Alan B
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| posted on 26/4/03 at 07:47 PM |
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Coram LMP
I guess many of you have followed the progress of this car, as I have, and may have heard that they wont be at Stoneleigh....
They say basically they won't have a good enough car ready to show......
My question is, is this a good move?
OK, you should have a first class product to show....but, how long can you take the risk that you might wee people off before they buy something else
like the MK GT 1 for instance....
Surely, not having a presence at Stonleigh is a BIG mistake.....
Any thoughts?
[Edited on 26/4/03 by Alan B]
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chrisg
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| posted on 26/4/03 at 08:02 PM |
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Yeah, Stoneleigh is the big one, strikes me as a little strange that it was good enough to show at the Autosports show but not now.
I think a lot of people will be expecting to see it.
Personaly I can't get on with the "bulge" at the sort of screen position
Cheers
Chris
Note to all: I really don't know when to leave well alone. I tried to get clever with the mods, then when they gave me a lifeline to see the
error of my ways, I tried to incite more trouble via u2u. So now I'm banned, never to return again. They should have done it years ago!
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Alan B
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| posted on 26/4/03 at 09:09 PM |
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Yep, agreed, the dash bulge is kind of odd in an otherwise OK looking car......
I'm sure at Stoneleigh Coram's loss will be MK's gain...and rightly so...even 4000 miles away you can tell MK must doing something
right....
[Edited on 26/4/03 by Alan B]
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kb58
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| posted on 26/4/03 at 10:22 PM |
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Yes but...
Take the case of the "Attack" by K1: http://www.k1-styling.sk/default2.htm They promised it would be done more than two years ago
(still says it'll be done in 2001 on their website.) From what I can tell, what they had at shows was a "cut-away" display model
only. Worse, they've been taking deposits on a car that doesn't appear to have any road time (which I find amazing.) No where on their
site could I find any real, actual road test data. What's really amazing is they are telling deposit holders that the wait just about over
because they're in production now.... of a car that hasn't been road tested... Guess that shows how much faith they have that their
suspenision will be "spot on" right out of the box, no tested needed.
And one wonders why kitcar companies don't last long. I think it's because enthusiasts try to run a business when they aren't
businessmen. In this case Marketing seems a bit out of control.
So back to your topic. I don't think there's a black and white answer. I admit it can be tough to time exactly when your prototype
should be presented. If you wait until it's "perfect," that'll be never, and you go out of business. If you rush it to the
show, you will definitely have lots of negative press... which will probably cause you to go out of business too. So the answer is somewhere in the
middle.
[Edited on 26/4/03 by kb58]
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Alan B
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| posted on 26/4/03 at 11:05 PM |
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I agree with all that KB.
Coram's problem IMO is that they have teased for soooo long.....
Either show it when it is ready, or shut up about it....again IMO
I do fully sympathise with them....I have been in the business in the past, and timing is difficult, but cancelling shows and missing shows
doesn't do them any favours.........
Glad to hear that Cooper is making progress...we know what you are going through...
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kb58
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| posted on 27/4/03 at 12:20 AM |
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Thank you Alan, I really appreciate the thought.
And I was going to say something like, "Geez Alan, if you spent as much time building as you do on this site, your car would be done by
now."
But I won't say that now...
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Alan B
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| posted on 27/4/03 at 12:26 AM |
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Ah, but it wouldn't.....I need to go online to get inspired, and stay motivated....
Plus, I'm waiting for filler to dry.......
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ProjectLMP
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| posted on 27/4/03 at 02:25 PM |
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I think as alan stated their big problem is that they have been promising so long without having the goods to deliver. From what I understand their
prototype is a bit rough around the edges. This is fine for testing but doesn't give a good impression when compared to nicely finished MK
GT1's and XTR2's
I have to say their artists impression was nicer than the final product. However, it isn't too bad looking and appears to be a little more roomy
than some of the competition. I like the fact they aren't using chain drive. These can be a pain to maintain.
