Well this guy tops em all


BBC NEWS
'Why should I live by Gypsies?'

By Helen Grady
Producer, Beyond Westminster

Every year millions of pounds are spent by local councils on evicting Gypsies and travellers from illegal camp sites. The government thinks the answer is to create more authorised sites, but who should decide where they go?

Len Gridley has some problems with his neighbours. The first is that there are 1,000 of them. The second is that they have set up what has become Europe's biggest illegal traveller site next to his back garden.

"All I want is for the council to clear the site," said Mr Gridley as he showed the 8ft fence he has fitted to separate his garden from his neighbours' homes.

"Who wants to live next to a Gypsy and traveller site? My house used to be worth £500,000 and now it's worth £150,000. No one wants to live here. People have sold up at a loss just to get away."

The site is in Cray's Hill, a picturesque village in the Essex countryside, which has become the focus of a planning row that is likely to cost the local council £3m.

Illegal settlement

The site backing onto Mr Gridley's bungalow is known as Dale Farm. It is owned by Gypsies and Irish Travellers, some of whom have been living there since the 1970s.

Grattan Puxon, a spokesman for the Dale Farm Residents, said the site expanded after some families bought an old scrap yard adjoining the original site. "As the families got bigger, they believed it was a quite a reasonable idea to clean up the old scrap yard and move onto it," he explained.
“ This is somewhere for us to live, plus somewhere for us to get our kids looked after in the lines of doctors and dentists and education ”
Jean Sheridan, traveller

But only half of the Dale Farm site has planning permission and more than 400 people are facing eviction following a ruling by the Law Lords in May.

Basildon District Council, has spent almost £1m on the legal battle to evict the Travellers and set aside another £2m to pay for bailiffs to clear the illegal section of the site.

Council leader Tony Ball said it was worth the cost, adding "It's quite clear - they are living on green belt land without planning permission. UK law says that site has to be restored to green belt. What price upholding the law? The alternative is anarchy."

But families at Dale Farm claim they have nowhere else to go. And, although they are travellers by birth, they say they need a base.

"I don't know how to read or write," said Jean Sheridan, a mother-of-four. "I've been brung up like a proper traveller - travelling from site to site and on the roads constantly, so I never got the chance to go to school and get an education.

"This is somewhere for us to live, plus somewhere for us to get our kids looked after in the lines of doctors and dentists and education and things like that."

"I'd be happy to move if they could find us another site," added a neighbour, who asked not to be named. "But nobody wants us, so where are they going to put us?"

Political dilemma

That is a dilemma politicians have been grappling with for decades. So far, a solution seems elusive. Although most Gypsies and travellers live in authorised sites, it still costs councils in England at least £18m a year to evict people from illegal sites.
# is broadcast on BBC Radio 4 on Saturday 1 August 2009 at 1100 BST Catch up later on the BBC

The government thinks the best way to cut these costs is to create more authorised sites and is offering councils £32m each year in grants for these sites.

There is some evidence to suggest this approach could work. Kent has 17 council-run sites across the county and has slashed its eviction costs by 80%.

But other local authorities have proved reluctant even to identify Gypsy and traveller sites, never mind creating council-run ones.

In England, each region must agree how many sites each local council will set aside for Gypsies and travellers in a document called the Regional Spatial Strategy.

However, some councils are threatening to take legal action rather than agreeing, even in principle, to provide what they see as "more than their fair share."

Candy Sheridan, a Liberal Democrat councillor in North Norfolk and a member of an Irish Traveller family, said a big part of the problem is that even authorised sites are unpopular with the settled community.

"There is no ideal site," said Ms Sheridan. "I sit on a planning committee and whenever the word Gypsy or traveller comes in, you get hundreds of people coming to public meetings and everybody is goaded up to say no to planning permission.

"Councillors who have signed up to creating new sites have lost their seats. What you have to do is take the responsibility away from local politicians."

At the moment, even though councils must assess the housing needs of Gypsies and travellers and have a strategy for meeting those needs, there is no legal duty to provide sites.

Labour MP Clive Betts, a member of the Communities and Local Government Select Committee, thinks that should change.

