Board logo

Mid engine V6 maestro?
talkingcars - 31/5/14 at 10:58 PM

I have a MG maestro hat has been converted to run a Rover Vitesse 16v turbo engine (Rover T16) but I've never been really happy with the conversion.

I've messed around with lots of things on the car so it'll never be converted back to original.

I also have a MGZS180 that I'm scrapping.

I was thinking of sticking the KV6 engine in to replace the T16 but an idea struck me - chop the back out of the maestro and drop the body over the ZS engine bay - mid engined maestro reminisant of a low power two wheel drive Metro 6R4.

Obviously there are a few issues to get around but MGF parts will help.

Any reason why this shouldn't work?

gregs - 1/6/14 at 06:17 AM

anything is possible.... but you could always find another T16.....

linky


The above has quite a lot of useful info on getting a fwd engine into the back.

talkingcars - 1/6/14 at 06:44 AM

Cheers for the link.

I do have another T16 in the garage (and a 1.4 16v K series) but I've always preferred the power delivery of a NASP over a turbo.

rdodger - 1/6/14 at 09:52 AM

Probably easier to fit an MGTF rear subframe and then drop the KV6 in.

ashg - 1/6/14 at 12:38 PM

toltec on here runs a t16 in his shelsey t2 i dont recall him having any problem with his engine other than its ability to shred a standard rover gearbox in 60 seconds because it made so much power lol.

talkingcars - 1/6/14 at 03:56 PM

quote:
Originally posted by rdodger
Probably easier to fit an MGTF rear subframe and then drop the KV6 in.


The MGF subframe needs modifying to fit the KV6. And then the maestro would need new rear chassis rails.

The way I'm planning on doing it is to take the front of the ZS, suspension and all and weld it "under" the rear of the maestro, dropping the shell onto the engine bay has the advantage that the weight is pushing down onto the engine bay. The distance between the inner wing seams on the body is a few mm less than the width between the inner wings on the ZS engine bay so should be a nice fit.

talkingcars - 1/6/14 at 03:57 PM

quote:
Originally posted by ashg
toltec on here runs a t16 in his shelsey t2 i dont recall him having any problem with his engine other than its ability to shred a standard rover gearbox in 60 seconds because it made so much power lol.


LOL, I want drivability.

JC - 5/6/14 at 03:34 AM

Wasn't the 6R4 a shortened Maestro floor pan?

Have a look at the Z cars universal sub frame. pricey, but shows that what you are planning is doable!

britishtrident - 5/6/14 at 07:14 AM

Unlike later MG-Rovers the Maestro (& Montego) had floor pans and sills were made of a thin low grade steel start chopping metal out to accommodate a sub-frame and there will be nothing solid enough to weld attachment points to.

The KV6 is not nearly as good a unit as an M or T series which have much more "drivabillity" than the KV6, what the KV6 had in its favour was low weight.

[Edited on 5/6/14 by britishtrident]

talkingcars - 8/6/14 at 08:09 PM

By drivability I mean resonably powerful for a NASP and plenty of torque that a vee gives you. And TBH I've never been a big fan of driving high boost turbo cars, ok in a drag but not so good on the twistys.

Options I've already considered for later are either a rebuilt KV6 with forged internals, possibly with one or two smallish turbos, obviously with custom exhuast manifolds or once the ZS engine bay is set up it isn't a major job to swap in a T16 (but not the pile of scrap iron that is currently in the front.

When it comes to cutting up the maestro it is only the area between the step at the back of the rear footwells and slight foward of the rear valance and from just inside the seams on the inner wheel arches. One obviously needs to brace diaganallyto prevent twisting of the main shell.

To aid strength when rebuilding one will add sections as needed and all welded joints will be spot welded and then seam welded.

talkingcars - 8/6/14 at 08:13 PM

quote:
Originally posted by JC
Wasn't the 6R4 a shortened Maestro floor pan?


I remeber hearing that many years ago.

quote:
Have a look at the Z cars universal sub frame. pricey, but shows that what you are planning is doable!


Interesting product but not for the poor shoe string budget I have.

big_wasa - 8/6/14 at 08:19 PM

Crack on The kv6 or even the k16 isn't that well loved out side Mgr circles. But those that have them love them a little more

talkingcars - 24/12/14 at 08:56 PM

6 months on and not a lot has happened except I have gathered togeather some bits to handle gear change and fuel storage.

However I have decorated the whole house so I have curried much favour with Mrs TC.................

MikeRJ - 25/12/14 at 10:30 AM

I loved the sound and smoothness of the KV6, but I was always a bit disappointed with the performance in my ZS180 (VIS motors were all working and manifold flaps ok). It never felt like a 175bhp car to me, and the 200bhp Civic Type R that replaced it felt hugely quicker and returned over 30% better economy.

Hmm, a Honda K20A in a relatively light car like the Maestro would be a lot of fun


[Edited on 25/12/14 by MikeRJ]

talkingcars - 27/9/15 at 08:15 AM

Progress update - I've completed level one welding and started on level two - the world is my oyster.

big_wasa - 27/9/15 at 09:01 AM

So let's have some photos

talkingcars - 27/9/15 at 09:45 PM

quote:
Originally posted by big_wasa
So let's have some photos


Of what - my NVQ work, as the saying goes "what gets welded in class stays in class".

StrikerChris - 28/9/15 at 08:33 AM

I'm not meaning to hijack your thread,but I have a Mg Maestro, and a T16 enging Im planning on bunging in it. Any parts you don't need from your conversion I may well be interested in, as I'll need all the parts before I start, with it being my daily driver I'll have to get the job done in one hit over a weekend.

Chris

talkingcars - 28/9/15 at 07:37 PM

Don't hold your breath Chris, it won't be any time soon but I will bare it in mind.

StrikerChris - 28/9/15 at 07:44 PM

No worries. I have a saab intercooler that fits snug and discreetly infront of rad but behind bumper.thing is the pipes would have to go through the standard rad.i dont suppose you know what rad you are using?

Chris

talkingcars - 28/9/15 at 08:47 PM



I took a rad from a montego diesel as they had brass end caps but managed to put a hole in it drilling a hole in the top plate to take a second fan. I took it to a local rad specialist and had it rebuilt as a high flow triple core rad.

The guy who did the initial install stuck a rad from a 1600 in there as it was the same size as the maestro turbo rad to give room for the ford intercooler he used, it was insuficiant to keep the engine cool in traffic.

You may find this helps with the wiring

http://home.btconnect.com/talkingcars/maestromods/electrics/T16engineloom.htm

StrikerChris - 29/9/15 at 05:22 PM

Yeah cheers for that.the wiring should be a doddle compared to my striker.i have both cooler pipes exiting the same end of the intercooler and it will sit nicely behind the non turbo bumper so hopefully can keep it looking standard.think the original turbo rad should fit just don't want to gamble and find out its not up to the job half way to work!what brakes were you running, im hoping to keep the pig ugly 14' wheels too....

talkingcars - 29/9/15 at 08:40 PM

I currently using O/E spec front discs and calipers but do have some larger ones to go on at some point.
On the back I have O/E spec drums but with cylinders from the van as they are larger.

I am using MGF VVC 5 spoke 15" wheels which have the same PDC.
If I do the transplant to the rear with the KV6 I plan to fit MGF rear hubs and brakes to get rid of the steering and over sized (for the back) ZS front discs. If I don't I'll have to use ZS 17" wheels on the rear due to the different PDC.