Home of the Astronomicalcost Mid engined LMP project
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Hugh Paterson
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| posted on 28/4/03 at 09:41 PM |
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Coram Lmp
Cards on the table gents, I have done a couple of bits and pieces for the coram prototype, on a sub-contract basis, and on first impressions may be
a prospective customer. I have driven the beast along with another 5 possible customers and suppliers invited to a come and try day last month. The
purpose of the outing was to get feedback from punters on the car prior to the production version going to build. Yup the prototype is rough round
the edges but it is a prototype
and I HAVE First hand knowledge of some of the suppliers which you dont, and they aint mugs. Steve and James work looney hours on this project, and
although it has taken longer to develop and refine the car than they had intended, it is progressing. Oh and by the way it goes like the clappers and
I cannot wait to try the production car. The lap times are quite good with more work scheduled to improve them, it has already shown a clean pair of
heels to a couple of exotic road cars that cost loads more than the Coram.
The Zx12 engined car should be complete by the end of May if all goes to schedule, and when u consider a two man operation that has only been at it
full time since last August have got this far I think you should give them a break or at least try driving the bloody thing before u criticise it. But
hey its only my opinion, and its a free world. Sure Sales and Marketing aint their strong point, but at least they dont fear feedback even if it is
negative. Oh by the way Alan, interesting use of GRP, when do us expect your project to be complete!
regards all
Shuggie.
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Mr K
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| posted on 28/4/03 at 10:34 PM |
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Hello Hugh, good to have your input.
I think everyone on here has been giving them a break, understanding the problems they have and are being supportive. The trouble is we aren't
the potential customers, and if I were, I'd be concerned about big shows not being attended. I'm sure if I met the guys, saw the car etc.
I'd be as impressed, and proud of the project as you obviously are, and then I could be patient.
I don't think, other than some styling preferences, has anyone been critical of the car itself.
As for the dig at Alan, when did he say he was offering it for sale or attending any shows? I don't understand your point about GRP either.
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Alan B
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| posted on 28/4/03 at 11:20 PM |
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Hugh,
I, and I'm certain the rest of us too, don't doubt a word you say....I'm certain the car drives great and that Steve and James are
totally committed...we know what's involved in building cars from scratch...that's what we do on here...
What concerns me is that most potential buyers aren't understanding builders like us....and by now many potential deposits will be in the hands
of Radical, Westfield, MK, ASOne etc....which is shame.
As Mr K said I don't think we've been overly critical of the car itself, just the fact a good product may not do itself justice....
IMO..
I do intend to sell my car eventually, but I won't start the marketing campaign until I know I can deliver....
If you have some specific comment about my GRP, good or bad, I'd appreciate you sharing it, because I don't follow your cryptic remark
either......
Bottom line Hugh... we are on your side...just listen to our concerns and pass them on that's all..
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Hugh Paterson
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| posted on 2/5/03 at 09:34 PM |
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Nowt wrong with the quality of the grp, the shapes not my cup of tea thats all, the boys have their own methods of marketing their product and for the
moment dont want to hit the shows until they have finalised the development of the car, suffice to say its not the same as it was at autosport. The
production model has had input from some knowledgable prospective customers incorporated in it, and in my humble opinion will be all the better for
it. Maybe when u have finished your Car Alan u might want to see if u can catch it?
Shug.
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Alan B
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| posted on 2/5/03 at 09:56 PM |
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Hugh,
As before I hope it works out for them, and they haven't missed their chance...
As for my body shape (Ooerrr..) I didn't expect to please everyone...just glad to clear up what you meant...
Once again though you finish with a remark I don't understand.....Do you mean see if can catch the Coram?
If so I seriously doubt it..... .....quite a different car really...mine has nowhere near the same track day intentions.
To be honest the most critical I've been about the Coram has been regarding the website....and I've discussed it with the guys...far too
much glitz, very slow loading, and not enough content.....but just IMO...
Still, lets not start another row...
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ceebmoj
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| posted on 1/7/03 at 08:57 AM |
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This thread has gone a bit stale but I wanted to bring it up again.
I saw the coram LMP this weekend at piston fest 2003 and I have a couple of things I would like to add to this topic.
First the car looks much better in the flesh than in any of the picture I have seen of it. It really does look very good I am extremely impressed with
the look of the car. Like some others hear have commented I was not very keen on the black wind screen like budge on the front however when seen in
context of the rest of the car it does look good. I also think that a lot of the aerodynamic body shaping is not shown up in the photos.