He told the BBC: "I think a lot of local authorities would welcome a statutory duty to have to do something because at least then they can go to their residents and say, 'we have to do something, let's find the best sites'."

Extra sites

But shadow local government spokesman Bob Neil said such decisions should be made at a local level and that the Conservatives would scrap the Regional Spatial Strategy.

Meanwhile Basildon District Council is advertising for bailiffs to evict the illegal Dale Farm residents and councillors are resisting calls to provide an extra 60 Gypsy and traveller pitches as part of the Regional Spatial Strategy.

Said Coun Ball: "If every authority in the country took an additional seven pitches that would deal with the demand that's out there at the moment.

"We would take seven extra pitches. But it is inequitable that, while Basildon already provides a 100, some are not providing any."

is broadcast on BBC Radio 4 on Saturday 1 August at 1100 BST. Or listen again via the BBC
Or download the programme

Should Gypsies and travellers be housed on official sites funded by the taxpayer? Who should decide where they go - councils or Central Government? Are you a traveller? Do you live near an authorised site for travellers or an illegal camp? Send us your comments by filling in the form below.

A selection of your comments may be published, displaying your name and location unless you state otherwise in the box below.

Story from BBC NEWS:
http://news.bbc.co.uk/go/pr/fr/-/1/hi/uk_politics/8171273.stm

Published: 2009/08/01 01:26:51 GMT

© BBC MMIX

I used to live a stones throw from the traveller camp at Cottingley Springs in Leeds and had no end of bother with them. There was also an occasion when they moved into a carpark at the back of my house.

I'd have no real problems living next to a caravan park or travellers, if they weren't.... burning tyres, fighting, harrasing and intimidating locals, leaving the place looking like a sh1thole, riding their quadbikes illegally down my road in the middle of the night etc etc.

What gets me is that in Leeds they have been given a place they can live but they've destroyed it, it's an absolute dump, they've stolen the roof tiles off the buildings (I think they're washrooms) the council provided for them, there's gas canisters and crap everywhere and there was a stage not so long back where there would be a new burnt out car outside there pretty much every saturday, sunday and monday morning!



[Edited on 1/8/09 by eznfrank]

I agree that they should all have access to doctors! They should all be sterilised or put down at birth.

They have moved into the carpark next to work for the umpteth time and they leave the place like a s*******tip.

Two years ago they were shooting at each other.......last year they had a war in the local grave yard at a funeral There was riot police called in and several pikeys got arrested for carrying weapons.....

[Edited on 1-8-09 by mangogrooveworkshop]

they're all still at the bottom of my road, lighting fires. came home after work last night and saw smoke. it was only a bon fire next to a caravan.
and then i saw 2 huge ugly things standing by the side of the road

wonder why they don't get their vans taken off them. surely they can't all be taxed, insured, mot'd etc. they must show up on anpr

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Originally posted by blakep82

wonder why they don't get their vans taken off them. surely they can't all be taxed, insured, mot'd etc. they must show up on anpr

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Originally posted by PaulBuz

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Originally posted by blakep82

wonder why they don't get their vans taken off them. surely they can't all be taxed, insured, mot'd etc. they must show up on anpr

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The simple answer is that the police are scared of them.
Gypsies rely on intimidation, big blokes with big dogs of almost equal IQ.
I would send in the army... they're not bullet proof.

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Originally posted by PaulBuz

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Originally posted by blakep82

wonder why they don't get their vans taken off them. surely they can't all be taxed, insured, mot'd etc. they must show up on anpr

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The simple answer is that the police are scared of them.
Gypsies rely on intimidation, big blokes with big dogs of almost equal IQ.
I would send in the army... they're not bullet proof.

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What do you think they'd do if their vans were confiscated? If you said "steal another one" then you probably understand half the reason the police don't make a big issue of it. Other half is it's hard for move them on if they're on foot so they stay being a problem on your crime figures rather than for the next towns BIB.

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Originally posted by iank
What do you think they'd do if their vans were confiscated? If you said "steal another one" then you probably understand half the reason the police don't make a big issue of it. Other half is it's hard for move them on if they're on foot so they stay being a problem on your crime figures rather than for the next towns BIB.

