Well folks, here goes
The Tangerine dream finally gave up the ghost this morning due to a blocked oilway and the crank cried 'no more'. I now have to bite the bullet and decide what to do, I really don't want to throw any more money at the x-flow and have been offered a ZX9 motor at a very reasonable rate, so come on guys, I'm here to be persuaded. Put your best salesmans hats on and get to it. Don't forget that I work in the ideal place to do a transplant like this but also don't forget about all the stick I've dished out to all the BEC boys in the past. I think my back is broad enough tho', so any ZX9 advice would be gratefully recieved (Jasper, MK9R etc...)
Cheers

There goes then neighbourhood,

PTM you'll be buying a GERMAN motor next,

All the best Dan.

P.S. how do you like your rice.

P.P.S sorry to hear about the anchor.

My grandad isnt turning,he's spinning in his grave.

If you are going jap why not go 4age as its the BDA copy but better built,but i'm sure DEAN will have got you on that one

We didn't see that one coming did we children??

*SFX (tune) Colonel Bogie*

Da da.....da da da da.............

They made my grandad build a railway......etc, etc

You f*cking turncoat!!!!!

Cheers

Chris

BTW you didn't have to kill the crossflow

Come on, the more the merrier. I keep on telling you all it's selected bigotry. If I say it's ok, then it's ok! I know that I may also be the biggest hippocrite on this planet but hey if you're all having a go at me then at least you're leaving some other poor bugger alone!
Oh BTW I've been driving a BEC all afternoon at Elvington today as well. At least I only went grass tracking the once, oops

Hey chris
I didn't want to kill the x-flow, do you think I enjoyed being sat outside Roche abbey at 7am in the freezing cold waiting for MK to come past? I can assure you I would rather not spend the money! Plus I don't have the time to spare but at least I'm in the right place to make it as painless as possible.

Chris, iv'e only just gorrin, was hoping to post bout the x-flows demise, wot do i see, you spoiled my moment of pleasure, swine...........

see ya in mornin, i just need to move my spare blade to one side to get the car out 1st though..................

The abbey's haunted you know! (by a black monk, not the Burma railway victims)

Get your finger out anyway, 10 weeks to Le Mans! Let me know if I can help.

Cheers

Chris

Chris
Yuo can help by getting your car sorted and going in that! 900 miles in a BEC, could we stand it?

it's a hell of a test run, that!!

Cheers

Chris

Are you sure you are going to be able to handle the jump from a pedalo to a rocket?? :p

You know you want to do it, you were just in self denial! You'd better not bump into Graham Noton if thats the case!! :p

I think I can handle it. I've been wellying the GT1 round Elvington all afternoon and all I think about that is - more power please mister!

Well, well, well, I just dont know what to say ...... you'll be drinking cappucino and eating chiabatta next!!

You dont need any persuading, I recon you killed the x-flow just so you can make the move to a REAL engine.

Better loose the windscreen while your at it and get yourself a nice Jap lid too.

Welcome to the club mate!

I've just p#@sed myself larfing.

Or am i crying cos i'm not going,thats it there there bob calm down

I took great delite in removing a lump of old oily cast iron from the "dream machine" earlier today, lots a room left now for that nice ZX motor.........

Hi Jasper and crew
Thanks for the kind words, oh and I already have a nice red and white Shoei, thank you. Thanx goes to Mr Ison who could'nt wait to rag the old engine and 'box from the 'dream. Cheers mate. Check the photo archive for a very busy Mr Ison and friends. Who needs a winch when you've got a fork lift?

Chris, I'm going to follow this adventure with interest. I have the same installation as you are outing!

I am seriously considering the same conversion at the end of the summer, please keep the photos going into the archive and if you get chance, keep posting your progress etc.

Thanks, and good luck.

No problemo David, keep on checking the photos. I'm going to put the engine in the chassis tomorrow morning to see if I need to chop the sump, I'd rather not if I can help it. I'm also considering routing the exhaust under the engine and out the other side like F27 do with theirs, then I can keep the std 4-2-1 front system which I have. Anyhoo I'll keep you posted.

