Hi,

Seen as you are the engine man, you may be able to help.

On a '98/99 Blade engine with the speedo sensor that bolts through the top of the crankcase, do you know what actually triggers it?

Is it a special triger wheel or one of the gears themselves?

Either way, I could do with the said ring and said sensor if you have either of them lying around anywhere.

Cheers,

Pat...

Hi Pat,

I've never had one apart to see what triggers it..give Marc at MNR a call as he had some in bits ages ago when I was there...

Meanwhile , as another option I was thinking about to your other thread...What about another set of blade clocks - an earlier set....

the 96/97 blade uses a sensor similar to the 98/99 one but its not mounted in the crankcase.

the 92-95 ones use a mechanical type speed sensor (ie spinny cable type not electrical sensor type)
I believe Hellfire 1 used this set up with the sensor 'wheel' turning with the prop..
(Hellfire..am I close?)

I have an earlier set of clocks (kms p/h though) and have a sensor wheel if you fancy trying that route.

let me know what you think...

cheeers
Colin

Cheers Colin.

IIRC, I have a 98/99 loom and all other associated bits and don't think the earlier clocks will work with my loom and if I have to get a new loom, that will only complicate/incur further expense.

I'll send Marc a message and see if has any ideas.

Have you got any fuel pumps lying around?

Cheers,

Pat...

IIRC, I've wired an older set of clocks to the 98/99 loom...they do work - not in my car. I used VDO gauges in mine

fuel pump...hmmm....I'll check, but I think I've only ones left with engine kits now.

Ah the old 'Blade speedo sensor chestnut again, one of lifes unanswered mysteries.
See previous posts and threads!
Anyway, my spinny speedo sensor is going to a clever man later this week to have the mystery unravelled once and for all hopefully, with a view to sourcing an appropriate third part electronic sender unit-cheaply. However if If anyones got a spare, cheap, gearbox type one as per Pats post i'll take it for investigation too.
IIRC Hell fire actually used the spinny electrical one on a bracket, run from the diff or driveshaft flang, i'm sure he'll confirm
HTH
Cheers
Nuther Colin

From what I can gather, the spinny thing sends the same pulse up the wire to the dials as the sensor I am after - unless I'm completely mistaken.

If that's the case, a simple sensor and a couple of magnets may do the job.

Pat...

I seem to remember hellfire running the sensor with a rubber wheel running against the prob or driveshaft (or sommat like that)

Reman - If you come up with a little box to replace the sender, I can try in on my '98/99 clocks and then we can all have a laugh if it works out that easy.

Pat...

hang on a mo...I'm getting all mixed up here... (that ain't difficult)

right...
the early blade has an electrical spinny thing..
I have one + clocks

the cbr1000 has non electrical cable thing....
I have that + clocks too..

hence my confusion..

so..what was the question...? haha

I think pre 98 engines pick up on the sprocket don't they, which is this little wheel thing you're on about Colin, and 98/99 have it all built into the gearbox. If, as I suspect it picks up on a gear, the earlier engine could easily be modded by drilling the block because the mounting boss is still there in the casting, although you'd need to split the engine before doing it to prevent swarf getting in there.

Andy Bates at AB Performance might be worth a call as he rebuilds blades all day every day, although mostly for racing so might not know too much about the speedo.

BTW, did you get my email about my head loom Colin?

[Edited on 14/6/05 by ChrisGamlin]

quote:

---

Originally posted by colibriman
hang on a mo...I'm getting all mixed up here... (that ain't difficult)

right...
the early blade has an electrical spinny thing..
I have one + clocks

the cbr1000 has non electrical cable thing....
I have that + clocks too..

hence my confusion..

so..what was the question...? haha

---

quote:

---

BTW, did you get my email about my head loom Colin?

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cant an hayness manual give you an drawing of the gearbox??

if it isn't there the unknown part then it isn't know where.

TKs

for speedo healers just make one your self

Cheers Colin, it's more use in my car ya know

TKS - Ive taken apart a couple of 99 engines and the gearboxes didnt appear to have any kind of trigger wheel etc in there, although there may be one integral to a cog or something that I didnt see, as I wasnt specifically looking for that.

I still like ythe idea that a different sender and magnets will work.

Will try and get hold of the later block sensor and then I can try and see what happens.

Watch this space.

Pat...

I'm almost convinced now that the sensor is just a Hall Effect do dar.

Watch this space (don't know what for - I'm weeks of having a rotating prop and engine in the car).

Pat...

quote:

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Originally posted by Avoneer
I still like ythe idea that a different sender and magnets will work.
Pat...

