SAMMIO SPYDER BODYSHELLS / 1950'S INSPIRED SPORTS CARS on eBay (end time 05-Feb-11 18:06:22 GMT)
Before embarking on my next project, I intend asking the DVLA for clarification but I just wondered if anyone has recently been down this route and
knows the current situation on rebodying regs to avoid IVA.
Whilst I always understood that you need 8 points of which the unmodified chassis is 5 I've just heard from a friend that it is now mandatory to
retain the donor car's bulkhead which has the VIN plate as well as no modifications to the original chasis.
Once I've spoken to the DVLA I will post their answer which I hope will be definitive.
John
What kind of car John?
Well, the master plan is to use a triumph Spitfire chassis and all running gear and build an aluminium body for it along the lines of a Jaguar C
type.
John
you definatly need to keep the unmodified chassis with its VIN - not sure about the bulkhead itself though...
my mate built a blitz 4x4 (SJ based) a few years back, it uses the std. suzuki chassis and he kept the donors reg.
(I don't think the rules have changed)
[Edited on 28/1/2011 by mcerd1]
quote:
Originally posted by John Bonnett
Once I've spoken to the DVLA I will post their answer which I hope will be definitive.
John
quote: I love your optimism!
Yes, you're absolutley right remembering the confusion and conflicting information from VOSA and the DVLA over whether an MOT was necessary in
addition to SVA.
Have you seen these, based on the herald. Pretty car I think....
SAMMIO SPYDER BODYSHELLS / 1950'S INSPIRED SPORTS CARS on eBay (end time 05-Feb-11 18:06:22 GMT)
Nice..... but they seem to have forgotten something!
Al 
Originally posted by cliftyhanger
Have you seen these, based on the herald. Pretty car I think....
SAMMIO SPYDER BODYSHELLS / 1950'S INSPIRED SPORTS CARS on eBay (end time 05-Feb-11 18:06:22 GMT)
I put a Stag body on a Range Rover chassis and I kept the Range Rover's ID as was classed as re-bodied.
I don't know about keeping the bulkhead.
The Spitfire has a separate chassis and body so the VIN number, I would think, belongs with the chassis.
quote:
Originally posted by cliftyhanger
Have you seen these, based on the herald. Pretty car I think....
SAMMIO SPYDER BODYSHELLS / 1950'S INSPIRED SPORTS CARS on eBay (end time 05-Feb-11 18:06:22 GMT)
Yes, I agree the Sammio is a very pretty car, apparently easy to build with none of the expense and hassle of IVA. Heralds are still available and
relatively cheap on Ebay so an on-the-road-price of under £1500 could be very realistic.
It was interesting to see that they retain the Herald bulkhead which does support information from my friend that keeping the bulkhead is
mandatory.
We'll see what the DVLA has to say.
John
quote:
I really like that, though not overly keen on the upward looking headlamps on the green one. VW Beetle lamps I suspect. Bit of a shame the underlying chassis and suspension is not exactly the most "sporting".
Just to get the thread back on track, I just spoken to the DVLA and I understand that providing the 8 points are achieved including using an
unmodified chassis no IVA is required. No mention was made about using the bulkhead of the donor. The lady from the DVLA is going to send me the
guidance notes.
It all seems quite straightforward but things never are where the DVLA is concerned.
[Edited on 28/1/11 by John Bonnett]
quote:
Originally posted by cliftyhanger
Have you seen these, based on the herald. Pretty car I think....
SAMMIO SPYDER BODYSHELLS / 1950'S INSPIRED SPORTS CARS on eBay (end time 05-Feb-11 18:06:22 GMT)
quote:
Originally posted by speedyxjs
quote:
Originally posted by cliftyhanger
Have you seen these, based on the herald. Pretty car I think....
SAMMIO SPYDER BODYSHELLS / 1950'S INSPIRED SPORTS CARS on eBay (end time 05-Feb-11 18:06:22 GMT)
Thanks alot! My next projec twas going to be spridget or spitfire but i am now really drawn to that!