Think you'll get a shock when you see how far the standard sump hangs down chris, i picked up a seized engine for spares which had been in a locost, the sump plug had grounded out and unscrewed itself. Nice idea with the exhaust but i think you will have to go round the engine rather than under it. Anyhow good luck with the transplant.

wadders

Originally posted by locodude
No problemo David, keep on checking the photos. I'm going to put the engine in the chassis tomorrow morning to see if I need to chop the sump, I'd rather not if I can help it. I'm also considering routing the exhaust under the engine and out the other side like F27 do with theirs, then I can keep the std 4-2-1 front system which I have. Anyhoo I'll keep you posted.

This seems to be a well oiled exercise Mr Dude.

Almost, almost, as if it was planned in advance, in some bizzare parrallel universe.

You'll have it finished for wednes day when I come and see you.

Cheers

Skeptical.

well oiled ???????

i was bloody coverd in the stuff.........a locost with a X-Flow will never rust, take my word for it, we had greenpeace there, they thought it was another oil spill.....

Chris my friend, you must allways have a contingency plan, a back door, a way out if you will. I loved that old boat anchor and it cuts me to the quick that you think of me like that.
And Jon, your wit and ready humour is up as early as you are. Anyroad I'm off to the unit for some tank fabrication and engine transplanting, hi hoooo!

i will ring, make sure your in, an probably call by, if not see you in week with nice new black sticky fings.......

quote:

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I loved that old boat anchor and it cuts me to the quick that you think of me like that.

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Get that sump chopped if u dont want it sticking out of the bonnet. If MK cant do it, get the chap who did mine to. These engines seem to be taller than the blade, I dont think youll be able to do the exhaust thing if you route them under the engine.

With my sump chopped and the rest of the sump hanging 1.5 inch below the rails, I've got an inch clearance under the bonnet from the carbs.

Hi Jasper
Checked it out today with a quick test-fit. You guys are right, looks like 50mm off the bottom for me. Martin agrees and I'll get it done in the week some time. I know you were going to baffle it also, what did you do and where did you put the baffles?
I think the exhaust will have to come out of the side also. I have the original headers so we'll make one up from them. A man not a million miles from me has some tubing and a bender! Regarding the air filter, I'm going to try to use the original air box but mounted semi-remotely as I also know a man who can weld polypropelene! Chop out the mounting flange, turn the airbox upside down, join together with some fabricated trunking et voila (ish). If there's enough room anyway. I'll let you know how I get on. Engine should be fitted this week with a bit of luck, just need to chop a chassis rail to allow room for the oil filter, drill a few rivets out and were away.
Cheers lads

[Edited on 23/3/03 by locodude]

Personally i don't think you need baffles as such, all iv'e done with mine is chop off the bit that sticks up from the bottom of the original sump (around the pick up strainer) and weld it back on to the new flat sump bottom.
Shit thats hard to put in words, but really obvious when you hacksaw through the sump.
Rather than chop the chassis
could you not mount the oil filter remoteley?


ATB

wadders


]Originally posted by locodude
Hi Jasper
Checked it out today with a quick test-fit. You guys are right, looks like 50mm off the bottom for me. Martin agrees and I'll get it done in the week some time. I know you were going to baffle it also, what did you do and where did you put the baffles?
I think the exhaust will have to come out of the side also. I have the original headers so we'll make one up from them. A man not a million miles from me has some tubing and a bender! Regarding the air filter, I'm going to try to use the original air box but mounted semi-remotely as I also know a man who can weld polypropelene! Chop out the mounting flange, turn the airbox upside down, join together with some fabricated trunking et voila (ish). If there's enough room anyway. I'll let you know how I get on. Engine should be fitted this week with a bit of luck, just need to chop a chassis rail to allow room for the oil filter, drill a few rivets out and were away.
Cheers lads

[Edited on 23/3/03 by locodude]

Hi
I've seen the pics of a chopped sump and me and MK agree with you. I'll probably get the sump off tommorow and give it to martin to chop. As for the chassis rail it's no sweat really as it can be triangulated around it and as I've said the car is at MK so everything is at hand. Also not forgetting the engine will be solidly mounted, adding stiffness to the chassis. I've seen a couple of ST zxers and the engine sits really high in the chassis. The pics of Alex roebucks car show the oil filter above the lower chassis rail. ST must not have chopped the sumps on theirs, it shows because the carbs just stick thru' the bonnet. I tried my bonnet today and it just wont fit (by about 20mm), so a 50mm chop is on the cards.
Cheers

Baffle: you probably dont need to but I recon it can only help. I used a piece of thin aircraft grade ali (hard) and just sandwiched it between sump and block, with holes cut out for oil pick-up and the flexi pipe return. Very simple and quick to make, just needed an extra gasket (£8!)

