andyps
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| posted on 3/7/03 at 03:54 PM |
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Potential donor
Just seen this on ebay - would probably make a brilliant donor -
http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=2420924039&category=31356
Has anyone ever tried the Porsche 924/944 as a donor?
Andy
An expert is someone who knows more and more about less and less
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ned
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| posted on 3/7/03 at 04:06 PM |
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aren't they fwd or am i just being silly, or am i thinking of the 928/968?
The flat engine would be a challenge to fit in the front!! maybe more suited to a mid engined design?!
Ned.
beware, I've got yellow skin
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andyps
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| posted on 3/7/03 at 04:17 PM |
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this is the front engine, rwd porsche (ok, it was a volkswagen originally!). The 924 had an Audi 4 cyl engine, the 944 a Prsche 4 cyl engine, both in
line. Main difference to a standard rwd car is that they have a transaxle gearbox, so the fron and rear ay need a redesign to fit the "elongated
diff" appearance of the cars.
solid and reliable mechanically though, and not too bad on the weight front I think.
Andy
An expert is someone who knows more and more about less and less
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chrisg
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| posted on 3/7/03 at 06:07 PM |
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One day i'm going to seek out and kill the next person who says that the 924 was"originally a volkswagen"
it bloody wasn't!
it was conceived and developed by Porsche as a project to replace the 914 as the entry level Porsche. Volkswagen were involved as parts suppliers and
because the 914 was also sold as a wolkswagen in some markets. The 924 was intended to be sold as a volkswagen in certain markets and a porsche in
others.
The Engine has a similar block(with forged pistons) to the audi 100/passat/ LT, but with a Porsche designed aluminium head.
All porsches in the seventies relied hevily on VW parts, including the 911.
Yes I have got one and they would make a terrible donor. The engine 3 inches higher than a pinto the tourqe tube/gearbox combo is massive and only
suitable for torsion bar suspension.
and I need the bits
Cheers
Chris
Nice to see them going up in value too!
Note to all: I really don't know when to leave well alone. I tried to get clever with the mods, then when they gave me a lifeline to see the
error of my ways, I tried to incite more trouble via u2u. So now I'm banned, never to return again. They should have done it years ago!
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stephen_gusterson
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| posted on 3/7/03 at 06:40 PM |
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ChrisG:
I heard it was developed for AUDI who decided not to go with it.
Ned:
That was pretty far out wasnt it 
I got bollocked on TOL once for commenting on stuff 'i was guessing' about. So, I try my best to avoid statements im not sure of, most of
the time, I think.
Perhaps.
atb
steve
[Edited on 3/7/03 by stephen_gusterson]
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chrisg
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| posted on 3/7/03 at 08:14 PM |
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Who owns Audi Steve?
tum te tum.........
Cheers
Chris
Note to all: I really don't know when to leave well alone. I tried to get clever with the mods, then when they gave me a lifeline to see the
error of my ways, I tried to incite more trouble via u2u. So now I'm banned, never to return again. They should have done it years ago!
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Peteff
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| posted on 3/7/03 at 09:28 PM |
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What does VAG stand for
yours, Pete
I went into the RSPCA office the other day. It was so small you could hardly swing a cat in there.
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stephen_gusterson
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| posted on 3/7/03 at 09:41 PM |
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quote:
Originally posted by chrisg
Who owns Audi Steve?
tum te tum.........
Cheers
Chris
Yeah, I know that.......but I dont know when audi was bought by volkswagen, which is why I made the distinction.
so, turning to google...........
http://www.wikipedia.org/wiki/Volkswagen
quote :
the 1976 Porsche 924 (which used many Audi components and was built at an Audi factory), and the 2002 Porsche Cayenne (which shares engineering with
the VW Touareg).
another quote:
Audi -- bought from Daimler-Benz in 1964-1966
which is confusing.
its an Audi.
but then Audi was already owned by volkswagen, so clearly its not.
or is it.
