Hi folks...

I was offered a Hillman Imp today, which would take a bike engine very nicely...or would it..?
Could the original gearbox be used ?

What way does the shaft rotate...?

could the 'box take the power?

or is there a diff (quaife etc) that could be used that runs the opposite way to normal..?

thanks in advance
Colin

The Imp engine rotates clockwise viewed frm the pulley end and the rotation can't be reversed by doing anything with the crown wheel because the part of the box where the crown wheel and pinion are located isn't symetrical.
Vixen Imp powered mid-engined single seaters were built using the Imp box simply by turning the geabox upside down.



Standard Imp box is no good for anything much more powerful than an Imp sport (52 bhp) Imp boxes will take 130 bhp but that involves fitting Jack Knight straight cut gears and replacing the bronze bushes with needle roller bearings . At those sort of power loads the die castalloy casing starts to become the limmiting factor, Skip Brown (I think it was he !) used to sell and external brace kit to try and hold the casing together so the crown wheel and the pinnion stayed in mesh. On the plus side loads of ratios used to be available and Jack Knight did a very nice pawl type LSD. I am pretty sure all of the above bits are now as rare as rocking horse droppings.

The box is all indirect and the top gear overal ratio was something like 4.15:1 first gear was a pretty low 16:1 approx

Ok...thanks for that.......

I've just been looking through various Imp sites now...and have sussed that the gearbox wouldn't be up to it...

Ok....back to the diff idea then.......

Any thoughts anyone...?

What about an upside down sierra diff...?

Well...

This may be a bit convoluted, but stick with me.

Clan Crusader and Davrian - both imp based right ? So anything that powers one of them could be feasible for an imp.

It just so happens that Drew Murray - old timer and Hillclimb sprint driver has a blade powered clan crusader - uses a sierra diff. Also, Roy Dawson of DJ Firehawk fame has a blade powered Davrian. He also uses a sierra diff, but in denuded state and much lightened.

So - it's possible.

P.S. Both of these are rear engined. I would be looking to lose the back seat and have a mid engined version.

Yep both the Clan and the Davrian are Imp based..
Don't think I know/know of Drew....

Ahhh.....I know Roy, didn't know he had a Davrian.
Did you know he had a crash on Monday at Croft?
He is due to get his new car this week...his old one was up for sale...

I had also thought of the mid engined idea.......

Just sussing out all possibilities just now....before diving in......

I like the idea of classic tax and insurance though....

Make a spaceframe to bolt in the back and run a chain driven diff. You don't need the back seats anyway. You'll need to uprate the front brakes as well, they were never fantastic.

[Edited on 31/3/05 by Peteff]

Pete,
that would be the obvious one....thinkin alternatives to the chain drive though first.....bit pricey

what kind of money's in a chain driven diff now anyway....they come down in price?

thanks for your input....

quote:

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Originally posted by colibriman
Yep both the Clan and the Davrian are Imp based..
Don't think I know/know of Drew....

Ahhh.....I know Roy, didn't know he had a Davrian.
Did you know he had a crash on Monday at Croft?
He is due to get his new car this week...his old one was up for sale...

I had also thought of the mid engined idea.......

Just sussing out all possibilities just now....before diving in......

I like the idea of classic tax and insurance though....

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yep..I saw it come back to the paddock and it didnt look too bad..but I only saw one side of it, by all accounts its not too badly damaged...mainly wishbones etc but the carbon body tub is damaged on the inside..

Can't you make a chain driven diff from one of the VW FWD gearboxes by taking the diff and bolting a sprocket to the crownwheel? I'm sure I've read about it somewhere.

No idea...
I'm really not familiar with the VW setup....if you find out anything let me know..!

thanks again Pete

I've just been speaking to Roy Dawson here in Scotland who has a Davrian (as mentioned previously) and he has really put me off the idea..saying the brakes and the suspension just aint up to it being such an old design...and if it was to race it just wouldn't be competitive etc.....to be honest I hadn't thought as far ahead as that..
The plus side is that he has a diff etc I could have.........

but now It's got me thinking about the brakes, suspension etc....anybody any comments?

ahh Pete,
just noticed you added the bit about the brakes........