BTW: If your gonna mount an oil pressure gauge rather than just a switch the chaps at EB Instruments recon it's best to remote mount then due to the high frequency vibration of the bike engine.

And it you want a copy of the cooling pipe diagram lay-out (though you chaps probably dont need it!) then check out the Yahoo list.

Let me know what happens with your airbox move - fancy making 2???

Hi Jasp
I cut the bottom off the sump today (with a very handy tilt bed band saw) and it loses quite a bit of capacity so I'm going to weld a 'box' to the side of it as well to keep the capacity the same. What have you guys done about the pick up pipe? I thought I may make one out of steel pipe the same dia. so I could still use the existing rubber seal, thats if it's too short to chop. Bloody glass filled plastic, I can't weld that
I'll see what happens with the airbox but I think it's going to be a tight fit. I've had a test fit and if I can extend it from the the carb inlet but keeping it no higher than the top corner of the carbs then we're on to a winner. It just means the airbox will be upside down.

Ey up Chris
shortened my pickup by cutting a section out of the middle and sticking the two halves back together with sikaflex,when that was dry i ran a fillet of sikaflex all the way round, i'm just hoping the oil dont melt the stuff.
Good idea about the extra box welded on, never thought of that.

ATB

wadders

]Originally posted by locodude
Hi Jasp
I cut the bottom off the sump today (with a very handy tilt bed band saw) and it loses quite a bit of capacity so I'm going to weld a 'box' to the side of it as well to keep the capacity the same. What have you guys done about the pick up pipe? I thought I may make one out of steel pipe the same dia. so I could still use the existing rubber seal, thats if it's too short to chop. Bloody glass filled plastic, I can't weld that
I'll see what happens with the airbox but I think it's going to be a tight fit. I've had a test fit and if I can extend it from the the carb inlet but keeping it no higher than the top corner of the carbs then we're on to a winner. It just means the airbox will be upside down.

If I were to do that then I'd put a sleeve on the inside to make sure. At least when it's trapped between the sump pan and pick-up inlet it couldn't go anwhere even if the Sikaflex broke down. If it were sleeved and the cut was clean then an 'o' ring would do as a seal. Just a thought.

My chap who chopped mine did the same, just cut the mid section out, turned down one end slighty so it was a nice tight fit, then glued it as well. Don't know what glue he used, but he's a race car engineer so I trust it will be fine. I didn't think the oil loss would be very much, but it can only be a good idea to add the extyra back in. Have you re-welded the sump plug on the side - a very good idea to stop it getting knocked off

Im not sure sikaflex will be up to the job to be honest, I'd think you ideally need something a little more permanent and solid than that, as Sikaflex is primarily designed as a sealant rather than a glue. I'm not sure what John used on yours Jasper, I would imagine something like Araldite or a Loctite product. Once the sump is in situ though, the pickup is held in position by the sump, so shouldnt be any worries of it coming away.

Chris

Araldite springs to mind, but I may be wrong, I often am! But it certainly can't go anywhere anyway

[Edited on 25/3/03 by Jasper]

As an ex-adhesives salesman I know that glass filled plastics are notoriously difficult to bond together, I doubt very much wether it would be a permanent solution. I think the machining/sleeving idea is the best as like has been said the pickup is trapped anyway!
Jasper, I'm going to weld the sump plug on the side (not much done today, v.hectic day!)
p.s. where's the best place for a sump gasket?

quote:

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p.s. where's the best place for a sump gasket?

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swine, just wot i was gonna put.....

Oh - just too easy....

Get if from your nearest Kawasaki dealer, your gonna need to make friends anyway, oil filter, plugs etc....

Oooh you're all soooo helpfull!

Anyhoo mr gibbs what are you doing lurking on OUR part of the list eh, you with your big old boat anchor of an engine, you don't know quality engineering when you see it

Ahhhhhh vely solly,

Locodude san.

Flied Lice with that?

Ahso

Clis

Oh, very droll, especially the new Avatar. I'd have replied earlier only I've been to the pub, you know, they serve beer? Gets you out of the house you know.
See you tomorrow big guy!

I've just finished the same conversion go for it. If you want any pictures etc let me know.