?
atb
steve
[Edited on 3/7/03 by stephen_gusterson]
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chrisg
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| posted on 3/7/03 at 11:43 PM |
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No, it's a Porsche
See how patient I am being with you
Cheers
Chris
Note to all: I really don't know when to leave well alone. I tried to get clever with the mods, then when they gave me a lifeline to see the
error of my ways, I tried to incite more trouble via u2u. So now I'm banned, never to return again. They should have done it years ago!
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stephen_gusterson
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| posted on 4/7/03 at 12:06 AM |
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how about a porche made in an audi factory? - which of course isnt cos it was owned by volkswagen, so its a porche made in an audi factory thats
really a volkswagen one.
so...
how do you pronounce porche
poorsh
or porsha
atb
steve
or veedub
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andyps
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| posted on 4/7/03 at 09:00 AM |
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Well - that opened a can of worms!
My brother is on his 5th 924 derivative (currently a 944 S2) and so I know all the arguments about being a VW or not, doesn't half wind some
people up even after all these years! They do share many components with VW/Audi and there is discussion about whether it was developed by Porsche for
Audi, or Porsche helped Audi with the development - on that basis there are probably many cars out there which people could claim are Porsches
including the original Seat Ibiza so lets not go there....
Given a big bonnet it could make a good donor! Where are the prices going up, and if they are that good why do you need the parts?
Andy
An expert is someone who knows more and more about less and less
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ned
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| posted on 4/7/03 at 09:03 AM |
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Petef
VAG:
Volkswagon Audi Group??
just another guess I'm afraid!!!
as always all my input (especially that which is incorrect) is all IMHO/IIRC (which I sometimes don't !!)
Ned.
beware, I've got yellow skin
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stephen_gusterson
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| posted on 4/7/03 at 09:39 AM |
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according to AliG, VAG means something entirely different!
I looked into getting a 924 before I bought my XJ-S, as I had always liked them. The bits I remeber were :
1. Its got about 125hp and 0-60 in 9 secs. I read XR3i used to embarrass them a lot.
2. The turbo version, made for 3 years, had IIRC 150hp.
3. They have a transaxle (rear gearbox) with front engine.
4. the last ones had same engine / drive train as the 944.
For the novelty, it would be interesting, but the transaxle may complicate things, and 125hp isnt excatly fantastic for the trouble.
isnt the 1.6 4age 125hp?
ATB
steve
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timf
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| posted on 4/7/03 at 10:03 AM |
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for fun
iirc the maza rotary engine is easily modified to be able to take additional rotor cylinders and i has been done to 'bolt' 2 engines end
on end giving a huge bhp engine for not much money.
this must be the fun way to go.
ps didn't the early 914 suffer if the prop went out of ballance as it rotates at engine revs.
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andyps
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| posted on 4/7/03 at 11:53 AM |
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Ned - VAG is Vlokswagen Ltd. I don't speak German so don't know what the AG actually stands for but is equivalent to our ltd/plc etc.
924 = 125 hp. 924S (porsche engine) 150hp plus 944 - depends on model - S2 = 210 hp. All tuneable, 944 engine up to 300 hp
Transaxle does mean that prop rotates at engine speed but I haven't heard of problems. All good for very high mileage - well over 150k is usual
before many problems.
Andy
An expert is someone who knows more and more about less and less
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stephen_gusterson
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| posted on 4/7/03 at 12:46 PM |
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I dont understand this 'roatates at engine speeds' stuff.
On a ford type 9, the final ratio is about 0.89 or summat. That means that in top gear, with 6000 rpm, the prop is doing 6500 approx. This isnt an
unusual situation - except that on the Porche, its going to do it in all gears.
atb
steve
[Edited on 4/7/03 by stephen_gusterson]
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kingr
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| posted on 4/7/03 at 01:53 PM |
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It also means that you can save weight by including the prop as part of the flywheel. It will be more heavily stressed - how long does it take to get
from 2000 to 6000 RPM in fifth with sierra, then think about how long it takes to get from 2000-6000 in first in a 924.