Maybe you need to speak to an Imp specialist.
Give Graeme Wight a call - he could always pedal an Imp really hard

I think Graeme could pedal anything hard....

Roy was talking about a test day on at Kames on tuesday....you know anything Zil?

Shhhh - it's all very hush hush to keep numbers down.
Yes - I'm going.

Can you make it along for a wee hour or two ?

.....now we're talking....quietly

I think you need to talk to chris at Zed cars. I guess he will stick a bike engine into anything.
Also didn't the R1ot use a fiesta diff with a sprocket fitted????? I may be wrong.

Chris at Zcars is good but mega bucks though...

good idea...I'll have a look at the r1ot site....

cheers
Colin

Rallye Imp, and Sunbeam stilletto had pretty good disk setup on the front. Monte carlo shock upgrades were ok too (if they are still available!) I actually threw a set out a couple of years back. And I did come accross a mid engined Imp fitted with a stock SD1 engine once, complete with auto box.

I like Imps a lot, stick with your idea, dare to be different

John

John,
cool...thanks for your enthusiastic words..

so far it looks like I'm going to go for it....

I was thinking R1.....but I'm wondering now you've posted, about using a twin.....

I've got RSV1000, VTR1000 OR SP1......Hmmmmm

Hi Colin,
I'm always enthusiastic for other peoples projects, I'm not doing the work .

Seriously though, a few years back I was looking into fitting a bike engine into my Imp. (GSX1100F) There aint much room in the engine bay. The Imp engine is an amazingly compact design plus its installed at a fair slant, it would have required a heavily modified engine cowl. My next idea was to rip out all the back seats and firewall and slot in a big V, but it was a really tidy example and someone made me a OTT offer so she was sold.

I reckon they handled well with slightly wider wheels/tyres (165) but you could push the front easily. So a mid set up would seem the way to go and relatively straight forward...

John

Howa bout this

Very cute!

A chap that does the same hillclimb championship as me (Auto 66 - Yorkshire) used to do it in a 'Bird engined Mini! He's putting the bird into a Striker and to help funds is building a twin VTR1000 powered Fiat Cinquecento grass tracker! What a beaut....
But, as far as brakes are concerned they made some discs and are using 'Blade calipers. Now, with your connections Colin maybe you could source a couple of sets of similar calipers (two calipers/disc) and fit bike discs?

And as I said last time I saw you, the RSV looks like a peach, and didn't you have at least two of these kicking about?

Hi Coosie,

Yep I had 4 aprilia's...have 2 left....had them ages so I'd be better using them and keep selling the popular engines like R1's...

all sorts are currently going through my mind..including using 2 twins....

regarding bike calipers...its certainly worth looking at....annoying thing is...I recently gave away 2 blade calipers...doh..!

I'd do it if I was you Colin. Anything can be made to work, and if the Imp is cheap enough and you fancy a new project, it sounds spot-on! My next one may be an R1/RSV Fiat 500.....

Colin,
Over here in Malta Imps are very popular for hill climbs and 1/4 mile sprints. There is one that uses the same engine 1.o litre block bored out, 48 Webers, NOs etc.. The guy outran a Ferrari 288 GTO twin turbo!

I think it will be a very inetresing project and do not underestimate the reliability of the components.

Good luck!

Coosey.......

quote:

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and if the Imp is cheap enough and you fancy a new project, it sounds spot-on! My next one may be an R1/RSV Fiat 500.....

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Col,
Lets not forget... the Imp is a Scottish car. I think the only Scottish car

John

Yes...
they were built about 20 miles away from me...

Don't think they were the only Scottish car made....in years gone by, there were various ones....just can't think of the names of them.....

I can already picture the Scottish flag on the roof....