Currently defrosting cold fingers, one sill repair almost done. quote:
Originally posted by marcjagman
I put a Stag body on a Range Rover chassis and I kept the Range Rover's ID as was classed as re-bodied.
http://www.direct.gov.uk/en/Motoring/BuyingAndSellingAVehicle/RegisteringAVehicle/DG_10014199
quote:
Originally posted by cliftyhanger
quote:
Originally posted by speedyxjs
quote:
Originally posted by cliftyhanger
Have you seen these, based on the herald. Pretty car I think....
SAMMIO SPYDER BODYSHELLS / 1950'S INSPIRED SPORTS CARS on eBay (end time 05-Feb-11 18:06:22 GMT)
Thanks alot! My next projec twas going to be spridget or spitfire but i am now really drawn to that!
If you want some spitfire experince pop over and have a go at welding mine up
On a serious note, if you getinvolved with Triumphs, give me a call, we have a monthly meet in Ringmer, and I am also involved with this lot
http://www.eastbourneandrammc.co.uk/page2.htm
http://www.direct.gov.uk/en/Motoring/BuyingAndSellingAVehicle/RegisteringAVehicle/DG_10014199
Thank Steve, that was what I understood from my conversation with the DVLA this morning. No mention of having to retain the donor's bulkhead. In
actual fact keeping at least part of the bulkhead could make the build simpler and give something solid to pick up on. This might avoid the dreaded
scuttle shake.
Sounds like confusion with the mini people who fit bigger engines and need to cut the bulkhead to get bits in.
DVLA has ruled that is a modification to the chassis so needs IVA.
Just found this. Claims to be VOSA's view.
http://www.the-ace.org.uk/Chassis-and-Monocoque-Modification.html
My thanks to IanK for aking the trouble to find the relevant regs covering re-bodying and radically modified vehicles. I have also received
clarification from Sammio Spyder Cars which explains why they retain the bulkhead. An extract from the reply follows:
"It isn't necessary to keep the bulkhead - I do that for ease of build ..a de-bodied Herald with its bulkhead still attached still has
brakes , steering etc...this saves a lot of time for the home builder and keeps the build relatively easy...
Also , I like the fact that you don't have to move the chassis plate from its original position..."
So, I think I can safely bin the whole Spitfire bodywork and start with a clean sheet.
My thanks to everyone who has replied.
John
Was just looking at the Sammio Spyder the other day. Are you going for the new cobra style nose or the original style?
The only thing that puts me off (besides the misses wanting to buy a bigger house) is the rear suspension woes of the spitfire, though I see there are
now proper solutions for that these days that are better than the rotoflex.
Although I like the Sammio Spyder very much it does not, in my opinion, lend itself to being shortened to fit the Spitfire chassis; I think it looks
too short and stubby. Gary at Sammio has shortened a body to suit so see what you think.
linky
Having got the Spitfire, I'm stuck with that and need to come up with a shape that looks in proportion.
I'm planning on building a double curvature all enveloping aluminium body that will sit on a standard chassis to retain the Triumph's
identity and to avoid IVA. The Spitfire has a wheelbase of only 83 inches and a track of 48 inches so there we have the problem. The Spitfire
doesn't look stubby which I think is due to it being low so whatever I build will have to be low as well.
My original plan was to use a Reliant Kitten as a basis for an MG TF but the Reliant didn't materialise and also suffered from a short chassis
(similar in length to the Spitfire). I had planned on putting 10 inches into it but that would have involved going through IVA so I had to bin that
one.
I'm not going to try to build a replica but I have been trawling the specifications of 1960s sportscars for inspiration. I do have one in mind as
a basis so the next step is to make a scale model and see what it looks like.
John
I thought all their cars were on the Spitfire chassis, at least their website imples it.
I quite like the proportions personally, but then I quite like short cars (mini's, midas', 550 spyders etc).
The spitfire also has a long rear overhang which makes it visually longer than the wheelbase would imply, and as you say they are low.
Are these not on a spitfire chassis?
[Edited on 31/1/11 by iank]
They are based on the Herald/Vitess chassis which is 10 inches longer than the Spitfire
linky
The white car shown in the picture on the link given in my previous post was shortened to fit the Spitfire chassis and I think in doing this it loses
its sleekness.
John
quote:
Originally posted by John Bonnett
They are based on the Herald/Vitess chassis which is 10 inches longer than the Spitfire
linky
The white car shown in the picture on the link given in my previous post was shortened to fit the Spitfire chassis and I think in doing this it loses its sleekness.
