
|
Can't you cut the lower bar instead of the upper one? Cutting the upper one is going to cause problems too isn't it? That's what I
did to make my Nissan CA18DET fit. The transmission housing just BARELY misses the upper bar, so it's back as far as possible. It's also
bolted to the lower tunnel to hold everything.
|
|
|
Liam
|
| posted on 5/11/08 at 08:44 PM |
|
|
Would replacing the Q tube with a cross give you enough room? That's what I did to accommodate the desired far-back-ed-ness of my engine. Have
a look in me photo archive as i'm not sure how to post one from there on here!
Liam
|
|
|
pewe
|
| posted on 5/11/08 at 08:49 PM |
|
|
Can't offer any advice other than to say I faced similar problems trying to slot in my Volumex engine.
Once the initial shock/horror of the frikking thing not fitting you'll no doubt think around it - just requires a bit of lateral thinking and
perseverance.
Cheers, Pewe 
|
|
|
kb58
|
| posted on 6/11/08 at 09:17 PM |
|
|
I'm trying - very, very hard - to not trout-slap you outside the head.
So it went something like this:
1. The frame was built per published plans.
2. A big drivetrain was acquired and dropped in.
3. You're unhappy and frustrated that it doesn't fit.
Where in these steps was the planning, the foresight, and thinking ahead? Where is the project management? I'm sitting here just shaking my head
wondering how on earth it could turn out any other way.
What's next, dispair that the sofa recliner won't fit as a seat and how unfair that is? I'm sorry to come down on you so hard, but
at some point, you, all by yourself, are 100% responsible for how this stuff fits together and no one else. Time to step up, take responsibility, and
plan things out ahead of time.
Mid-engine Locost - http://www.midlana.com
And the book - http://www.lulu.com/shop/kurt-bilinski/midlana/paperback/product-21330662.html
Kimini - a tube-frame, carbon shell, Honda Prelude VTEC mid-engine Mini: http://www.kimini.com
And its book -
http://www.lulu.com/shop/kurt-bilinski/kimini-how-to-design-and-build-a-mid-engine-sports-car-from-scratch/paperback/product-4858803.html
|
|
|
aerosam
|
| posted on 6/11/08 at 10:01 PM |
|
|
1. Mcsorley +4 chassis plans have been followed thus far.
2. BMW 530i had previously been bought and stripped. All parts were measured up, engine will fit in chassis, oil filter housing had been removed
previously but when refitted found it fouls a top rail.
3. Gutted it doesn't fit, turn to a generally great forum for help and find some great ideas, somewhat overshadowed by patronising and mocking -
this step had not been planned for.
Thanks to all those members who have posted geninely helpful advice.
I'll find a way around this and build it just to prove all the doubters wrong!!!
[Edited on 6/11/08 by aerosam]
|
|
|
dmulally
|
| posted on 7/11/08 at 06:02 AM |
|
|
I am putting a P76 V8 into a standard locost frame. Its a chubby cousin of the rover V8.
Perhaps look at a remote oil filter. I know nothing about Bimmers but surely something could be adapted with a sandwich plate.
I had to take out that same bar and I just moved it back to where it would fit. There is no triangulation in it but I am not fussed.
You could move it back as I did and perhaps put in a removable bar held by rod ends thats up high. Isnt perfect but such is life. Also aids in getting
the thing in and out later on.
Another thing you can think about is the Aussie mod below the gearbox. Its a bent tube that follows the gearbox. It works.
Ive been through exactly what you are going through and its all about compromise. There will be plenty more of these moments though so try not to let
it get you down. Its good fun finding a way around it.
Good luck.
Cheers
Damian
|
|
|
David Jenkins
|
| posted on 7/11/08 at 08:50 AM |
|
|
At least it's a home-made chassis, so cutting a piece or two off and relocating won't be too bad.
It's still an awesome project, so accomodating an oil filter is not the end of the world.
Good luck with the fix, and have fun!
cheers,
David
P.S. Don't be too hard on kb58 - in your initial post it did sound like you had been over-ambitious in your project and had run aground. Only
when you added more info did it become apparent that you were fully aware of the nature of your project!
[Edited on 7/11/08 by David Jenkins]
|
|
|
MakeEverything
|
| posted on 8/11/08 at 08:00 PM |
|
|
Regardless of what level of thought or planning was put in beforehand, a colleague of ours has posted his frustration asking for some help. Who are
we to take the wee out of someones ability or experience? The point is, hes making an effort to push limits, and build something unique.
A remote Oil Filter Housing on the bulkhead sounds good, as does removeable sections. Try looking at the possibilities of a completely removeable Q
and P sections, and anything else above - ie the scuttle.
This will allow a bit more room when removing the Transmission, and will allow the bellhousing to move around slightly without pushing the frame
around whilst taking it out. Could also prove usefult if chaning a clutch.
The idea of using the transmission itself as a structural member is another goodun. Are there any mounting points you can use?
Im fitting a 2.9 V6 in mine, and im going to have to have a remote oil filter, and take everything off the engine that i can, and mount it somewhere
else, purely to keep the bay tidy and accessible.
All the best with the build, and read the negative responses if they appear. You can always choose to ignore them afterwards. All feedback is good
feedback, and the negative ones are just one persons opinion.
Kindest Regards,
Richard.
...You can make it foolProof, but youll never make it Idiot Proof!...
|
|
|
scootz
|
| posted on 8/11/08 at 08:21 PM |
|
|
Don't worry about it! I've made that mistake so many times, that I no longer make 'plans' until I've collected all the
parts I want to use!
Once I've decided on the parts, then I start to scratch my head to see how 'x' can be modified to accept 'y'.
It's great fun and will give you a real buzz once you've nailed it (not literally ).
Nothing is insurmountable... there will be a solution. Post some pics and we'll see where we can help!
|
|
|
Cheffy
|
| posted on 10/11/08 at 11:36 PM |
|
|
quote:
I'll find a way around this and build it just to prove all the doubters wrong!!!
Spoken like a true 'Locoster' and pioneer!
Go for it and good luck.
Mart.
Farts are like Rock'n'Roll. You love your own but you hate everybody else's. Lemmy, Motorhead.
|
|
|
kb58
|
| posted on 11/11/08 at 10:53 PM |
|
|
There's always a way around problems. It just takes lots of careful planning and designing.
Mid-engine Locost - http://www.midlana.com
And the book - http://www.lulu.com/shop/kurt-bilinski/midlana/paperback/product-21330662.html
Kimini - a tube-frame, carbon shell, Honda Prelude VTEC mid-engine Mini: http://www.kimini.com
And its book -
http://www.lulu.com/shop/kurt-bilinski/kimini-how-to-design-and-build-a-mid-engine-sports-car-from-scratch/paperback/product-4858803.html
|
|
|
aerosam
|
| posted on 12/11/08 at 10:42 AM |
|
|
panic over, it just about fits!
I'm going to have to chop a little (ok a lot) from the centre of the top rail immediately behind it to allow the gearbox to fit.
I'm a little concerned with how tall it is, are you allowed to have the engine poking through the bonnet, if it has a nice smooth plastic engine
cover over it? (the BMW one from the donor is actually quite nice)
 
Rescued attachment engine in small.jpg
Had enough of this dictatorship known as LCB. Gone elsewhere, not coming back. Kiss my ass ChrisW.
|
|
|
