Johneturbo
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| posted on 12/12/10 at 04:54 PM |
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ZZR1400 start up woes
Had a go at trying to fire up the engine today but with no luck
i've go a 100ohm resistor in place. i'm using the same injection pump i used on the R1 but with a fuel presure regulator
there is a W/R wire thats for the bikes fuel pump, i was using that to turn the pump on but nothing primes
checking the 100ohm resistor with a multimeter it's showing 98.8 ohms does it have to be 100ohms exactly?
engine turns over but thats all, i also have the bike clocks only error i get is fuel empty but that i think is becuase i don't have the fuel
level switch
anything i missed?
cheers
john
ETA i have stripped a lot of wires from the lighting circuit, which included a relay box but that was for lights only
[Edited on 12/12/10 by Johneturbo]
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minitici
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| posted on 12/12/10 at 05:43 PM |
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Which ECU are you using?
USA - without immobiliser
or
UK - with immobiliser?
Have you checked all the usual suspects:
Tilt switch
Sidestand switch
start/stop switch
Clutch switch
If everything is wired up right the system primes and secondary butterflies cycle on power up.
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Johneturbo
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| posted on 12/12/10 at 05:57 PM |
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It's a USA ecu and loom
Have the usual suspects connected clutch switch, side stand, engine stop
with ignition on butterflies don't do anything or get any prime from pump
i have a 68ohm resistor for the tilt switch which i know works as without i get FI error on clocks
maybe my 100ohm is out of tolerance
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minitici
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| posted on 12/12/10 at 07:30 PM |
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I suspect that the 98 ohm would not make a significant difference (assuming you are not still using the original keyswitch).
Do you have the original tilt switch which you could fit instead of the 68 ohm resistor?
Perhaps the ECU may be looking for something other than a fixed resistance?
My other inital thought is you may have inadvertently cut a ground connection to the ECU by removing some of the 'redundant' wiring.
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Johneturbo
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| posted on 12/12/10 at 07:48 PM |
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No don't have the tilt switch. i got the info on the 68ohm resistor from
HERE
and no i don't have the key switch
I'm hoping it's something silly like a missing earth,i have a multimeter so will have to check each pin
i really can't think what i've missed i've studied wiring diagram, i guess if the ecu isn't happy it won't send power to
the fuelpump wire i'm using
ho hum the joys
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minitici
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| posted on 12/12/10 at 08:08 PM |
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According to the manual there should be 3.55 to 4.45 volts between the Y/G lead and BR/BK lead when the tilt sensor is connected to the ECU and the
tilt sensor is upright.
Can you probe the Y/G lead and the cut off BR/BK lead and confirm that you get this voltage range when the ignition is on.
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minitici
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| posted on 12/12/10 at 08:13 PM |
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Just re-read the article and it says you should have fitted a 68K resistor NOT a 68 ohm resistor!!!!!!
[Edited on 12/12/10 by minitici]
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Johneturbo
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| posted on 12/12/10 at 08:58 PM |
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sorry yes i think it's a 68K resistor i have. it's a 5 band one. blue 6 then grey 8 then black 0 then something else i can't remeber
as it's in the garage!
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skippad
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| posted on 13/12/10 at 08:51 AM |
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I kept the tilt switch and filled with silicone to imobilise ballbearing.
Have you kept all the earth wires on loom and connected them all?.
are you sure your in neutral when starting?
Im trying to remember all the stages we went through to start my engine, but it was two and half years ago.
I also used the 1400 fuel pump (with its own regulator) which plugged straight into loom.
We didnt cut any wires off loom till we got it started!
I'll get in touch with mate who helped, see if he can recall any other details.
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Johneturbo
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| posted on 13/12/10 at 03:23 PM |
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ok not sure if this is right i checked the grey wire that goes into the ecu and i'm gettin 11.4v is that right i thought it should be lower? but
if i check just the 100ohm resistor it says 98.1
Engine is in neutral. i've checked earths only ones missing are the lightin circuits from what i can see.
funny thing is i get the same effect with or without that grey wire connected ie clocks light up can even turn engine over
[Edited on 13/12/10 by Johneturbo]
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Johneturbo
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| posted on 13/12/10 at 05:40 PM |
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Ok all Sorted it was the resistor!! blooming 10p part,it was just below what it needed to be.. i bought a couple more from maplins and they were 100.1
straight away pump primed and butterflies moved even fired up, but i dont have a manifold so was just a quick catch then shut it down
yay 
thanks for the advice guys and this might help someone else who has the same problem, just unlucky i guess
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minitici
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| posted on 13/12/10 at 07:55 PM |
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Excellent result - glad you got it sorted.