John
quote: Penny drops, I thought they shared a common chassis. Looking again the white car would look better if it lost an inch off the height along
the flanks.
I thought they were identical chassis too Ian and if I'd realised beforehand I would have bought a Herald and not a Spitfire.
The white car based on the Spitfire shows just how important it is to get the proportions right.
Li
nky
[Edited on 2/2/11 by John Bonnett]
[Edited on 2/2/11 by John Bonnett]
ohhhh,
see what you mean, it looks rather "noddy-ish" when shorter.
The other issue I can see may hapen is the spitfire has no siderails and uses structural sills (sort of semi-monocoque on a chassis) which probably
means the spitfire based one needs a rather more complicated bolt-on frame. On the plus side, hearld chassis tend to rot rather more than the herald
versions.
Shouldn't be too hard to swap the chassis for a herald one, plenty about but most need a few bits of welding in the diff area.
I do seem to have made life difficult for myself by taking the Spitfire route not only because of the short chassis but also because as you mentiion
the lack of body support which require the sills to be structural.
I really want to do this properly and legally with respect to the DVLA regs for radically modified vehicles and retain the Spitfire identity so
inserting a Herald chassis would not be an option, sadly.
On the positive side the Spitfire designer has managed to produce a very pleasing result despite the short wheelbase largely because the car is low
and I think that is the key to success. That is, retain the height to length ratio of the Spitfire in my design.
So, it's out with the tape measure!
Sure you've already seen these, but other options on the spitfire chassis are
Vincent Hurricane
http://www.caburn.demon.co.uk/Contents/CaburnEngineering/Hurricane/
and Fiorano Type 48 Corsa Spyder
http://www.corsaspyder.com/Home.html
Thank you for your effort Ian, it's really nice having someone batting for you.
I've been trawling through specifications given in Carfolio and the interesting thing I've discovered is that all the cars that I think look
really well balanced, nice to look at, all share a similar ratio of height to length. These include;
Spitfire, AC Ace, E Type, C Type, D Type, DB9, Ferrari 250GT, McLaren F1 etc. Try it yourself on your favourites. So, this ratio seems to be the key
to the ascetics. Get that right and we're well on the way to a nice looking car.
We've got really off topic now so perhaps we should move to another heading.
John
Hi,
Just found this thread whilst trawling through Google....
John is correct in saying that the Spit based cars are visually a bit short...I felt that straight away when we did it ....I do think the wheels and
suspension height don't help in those pics though ....if someone whos clever with the photoshop stuff could lower the body about 4''
and change the wheels to steel or wire examples - I think it will look better...The original front works better than the newer Lancia styled one we do
now...
The bulkhead issue as said previously is just a personal choice...I like the unmolested VIN tag and not interfering with pedals , steering etc keeps
them an easy build...Triumph designed and built a bulkhead that works - why mess with it ?
DVLA are happy for you to just use the chassis , running gear etc and move the chassis tag to the new shell.... With the Mini's - modifying the
bulkhead becomes a chassis modification ( mini is classed as semi-monocoque ) and does become SVA'able
Any serious body mods on a monocoque - bulkhead recess , roof chop etc takes you into SVA as well...
The problem with the Spitfire is the rear suspension tie bars - a herald has these mounted into the outrigger - Spitfires are mounted to the
floor..When you take the body off , you need to mount the tie bar and any mods can infringe your SVA immunity !
I am looking at re-designing a version of the Sammio to cater for the Spit crowd - my plan is to make a minimal BOLT ON mount to accept the tie bar
and some different floor styling to allow for no outriggers...I am still in negotiation with my local VRO to see just how much of a bolt on tie bar
mount is acceptable before DVLA class it as a subframe ( subframe is classed as chassis mod !! ) No one can answer me yet !!
We make our inner frame to brace the chassis in a way that it can be removed with the Sammio body if you chose to....the wording in the regs suggest
you must be able to remove without cutting off , ( ie. unbolt ) any body mods to take your chassis back to a state of originality that would allow a
stock Herald body to go back on...this would need to be the same with your Spitfire Special.....
[Edited on 20/2/11 by SAMMIO SPYDERS]