---

Reman - which clocks have you got then?

I'll U2U MarkN and Rizla and see if we can find out which sensor they used.

Pat...

No need to U2U. Marc's U2U said they used the later sensor (presumably the one that goes into the block) and two magnets.

Both sensors must be hall effect as the wiring diagrams are the same in the haynes and both have three wires.

Now just got to find that elusive sensor!

Pat...

quote:

---

Originally posted by Avoneer
Reman - which clocks have you got then?
Pat...

---

Ours was the spinny ELECTRICAL type sensor which runs off the bolt which holds the sprocket on (as described by Nuther Colin) but adapted to run off the diff output flange as a wheel. Worked an absolute treat and will be used again on the next Fireblade engined car.

[Edited on 15-6-05 by Hellfire]

I have a blade engine that used the sprocket type sensor. Conversion was relatively simple! I used a photo cell to trigger the speedo. Simplicity it’s self all I needed to do was paint white lines in the prop! To calibrate it I used the “new speed” spread sheet to calculate the number of pulses required with my diff. The blade sensor has four pulses per rev of the sprocket. The end result was I needed 2.5 pulses per revolution. This was achieved using a frequency divider i.e five white lines on the prop and divide by 2. Seemed relatively simple and it works – total cost less than £2.50. If any one is interested I could go into more detail, pics etc.

more details would be good.....!

quote:

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Originally posted by pk
. If any one is interested I could go into more detail, pics etc.

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you need an optocoupler...

and an couple of transistors..

the freq devider dunno how he did that but an way of doing is with an microcontroller..(there are easy ones that don't need much hassle..to run)

now lets wait and see what he tells.

Tks

Just got a price from Honda for a new one.

**UCK me - was more than three figures.

Time to email a load of breakers.

Pat...

Right - this is Andy's MNR and he has the early blade clocks with the needle temperature gauge (not digital) and is using the sensor from the later blade that bolts through the crankcase with two magnets on the prop shaft adaptor and a speedo healer and it all works fine.

So.... Both the older sensor with the wheel and the new sensor that bolts through the crankcase must give the same signal down the wire (unless the speedo healer compensates massively).

So... In theory, any sensor should work that gives off the same pulses.

Still go to get myself a sensor like the one in the pic, but it's great to know I can utilise all the blade clocks and very easily using the later speedo sensor.

Pat...

Gents,
Ive attached a word doc explaining how i resolved the pick issue using blade clocks.

Sorry, I don't see how this picks up any rotational pulses and how the sensor works and is mounted???

I have spoken to "Speedo Healer" now on a few occassions - very helpful guy and he has said that a reed switch, or a hall effect will work, as long as the input to the speedo healer is less than 5v and pulls the signal down to ground when the magnet passes.

I have found an original speedo sensor so will test further when it arrives.

Pat...

Just an ordinary

microcontroller in an case

And offcourse 1 pot to be able to adjust the devide quantity..

sample an 16F819 and do it your self..

Needings
- 1x 16F819
- 1x 7805
- 2x BC547C
- 2x 10KOhm resistor (7 to 15K)
- 1x 1K Ohm res (500 / 2K)
- 1x Pot 20K/Ohms

Hooking it up is straigt forward...
the pot in series with the res on the 5volt line and ground..(depending on our program we can then mannage the value with the number we want..adc value will be between 0 and 1024(10bit) sow enough steps possible.)

(adc port, adjust)
to porta.o channel an lead (coming from the pot/res connection)

vdd= 5volts 7805 output
vss = 7805 middle pin = chasis connected
7805 input = 12volts...

(input)
portb.0 connect it to 10K to 5volts..
connect pin also to collecter (pin 1 of the bc547c)

connect the middle with the 1k ohm to the sensor lead..

(output)
Connect portb. 4 to the other bc547 middle pin)

connect the collect to ground and the emitter is the input of the clock
(output of the unit)

then whats left is program the chip with an simple program....
(can make it for you in 5minutes)

Tks

ohja total costs will be less then 4 pounds....

what costs an healer unit?

[Edited on 20/6/05 by tks]

Ok, so I am guessing that bit replaces the Speedo Healer.

Any suggestions as what to use for the actual pickup and where to mount it?

Pat...

quote:

---

Originally posted by pk
Gents,
Ive attached a word doc explaining how i resolved the pick issue using blade clocks.

---

Whats a frequency divider?

I still like the simple idea of the original later sender, 2 magnets and a Speedo Healer.

Pat...

simple is always best