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skippad
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| posted on 13/12/10 at 11:34 PM |
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Glad you got sorted.
Are using a shortened baffle sump?
You'll need one!
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Johneturbo
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| posted on 14/12/10 at 07:32 PM |
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I have spoken to Andy about his sumps......i have about 50mm clearance from the drain plug, but will get everything else done first, maybe even a
quick blast around the block!
quick question about your cooling system, how is your header tank plumbed into the system
i was thinking the top hose from the header tank can go with the small hose from the thermostat into the top of the polo rad with the little outlet on
it. but where have you but your outlet from the header
cheers
john
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skippad
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| posted on 15/12/10 at 10:02 PM |
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John
The small pipe does go to top of rad with a T piece to top of header tank.
The bottom outlet on header tank i have T pieced into bottom hose that goes from rad to water pump
dave
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adithorp
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| posted on 16/12/10 at 12:57 PM |
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quote:
Originally posted by skippad
John
The small pipe does go to top of rad with a T piece to top of header tank.
The bottom outlet on header tank i have T pieced into bottom hose that goes from rad to water pump
dave
Thats as it should be in an ideal world, but my bottom connection from the header goes into the top hose as thats was easier to route (the pipe goes
strieght past it) and it works well.
50mm sounds very low when you account for drive under braking.
"A witty saying proves nothing" Voltaire
http://jpsc.org.uk/forum/
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skippad
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| posted on 16/12/10 at 01:13 PM |
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quote:
Originally posted by adithorp
quote:
Originally posted by skippad
John
The small pipe does go to top of rad with a T piece to top of header tank.
The bottom outlet on header tank i have T pieced into bottom hose that goes from rad to water pump
dave
Thats as it should be in an ideal world, but my bottom connection from the header goes into the top hose as thats was easier to route (the pipe goes
strieght past it) and it works well.
50mm sounds very low when you account for drive under braking.
Which engine are you talking about?
The tried and tested way (on a 1400) is how i plumbed it in.
Surely your flow will be the wrong way.
Regarding the sump, this needs to be addressed as soon as its on road, as the sump plug is the first part you hit (after sump guard is ground off).
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Johneturbo
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| posted on 16/12/10 at 03:32 PM |
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Ta Dave, wasn't sure with top or bottom pipe, i'll go with what works.
Adrian, on the R1 i had my header outlet plumbed into that small hose that also connects to the pump it had a t piece fitted, seemed to work ok
i know i will need to address the sump sooner than later, i do know of a dax rush that runs the standard 14 sump, but the ride height gets measured in
feet
Minitici, i think you said you run a fuel pressure regulator as well. i've fitted mine but haven't connected the vacuum pipe, does that
just get plumbed into the end of the vacuum pipes on the Tb's the end one with the stopper? or do i need a T piece
cheers
john
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thurso
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| posted on 22/3/13 at 03:25 PM |
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zzr1400
hi similar problem, engine turns over and has spark and fuel at cylinders...but wont fire.....any ideas guys
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minitici
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| posted on 22/3/13 at 04:19 PM |
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quote:
Originally posted by thurso
hi similar problem, engine turns over and has spark and fuel at cylinders...but wont fire.....any ideas guys
If you are getting sparks and fuel from the injectors then it could be a couple of things:
1. Wet plugs - petrol soaked bike plugs just don't work (and seldom recover).
Try a brand new set of plugs (after charging the battery first).
2. Battery low - in this cold weather you need a good battery charge.
3. Injector and/or stick coil leads on the wrong cylinders - quite easy to fit from the wrong end of the engine if you have had the looms off!
4. Old fuel.
Douglas.
[Edited on 22/3/13 by minitici]
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thurso
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| posted on 22/3/13 at 08:34 PM |
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zzr1400
Doug hi
yes have wet plugs ..... pressumed because it wont fire
battery was freshly charged
fuel is old but it started earlier
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thurso
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| posted on 14/4/13 at 04:25 PM |
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zzr1400
hi folks still working on this problem
now find that there is only fuel to one cylinder? other 3 bone dry?
any further ideas welcomed
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