locoboy
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| posted on 24/11/03 at 12:18 PM |
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Propshaft Slider
Hi chaps,
Bike engine and live axle = need for sliding prop shaft.
are these available just off escort/capri/cortinas? (well anything ford live axle)
How does this work on a BEC as the slider on the cortina used to slide in and out of the end of the gearbox along the splines.
What do i do now!???
ATB
Locoboy
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ChrisGamlin
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| posted on 24/11/03 at 02:03 PM |
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You need a slider at the back, but you wont be using the standard Cortina/Escort prop anyway as in a BEC it needs a centre bearing and needs to be
much longer. For a BEC you'll need a fabricated 2 piece prop with a centre bearing from a Transit donor, then a slider shaft in the rear (also
possibly from a tranny?) with a flange in it to match the diff flange.
Speak to someone like Bailey Morris, they've done lots of BEC props with sliders etc, it wont necessarily be the cheapest option but IMO the
prop is one of the few things not to cut corners on, from a safety point of view.
[Edited on 24/11/03 by ChrisGamlin]
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locoboy
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| posted on 24/11/03 at 02:28 PM |
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Cheers Chris,
I have mailed bailey Morris and asked for a price.
Is there no way you can cut up and use a tranny/sierra one?
I wouldnt do it myself but get a pro welder/ fabricator to do it.
ATB
Locoboy
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ChrisGamlin
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| posted on 24/11/03 at 03:10 PM |
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You can cut-n-shut one yeh, and some people have done exactly that and don't seem to have had any problems as long as its meticulously balanced.
Personally, it would always be in the back of my mind, so would prefer to spend the extra and buy one that I know is up to the job, but thats
not to say that the homebrews arent safe by any means.
Chris
BTW, expect a cost of about £200-£250 from BM.
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locoboy
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| posted on 24/11/03 at 04:21 PM |
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WOW £xpensiv£!
I think a well engineered cut and shut is in order.
Components
3 UJ's (1 at engine end, 1 just after the bearing and 1 at the axle end)
1 x suitable slider
1 x Main bearing.
Have i missed anything?
I am planning on only having this engine in this car for a short while then swapping it out into my new car and ideally dount want to go to the hassle
or expense of making another prop to fit the new chassis,
so my next question is how much slide in a slider do you have as a rule?
ATB
Locoboy
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ChrisGamlin
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| posted on 24/11/03 at 06:04 PM |
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about 8-10cm at a guess, I think thats about what mine extends by. 
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locoboy
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| posted on 25/11/03 at 09:31 AM |
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so with a little careful measuring and fully thought out engine placement it could in theory be possible to use the same shaft for both cars?
I plan on only making one engine cradle too, and putting appropriate brackets on each chassis to fit it ......lazy or sensible, not sure 
ATB
Locoboy
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ChrisGamlin
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| posted on 25/11/03 at 11:20 AM |
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Yep you could use both props in both chassis. The most critical measurement is going to between the centre bearing mounting and the flange on the
engine, as this doesnt have a slider section usually, so needs to be within the tolerence of the bearing mounting plate.
Chris
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Peteff
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| posted on 25/11/03 at 06:44 PM |
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I helped fit a bike engine in an Indy chassis and we fitted a slider from the front half of a plastic pig prop into the front of the car prop. This
was needed as the engine was in at an angle to the centre joint. The rest was Sierra but a Transit one could be used in a live axled car I would think
as the axle will only have limited travel the centre joint should cope with the up and down movement.
yours, Pete.
yours, Pete
I went into the RSPCA office the other day. It was so small you could hardly swing a cat in there.
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Jon Ison
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| posted on 25/11/03 at 08:45 PM |
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morris marina slider at front, sierra center bearing near front, sierra prop to rear, worked 4 me........
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locoboy
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| posted on 25/11/03 at 09:10 PM |
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am i right in thinking that there is no real point to having a slider between 2 fixed points, ie the engine being solid mounted and the bearing also
being solid mounted?
John, im sure you are about to tell me otherwise
Surly the up and down movement in the axle will load the bearing and mounting in a front to back direction....yes/no?
[Edited on 25/11/03 by colmaccoll]
ATB
Locoboy
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Jon Ison
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| posted on 25/11/03 at 09:20 PM |
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whilst the center bearing is "solid" to chassis it has loads of movement in it, may not be "the way it should be" but i did
over 5k miles flat out with the slider at the front with no probs
i would guess the slider moved 5mm max but without one that 5mm wunt do engine much good ?
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ChrisGamlin
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| posted on 26/11/03 at 10:37 AM |
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Yep you can have a slider on the front as well, the only word of caution on this is that occasionally the retaining bolt on the output shaft that
holds the prop flange on can fail. If you have a prop without a front slider, all you get is increased vibration as the flange is moving about on the
engine a bit, but cant go anywhere. If you've got a slider on the front, the prop flange can slide off the output shaft and you have a nasty
flailing prop trying to get at your feet.
It not a hugely common occurance, but I know of at least two people on the BEC list who have had this bolt fail, one ended up with major tunnel damage
after the prop slid off the output shaft, the other put a new bolt in after feeling a bit of vibration.....
Chris
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locoboy
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| posted on 26/11/03 at 10:55 AM |
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So threadlock aplenty is the name of the game!
i may also get a thin piect of sheet steel welded to my adaptor so i can fold it round onto the flats of the bolt that holds it on to the output
shaft, this should stop it coming undone shouldn't it? may be a bit belt and braces but i like my legs
ATB
Locoboy
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ChrisGamlin
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| posted on 26/11/03 at 11:07 AM |
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It wasnt coming undone, it was breaking the head off the bolt, so threadlock wont help the cause in that scenario
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loafersmate
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| posted on 26/11/03 at 12:02 PM |
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Make sure you use a decent 12.9 grade bolt!!!
Ben
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locoboy
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| posted on 26/11/03 at 12:38 PM |
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holy sheet, how the hell was it doing that, just through vibration?
a decent bolt it will be then, i guess the original sprocket bolt is a pile of poo then?
ATB
Locoboy
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ChrisGamlin
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| posted on 26/11/03 at 02:05 PM |
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I dont know what grade the original bolt is, I guess it may not be too hard as on the bike there should be no lateral force on it. This should also be
the case with a BEC flange, but its not always the case as can be seen from the other thread about flange adapters today. If its at all loose I guess
it can vibrate and move along the splines and give the bolt a good whack every time it does it.
Like I said, its not a common occurance and if the flange fits properly then you are probably 90% there with reducing the chance of failure, but if
you can afford not to have a slider in the front as well (which will also weigh more) then I'd still personally go without.
Chris
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