Kingr
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Noodle
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| posted on 4/7/03 at 02:20 PM |
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quote:
the maza rotary engine is easily modified to be able to take additional rotor cylinders
In Japan, you can already buy a 3 rotor Mazda motor. The JC Cosmo (JC? Does it walk on water?) is a turbocharged 3 rotor version of the type 13B as
found in the last RX-7's.
The original RX-7 could be quite a nice donor (twin rotor, live axle), the MKII which (tenuous link to current thread) was meant to look like a 944
("What those things that VW did?" etc) and had semi-trailing arms rear a la E30 BMW and Sierra. Some of them also had a fat turbo strapped
to them.
The MKIII used a twin-turbo, twin rotor, twin-plugged engine that borders on the ludicrous for a Locost. (That is a good thing )
There's a place on Cov who'll import a Cosmo motor for you I believe (http://www.hurley-engineering.ltd.uk) but their site looks dead. Was
up a few weeks ago.
Neil.
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timf
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| posted on 4/7/03 at 02:21 PM |
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as kingr said
the early ones suffered from the uj's failing due to tha fact they were running very fast most of the time then porche uprated them after a
couple had failed.
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Spyderman
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| posted on 4/7/03 at 11:14 PM |
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Just speculating, but wouldn't the prop from a rear gearbox be significantly lighter than a traditional one?
The gearbox acts as a torque multiplier, so the loads through a trad prop are much higher.
Then again having the prop rotating at engine speed is adding more rotational inertia to the engine. More power needed to increase revs.
Terry
Spyderman
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greggors84
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| posted on 5/7/03 at 12:24 AM |
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quote:
Originally posted by andyps
Ned - VAG is Vlokswagen Ltd. I don't speak German so don't know what the AG actually stands for but is equivalent to our ltd/plc etc.
Im pretty sure it stands for Volkswagen Audi Group as ned said
Chris
The Magnificent 7!
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Metal Hippy
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| posted on 5/7/03 at 01:47 AM |
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I decided to look up the answer.
Here it is for one and all....
VAG is a German corporation. It originated as a public concern selling Volkswagen automobiles, but currently owns a number of automobile brands and
related companies. The name originally stood for Volkswagenwerk Aktiengesellschaft (Aktiengesellschaft or AG being equivalent to the English
corporation or Corp). The name was changed to VOLKSWAGEN AG on 4th July 1985. The corporation now goes by that name or 'Volkswagen Group',
but many people still refer to it as VAG.
Source site was http://www.wikipedia.org/wiki/VAG
Cock off or cock on. You choose.
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chrisg
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| posted on 5/7/03 at 11:15 AM |
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Anyway it's a Porsche, and a nice one at that.
So there
Cheers
Cheers
Note to all: I really don't know when to leave well alone. I tried to get clever with the mods, then when they gave me a lifeline to see the
error of my ways, I tried to incite more trouble via u2u. So now I'm banned, never to return again. They should have done it years ago!
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Alan B
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| posted on 5/7/03 at 12:02 PM |
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I think the actual equivalent of just plain "limited" as in XYZ ltd. is "gmbh"....as in Klochenshister gmbh.......
Leaving the AG for the large corporations..
Anyway..Porsche/Audi/VW...who cares?...POS hairdressers car either way....
<stir, stir>
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Peteff
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| posted on 5/7/03 at 12:05 PM |
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The JC Cosmo (JC? Does it walk on water?)
And does it wear bottle bottom glasses and say "Knickers, knackers, knockers".
I really liked that bloke and he looked a lot like Les Dawson as well.
yours, Pete.
yours, Pete
I went into the RSPCA office the other day. It was so small you could hardly swing a cat in there.
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