A number of people also commented that the prototype was a bit rough. Having now seen this car and a some of the completion in the flesh I would have
to say that if this is rough I would not like to comment on the mk GT1 as when I when to go and see this the car was in a pore condition (I don’t what
to offend any body on this subject as I think that the GT1 is a very nice ider and at the price truly amassing)
I am now planning a visit to se the coram boys at there base for another look at the car. If possible I will also be attending one or two of there
testing sessions at either knockhill or the other circuit they have been testing at (cant remember the name). I would have to say that for me this
will be a serious consideration as a future project.
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Alan B
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| posted on 1/7/03 at 11:28 AM |
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I am genuinely glad to hear that...I know a lot of effort has been put into the car and it deserves to do well...
How was Pistonfest?
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ceebmoj
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| posted on 1/7/03 at 11:57 AM |
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Piston fest was good it was good to put faces to names and see some very nice cars.
But for me the coram was one of the highlights. Also despite reading there web sight a number of times I learnt that they are based in Scotland I must
not have looked at all the information as I missed this bit so I am no looking forward to going to see them at work on the car
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Alan B
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| posted on 1/7/03 at 12:39 PM |
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Well you can be our Coram spy..
Sounds good.......let us know more.....
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ceebmoj
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| posted on 18/7/03 at 11:15 AM |
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I took yesterday afternoon of work to go and see the guys at Coram yesterday, as a contractor taking time off is virtually unheard of for me. However
the time was well spent after arriving at their base I spent 5 or 6 hours looking at the car and talking to a number of people. I am also going to see
the car on track in the near future if people are interested I will so post up what I think, on hear.
I was very impressed buy the amount of time every one gave to show me things and talk to me despite the fact that they are all very busy.
I learnt a lot about the car and had short blat up and down the car park and all though there is no where near enough room for me to get a good feel
of the car (I am not going to pretend that I am a good driver I just enjoy driving). It felt nice however I did make a bit of a tit of my self staling
the car a couple of times. Two things that did strike me from my short drive of the car where. The braking ability and the general feel of stability
in the car.
As I have said I really did not drive the car for any thing like long enough to get a good feel of it and I am also not a good driver but in
comparison to the MK GT1 in both of the areas I have commented on above the car was much better however the one thing that real stood out was the
breaking ability.
I spent a good while looking at the car and being shown a number of the components the suspension in particular remains in my mind probably because
while I was there a number of castings for the uprights arrived and they looked good coupled with the elliptical tubing of the wish boans it will look
very good
Sorry for boring you lot with my dribble I hope that if you have been following the project that this has been of interest to you.
The only thing that remains for me now is to sell my gran to get the rest of the capital for my next project. So any one who is looking I have one
grandma barley used makes good cups of tee all reasonable offers accepted
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Simon
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| posted on 18/7/03 at 02:28 PM |
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Just had a look at their website
Kit £15,000+ vat (£17,625) needs wheels/tyres (£1,000) and engine (say a £2,000)
That's £20,625.
Complete SVA'd car £22,000 (+vat) ie £26,000
I appreciate the kit is very comprehensive, but it's gotta not be worth bothering building a kit/sourcing engine etc/SVA'ing for £5,000
£25 grand would get me a very fast/proven car. (Ultima/TVR/Porsche)
ATB
Simon
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Hugh Paterson
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| posted on 23/7/03 at 04:45 PM |
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Coram LMP
Simon, I hear what u are saying about the build costs of the Coram, but I dont think the typcial Locost builder would be in the market for this type
of car anyway.
regards
Shug.
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Tudor (Ted) Miron
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| posted on 17/8/03 at 03:52 PM |
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Is anyone aware of AsOne project?
What is it and where I can get any more info about it.
Thank you in advance
Ted
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MattWatson
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| posted on 17/8/03 at 06:20 PM |
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Their main site is:
http://www.automotivesolutions.de/auswahl_uk.php?check=0&res=1
In EVO this (or last months) track day car of the year feature, the AsOne competed...
Matt Watson
--------------------------------
VW 1.6L SOHC Turbo Mid engined car
http://members.shaw.ca/wavindustries/
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Tudor (Ted) Miron
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| posted on 20/8/03 at 04:57 PM |
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Thanx Matt 
Cheers
Ted
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