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Audi Main Stealers and A6 Avant 4f WARNING
Agriv8 - 17/10/12 at 01:06 PM

Warning if you are thinking about purchasing an A6 Avant or you have one

So the long story

My trusty stead an A6 4f Avant started draining the battery, did the usual disconnect the Headrest tv’s and removed the last item i fitted ( Audi towing module). Still no joy leave it a couple of days it would need jump stating.

Of to my usual garage to take a look tried various things plugged into VCDS ( new name for VAG com ) nothing to strange identified no options but to send to the main stealer Sytner Audi Harrogate . So £114 was paid to diagnose the fault and they found that the Sound AMP was stopping on ( runs on a 30 amp fuse so can use some juice ) even when ign was off. £600 plus fitting was the asking price for a new one!!.

No thanks said I and went to collect on collection the very helpful and immaculately dressed Service receptionist said to give her a call to book it in and that they had done some recall work while they had the vehicle ( alarm bells were ringing all the way home ).

So looked up Technical bulletins that cover my car and guess what find that Audi have been replacing the Screen wash feed pipe to rear wash wipe rubbing on the boot hinge. Where do we assume the leaking washer fluid ended up on the AMP causing it to blow. Various emails ensued to be politely told naff off we arn’t going to help.

So disconnected battery pulled the amp out and onto ebay with the part numbers Fantastic one on there for £150 just about to order when it occurred to me to do a little more google’ing on the subject and guess what the unit has Audi protection ( not removable by VCDS ) so email Audi asking if they would recode a second hand unit there response.

quote:


Dear Mr ********

I have discussed this issue with the mater technicians & the workshop manager. I would like to address the 3 points you listed in your email below.

1. A second hand unit can be fitted but it will need recoding. This is not something that we would be prepared to assist you with as the item is component protected for security.

2. The control units communicate with each other & turn on & off on instruction from each other as required. This is via CAN communication & not reliant on the main ignition feed.

3. If water has entered the unit causing the issue there is not necessarily going to be any trace due to evaporation from the unit being warm.

I therefore regrettably inform you again that Audi UK are not prepared to assist on this occasion & if you would like us to carry out the repair it would be chargeable.

Regards




The short version.


Audi has a A6 Avant fault with a design flaw which breaks a £600 item and they will not recode a second hand Item to Work so I am Scre*wd.

So apart from the rant and the warning the reason for the Post.

Anyone know a main stealer with a more helpful approach and will recode second hand units
Or
Any other ideas apart from admitting defeat and parting with my hard earned Cash

At the moment the car is running happily with the 30 amp fuse pulled Just Hopping the LCB Collective can assist with other options

Agriv8

Chippy - 17/10/12 at 01:28 PM

Maybe a silly question, but surely most electronic items are repairable, just a matter of locating the blown/faulty element and replacing. Or have Audi made that in some way not possable? Cheers Ray

MakeEverything - 17/10/12 at 01:48 PM

It is just an Amp, so i would look at the possibilities of replacing it with another item, that you might need to turn off separately. I wouldnt pay £600 either. Have you tried Audi HQ to see what they say?

I bought a 2nd hand car which had been subjected to a full 100+ point safety check. anyway, two weeks later, i took it back because the brakes were juddering. the dealer i bought it from refused to do this under warranty, and wanted to charge me for it.

I escalated it to a main ford branch, and they sorted it FOC. A couple of months later, the garage i bought it from were no longer a ford franchise so i dont know if it has been a longstanding issue (this type of service).

RichardK - 17/10/12 at 02:01 PM

Have you opened up the amp to see if anything has obviously blown? I must be repairable? Even maybe using the 2nd hand one for parts if inside they are separate boards like 1 for psi and 1 for logic etc?

Hope you get it sorted

Rich

Agriv8 - 17/10/12 at 02:09 PM

cheers Guy yes I had the unit apart and i could see no damage ( lifted tracks / blown Caps ) But I will pull it again tonight ant take a photo see it anyone can give me any pointers where to start onvestigations.

Not Hit Audi HQ but I will be contacting them Shortly.

The amp is on A fibre optic loop conecting all the items so cant replace with third part as far as I am aware.

Keep the sugestion Comming I am sure one of the audi fdealers must re-code secong hand units fingers crossed

ATB Agriv8

[Edited on 17/10/12 by Agriv8]

FuryRebuild - 17/10/12 at 02:40 PM

sue them for consequential loss in the small claims court? if for no other reason than spite?

jeffw - 17/10/12 at 03:14 PM

While you are looking around check there is no blocking of the drains in the scuttle area of the engine bay. I lost my Audi 3.0TDi Avant S-line because of water ingress via the two electrically boxes in the scuttle which ruined the electrical system in the car.

matt_gsxr - 17/10/12 at 03:18 PM

quote:
Originally posted by FuryRebuild
sue them for consequential loss in the small claims court? if for no other reason than spite?

I like it! If there is water fluid residue on the unit no-one could refuse your claim.


