Jubal
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| posted on 5/9/06 at 09:22 PM |
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Winter upgrade - which engine?
My Indy has a 919 blade engine but I fancy going a bit faster next season. From searching on here it looks like there's no simple engine upgrade
and it might be better to sell the car and buy one with more beef but the market seems pretty pants for blade cars. Mine is slightly tatty too but it
handles like a dream and I think I'd rather keep a good 'un, plus I'm ready for the experience as long as I don't bite off
more than I can chew.
Any thoughts on what the simplest upgrade path would be that's actually worth the effort?
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Hellfire
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| posted on 5/9/06 at 09:23 PM |
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Depends how deep your pockets are but I'd go Turbo........
Phil
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StevieB
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| posted on 5/9/06 at 09:31 PM |
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Be different to everyone and put an Aprilia Mille in?
Not sure if it'd be any faster, but it would certainly be fairly unique.
(it might cost a fortubne and be totally useless, but then at least the rest of will know not to bother )
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Coose
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| posted on 5/9/06 at 09:32 PM |
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Pants to smelly turbos, supercharger all the way!
Spin 'er off Well...
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StevieB
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| posted on 5/9/06 at 09:34 PM |
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Might as well get economies of scale and buy an iso full of engines - it'll make it cheaper in the long run when they blow up!
(don't 919 engines have a tendancy to throw conrods out?)
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Coose
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| posted on 5/9/06 at 09:35 PM |
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quote:
Originally posted by StevieB
Might as well get economies of scale and buy an iso full of engines - it'll make it cheaper in the long run when they blow up!
(don't 919 engines have a tendancy to throw conrods out?)
Ah now, that's a sore point with some people..... 
I still think it may be down to the fact that the oil was never changed since he built the car....
Spin 'er off Well...
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givemethebighammer
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| posted on 5/9/06 at 09:37 PM |
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How far away dimension wise is a blackbird engine. I thought they were basically a blade engine with a longer stroke and a different head ?
I might be wrong though.
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StevieB
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| posted on 5/9/06 at 09:42 PM |
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I think the blackbird engine needs to be dry sumped.
Plus, I was chatting to one of the guys from MK at Newark and he said they had no end of problems with their blackbird demo car - they've now
got a GSXR1000 engined car, which they seem to like an awful lot.
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Jon Ison
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| posted on 5/9/06 at 09:43 PM |
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If it was me, its not, but if it was, ZX12, R1 in that order.
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Jubal
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| posted on 5/9/06 at 09:48 PM |
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One of the lads at work thinks a supercharger is the way to go too. But I will be the first to admit I don't have the skills to tread a new
path.
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StevieB
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| posted on 5/9/06 at 09:50 PM |
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quote:
Ah now, that's a sore point with some people.....
I still think it may be down to the fact that the oil was never changed since he built the car....
Not like Mark to bodge things last minute or forget something so important - totally out of character!
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caber
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| posted on 5/9/06 at 09:50 PM |
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RV8 out of a crashed TVR! There is no replacement for displacement! also V8 sound much better than a screeching bike!
Caber
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Jubal
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| posted on 5/9/06 at 09:51 PM |
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Is that choice based upon ease of install?
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JoelP
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| posted on 5/9/06 at 09:55 PM |
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new zx10 would be my primary choice, obviously nearly new and much lighter than zx12 etc.
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Jubal
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| posted on 5/9/06 at 09:56 PM |
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quote:
Originally posted by Jon Ison
If it was me, its not, but if it was, ZX12, R1 in that order.
Again, which do you think is easier to install? R1 been done more too.
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Jubal
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| posted on 5/9/06 at 09:57 PM |
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quote:
Originally posted by JoelP
new zx10 would be my primary choice, obviously nearly new and much lighter than zx12 etc.
Mr yorkshire engines always pushes these too. I'm tempted. Has anyone got a cradle off the shelf for it yet?
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Jon Ison
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| posted on 5/9/06 at 10:02 PM |
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Too do either you would need........
New cradle.
Exhaust manifold.
Prob prop shaft alterations.
Electrical work for engine loom.
Upgrade fuel pump if yours isn't injection.
Cost offset by selling your engine package, advertise it whilst still in car, potential buyers can here see, test it running, gives more confidence
too buyer, reflects in the price they will pay.
Either option as plenty off guys on here who have experience of both, not difficult too fit either, honest.