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What do you think they'd do if their vans were confiscated? If you said "steal another one" then you probably understand half the reason the police don't make a big issue of it. Other half is it's hard for move them on if they're on foot so they stay being a problem on your crime figures rather than for the next towns BIB.

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Originally posted by omega 24 v6

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What do you think they'd do if their vans were confiscated? If you said "steal another one" then you probably understand half the reason the police don't make a big issue of it. Other half is it's hard for move them on if they're on foot so they stay being a problem on your crime figures rather than for the next towns BIB.

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Oh well that makes it all Ok then??????? Lets all become Pikey scum and do what we want with no fear of the law. This country sucks BIG TIME

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A few years back the police here went onto a camp and seized 3 caravans and a couple of Navaras plus some Husky dogs which were identified as stolen as well so some of the pikeys were walking and nothing to live in. It doesn't happen often enough though and it cost £30,000 of local council tax to clean up after they'd gone.

And it's about this time of year Whitby has the Pikey Carnies in town. It's the start of the show season and generally the Show Gippos are OK. It's the dozens of 'we'll tarmac your drive, fit double glazing, dig your garden, steal your shed' hangers-on that fight, steal and get into trouble. As soon as they are here, the local BiB set up a mobile police station next to the field set aside by the council (at our cost) to keep an eye on them. The council have already rebuilt the shower blocks and toilets after they destroyed them last year. And they've got six big skips for them to not bother with as they can just throw rubbish wherever they want...............

If they moved into our street, the council would probably think they'd got into my shed 'o' doom and trashed the joint the way it looks right now...



The concept I struggle with is that they are 'travellers' yet the site in essex has been there since the 60s and some of the gaffs have less wheels than a surfboard.

Did you know that Gypsies are now oficially recognised as an ethnic minority? I had to do a study and presentation on gypsies, travellers and showpeople in Salford earlier this year. Went round to their homes and had a chat. Got on real well with the showpeople, they'd just bought an 8ft folding machine.

Gypsy's have always been recognised as an ethnic minority as they are one in the truest sense, travellers in general are not.

Gang warfare is the only effective way to see off the maruading kind, you need to find your self some fixed place pikeys or some gangsters or something.

Irish travellers gained ethnic minority status August 2000. What I found interesting too is that a lot, around Salford anyhow, live in what they call "bricks and mortar" houses. That is regular housing and still class themselves as gypsies or travellers and fall under the minority umbrella.

The "show" gypsies I wouldn't count as typical gypsies, they travel because it's an essential part of the job. I went to school and was friends with 2 brothers whose parents had a mobile video arcade and a few kiddy rides. One of the nicest families you could wish to meet. Not of Irish origin and absolutely despised the pikeys and the way "they" had made travellers in general second class citizens. That being said, I wouldn't want to cross either of the brothers or their dad, they'd learnt to look after themselves pretty well over the years!!

You're right, though the 'show gypsies' hate to be called gypsies and despise them mainly because of the trouble they cause and the fact that they get labelled as part of the causers. In Salford they've actually put a gate on their land to stop the police storming in and mistaking them for the travellers next door. Like you say they travel as part of their work and are actually called 'showpeople'. They have their own showpersons guild and have a regular newspaper you can get. Very friendly people actually and some have taken to making fast food trailers as a money booster which means they have some handy tools.

A few years ago a friend of mine was a barman at a trditional romany wedding and although they knew how to look after themselve there was no trouble at the bar he worked at. Nana and grandad of the bride turned up in a traditional caravan. They werent shy about spending their money and looking after my mate in terms of tips

The only problem was when a load of yobs turned up after the bash and started trash talking and getting lary. They were soon taught the error of their ways in the carpark but noone else had any trouble.

I think they must spend a hell of a lot of their tax free cash on weddings. My missus did floristry at college and they spent about 3-4 full days just on gypsy weddings!!

Well IF they are Travellers, why do then need to have a base camp / stay in one place.

By the very nature of their lifestyle they should be moving on regularly.

If they stay and live in one place, then they arent travellers, and therefore should live in proper houses / properites.

Also they are bound by the same laws as us. If I put up another house in my garden the council would soon make me take it down. The rules and laws should apply to everyone equally.