My experiences of audi main dealers is also rather disappointing. Fortunately my audis have been reliable, but the water ingress into the rear lights of my A6 does annoy me (drill drain holes in the bottom and don't worry about it is the only solution).

vwaudiforum seems to be a decent resource

snakebelly - 17/10/12 at 04:34 PM

so does the amp still work but draws current when even switched off? If so why not just wire in a seperate switch to isolate it when you switch off the car?

stevebubs - 17/10/12 at 05:08 PM

Personally I would a) get a quote for the replacement part supplied and fitted from main stealer
b) start small claims procedings for all costs including diagnosis and including the technical response as part of the evidence
c) take great pleasure in loudly providing them with the small claims letter at their busiest time of the morning.

dray13dad - 17/10/12 at 05:44 PM

try ecu.com or ecu doctor maybe able to help. not at work so cannot find company you really need at mo pm me tomorrow eve and hope to have more news. by the way there are three drain holes under scuttle panel there is one under battery which people miss and just go for the easy ones.

mark chandler - 17/10/12 at 06:05 PM

quote:
Originally posted by snakebelly
so does the amp still work but draws current when even switched off? If so why not just wire in a seperate switch to isolate it when you switch off the car?


I,m with this, drop in a relay on the power supply so it lights up when you turn the ignition.

splitrivet - 17/10/12 at 06:31 PM

quote:
Originally posted by mark chandler
quote:
Originally posted by snakebelly
so does the amp still work but draws current when even switched off? If so why not just wire in a seperate switch to isolate it when you switch off the car?


I,m with this, drop in a relay on the power supply so it lights up when you turn the ignition.


Thats what I'd do.
Never been a fan of Audi service since my A6's head gasket went on the Autoroute just outside Orleans France it was taken to the main Audi dealer who changed the cylinder head which cost me 900 euros, picked the car up after repair went 5 k up the Autoroute and the engine made some horrendous noises so was picked up and taken back to the dealer. Turns out they hadnt changed the oil, 3 big ends gone. When I asked them why they hadnt changed the oil they said they were trying to save me money.
Cheers,
Bob

tegwin - 17/10/12 at 06:56 PM

Buy a second hand amp off ebay and find someone with VAG-com or VCDs to code it in for you... takes seconds....

mookaloid - 17/10/12 at 06:57 PM

I have had nothing but poor experiences with audi dealers.

I had a "don't worry your iffy clutch is covered under warranty" change to "when we got it out it was just worn which is not covered so here's a bill for £1500"

The last time the parts department wouldn't sell me some radio removal prongs - apparently they don't sell them to the general public as it is a security risk.

I wouldn't buy another Audi .......ever

Agriv8 - 17/10/12 at 08:23 PM

quote:
Originally posted by tegwin
Buy a second hand amp off ebay and find someone with VAG-com or VCDs to code it in for you... takes seconds....


Vcds can not get around component protected items I belive.

Ate agriv8

Agriv8 - 17/10/12 at 08:25 PM

quote:
Originally posted by mookaloid
I have had nothing but poor experiences with audi dealers.

I had a "don't worry your iffy clutch is covered under warranty" change to "when we got it out it was just worn which is not covered so here's a bill for £1500"

The last time the parts department wouldn't sell me some radio removal prongs - apparently they don't sell them to the general public as it is a security risk.

I wouldn't buy another Audi .......ever


mook at this moment in time I suspect I will be joining you on that which is a shame as it is a fantastic product let down by the dealers.

regards agriv8

Agriv8 - 17/10/12 at 08:37 PM

So here is the amp in bits

Blown amp
Blown amp

and my gut feeling would be the relay bottom right

Relay1
Relay1

as the unit works but won't switch off

Fact sheet

I can't get the cover off the relay or work out how to test any pointers ?

fingers crossed someone can assist

ATB Agriv8

mookaloid - 17/10/12 at 08:49 PM

As said above - the cheapest and easiest way if it is working but won't switch off is going to be to pop an ignition controlled relay into the live feed for it. It will still work as it should but won't drain the battery.

cheers

M

Agriv8 - 17/10/12 at 09:28 PM

Found a supplier of the relay

Here

The tech drawing has n.c. And n.o. On the output poles any ideas

Agriv8 - 17/10/12 at 09:28 PM

Found a supplier of the relay

Here

The tech drawing has n.c. And n.o. On the output poles any ideas

Davey D - 17/10/12 at 09:54 PM

quote:
Originally posted by Agriv8
Found a supplier of the relay

Here

The tech drawing has n.c. And n.o. On the output poles any ideas




n.c = normally closed

n.o = normally open

ShaunB - 17/10/12 at 10:00 PM

I think NC = Normally Closed, NO = Normally Open. This would be the state of the contact between those pins when the relay isn't energised.

If you were to wire in an ignition switched relay as others have suggested you'd want a NO relay, which closes the connection (and hence completes the power circuit to the amp) when the ignition live trips it.

Shaun.

Agriv8 - 18/10/12 at 06:31 AM

cheers Shaun, Davey I should have been able to guess that.

Plan tonight is to

See if the relay is permentantly switched on when Not connected to the car ( fingers crossed ).

Regards

Agriv8

Agriv8 - 18/10/12 at 08:12 PM

Hi chaps relay looks and sounds ok and is clicking in and out as the fuse is fitted.

So the circuit that energises the relay is likely goosed so looks like I need a new one or fit an inline relay,

There is a independent that can now remove component protection for 60 notes it in London which is a trip but better than giving the b4stards another 114 readys.

I am going to fire of an email.

regards agriv8

Agriv8 - 18/10/12 at 08:13 PM

Hi chaps relay looks and sounds ok and is clicking in and out as the fuse is fitted.

So the circuit that energises the relay is likely goosed so looks like I need a new one or fit an inline relay,

There is a independent that can now remove component protection for 60 notes it in London which is a trip but better than giving the b4stards another 114 readys.

I am going to fire of an email.

regards agriv8

[Edited on 18/10/12 by Agriv8]