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Hellfire
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| posted on 5/9/06 at 10:09 PM |
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quote:
Originally posted by JoelP
new zx10 would be my primary choice, obviously nearly new and much lighter than zx12 etc.
Best price I've seen for a ZX10 though is the thick end of £2,000. Apparently very good engines - love to see one go into a seven
Phil
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Jubal
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| posted on 5/9/06 at 10:19 PM |
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quote:
Originally posted by Hellfire
Best price I've seen for a ZX10 though is the thick end of £2,000. Apparently very good engines - love to see one go into a seven
Phil
That price is good compared with the turbo option you were proposing a few posts ago! Plus a recent R1 isn't much less. An older R1 is cheaper
but not sure how much of a real world improvement I'd see.
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StevieB
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| posted on 5/9/06 at 10:34 PM |
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If you take the original bikes as a guide, the R1 is far superior to the blade right up until a year or two ago when the blade was totally redesigned.
When it was first launched, the R1 was a sensation due to the amount of power it prioduced and the fact it was such a compact unit
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the_fbi
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| posted on 5/9/06 at 10:43 PM |
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I've got exactly the same dilemma but mines not even finished yet!
I already have a 954 complete too which I could fit, but I think the best route when i come to an upgrade will be to stick throttle bodies on it and
install Microsquirt.
Cost should be sub £400 and it keeps the reliability of the 919 which is superiour to the 954.
No costly exhaust, prop, wiring, instrument, cradle, sump issues, just going from carbs to FI and programmable mapping too for extra fun.
Bang for buck it has to be the way forward for 919 owners.
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Jubal
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| posted on 5/9/06 at 11:07 PM |
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quote:
Originally posted by the_fbi
I've got exactly the same dilemma but mines not even finished yet!
I already have a 954 complete too which I could fit, but I think the best route when i come to an upgrade will be to stick throttle bodies on it and
install Microsquirt.
Cost should be sub £400 and it keeps the reliability of the 919 which is superiour to the 954.
No costly exhaust, prop, wiring, instrument, cradle, sump issues, just going from carbs to FI and programmable mapping too for extra fun.
Bang for buck it has to be the way forward for 919 owners.
What improvement are you forecasting? Are you making up the parts yourself? Interested to hear more.
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DIY Si
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| posted on 5/9/06 at 11:18 PM |
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I'd like to second the blackbird engine. It only needs drysumping if you intend fast track days. Mine's fine for as-fast-as-I-can-go road
use. It's also actually capable of 0-60 in roughly 4/4.5 secs.
“Let your plans be dark and as impenetratable as night, and when you move, fall like a thunderbolt.”
Sun Tzu, The Art of War
My new blog: http://spritecave.blogspot.co.uk/
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the_fbi
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| posted on 5/9/06 at 11:21 PM |
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quote:
Originally posted by Jubal
quote:
Originally posted by the_fbi
I've got exactly the same dilemma but mines not even finished yet!
I already have a 954 complete too which I could fit, but I think the best route when i come to an upgrade will be to stick throttle bodies on it and
install Microsquirt.
Cost should be sub £400 and it keeps the reliability of the 919 which is superiour to the 954.
No costly exhaust, prop, wiring, instrument, cradle, sump issues, just going from carbs to FI and programmable mapping too for extra fun.
Bang for buck it has to be the way forward for 919 owners.
What improvement are you forecasting? Are you making up the parts yourself? Interested to hear more.
Realistically I've not even thought about power increase, they'll be one, but mostly a driveability improvement and smoothness of FI.
Its really just my way of moving forwards towards my 954 without using it, as its still not proven in BECs, plus the additional costs which will be an
easy £600 for exhaust & sump + all the wiring changes for the HISS system, unless I get a USA loom/ECU which is more cost again.
Yes I could stick microsquirt on the 954 but all that would save would be the HISS wiring.
After the microsquirt has been on there a bit and the 919 getting tired, theoretically a busa (as Westfield do a cradle for it) could be dropped in
using the same management just with a few sensor changes, manifold and prop. Or any engine if I made a cradle, + manifold + prop.
Just seems like a good starting point to upgrade the 919 to. Even if its still the same bhp it'll be doing it smoother, and it also means a
cleaner engine loom install.
All theory at the moment though and won't happen this year unless I get a move on!
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Jubal
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| posted on 5/9/06 at 11:27 PM |
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You can keep smoothness, I want power
Plus, the car is a trackday car first and foremost. Engine upgrade will be accompanied by new roll bar.
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