khaOs
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| posted on 27/12/06 at 02:00 AM |
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newbie question about mid-engine chassi
Hey! I was thinking about making a car from scratch to install the 1.6 vtec turbo engine that i have at home. the problem is that i don't have
any experience in this field and i don't know how to start designing the chassi. Does anyone know where i can learn about this? thanks
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kb58
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| posted on 27/12/06 at 02:25 AM |
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You've come to the right place. My advice is to take a year (really) and read, read, read. Here's my list of
books
My own book will be ready at the end of January, which will be very helpful in your case. I used a Prelude VTEC drivetrain and mounted it mid-engine
in a tube-frame Mini. Click on link in sig.
/End of self-promo...
[Edited on 12/27/06 by kb58]
Mid-engine Locost - http://www.midlana.com
And the book - http://www.lulu.com/shop/kurt-bilinski/midlana/paperback/product-21330662.html
Kimini - a tube-frame, carbon shell, Honda Prelude VTEC mid-engine Mini: http://www.kimini.com
And its book -
http://www.lulu.com/shop/kurt-bilinski/kimini-how-to-design-and-build-a-mid-engine-sports-car-from-scratch/paperback/product-4858803.html
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Doug68
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| posted on 27/12/06 at 07:53 AM |
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Hi KhaOs,
I'd second what kb58 said I'm a roughly a year into my project and expect to start cutting metal soon!
I'm glad I didn't rush to this stage as I'm sure I would not have been happy with the result.
Other people on the forum have taken much less time than this and that's good for them .
As you'll see anyone who engages in this sort of project is fairly individual person, so expect lots of differing opinions from people who are
not afraid to speak their minds!
Good luck!
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gttman
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| posted on 27/12/06 at 10:03 AM |
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You could try to buy some plans for a midi you like.
Andygtt
Please redefine your limits
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goodall
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| posted on 27/12/06 at 12:19 PM |
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do mid engined cars not understeer like theres no tomorrow with just a few bit of box iron loading the front wheels
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suparuss
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| posted on 27/12/06 at 01:36 PM |
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quote:
Originally posted by goodall
do mid engined cars not understeer like theres no tomorrow with just a few bit of box iron loading the front wheels
not if its designed properly. its obviously an inherent problem to think about but there are plenty of ways around it.
edit- another point is that when going round a corner the weight in the back will tend more to push teh back out causing oversteer. depends on many
little things.
to answer the main question, ill second what kb says- get some books and familiarise yourself with chassis design and suspension design principles and
then the best next step would be to learn a cad program so that you can start playing with different ideas a lot easier.
one main requirement will be to have the main parts you intend to use to either measure into cad to design around, or make a scale model etc.
[Edited on 27/12/06 by suparuss]
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DIY Si
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| posted on 27/12/06 at 01:37 PM |
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No more so than a locost weighing 500 kgs with 50-50 weight will. And since all the weight is in the boot, a mild prod of right foot will soon sort
any understeer out!
“Let your plans be dark and as impenetratable as night, and when you move, fall like a thunderbolt.”
Sun Tzu, The Art of War
My new blog: http://spritecave.blogspot.co.uk/
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russbost
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| posted on 27/12/06 at 06:18 PM |
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My cars handling is very neutral despite having about 2/3's of the weight up the back end, when you push to the absolute limit it starts to
understeer slightly, but a dab of throttle puts the back end out - can then be controlled on the throttle just like a kart
I no longer run Furore Products or Furore Cars Ltd, but would still highly recommend them for Acewell dashes, projector headlights, dominator
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Don't forget Stainless Steel Braided brake hoses, made to your exact requirements in any of around 16 colours.
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NOTE:This user is registered as a LocostBuilders trader and may offer commercial services to other users
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kb58
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| posted on 27/12/06 at 06:23 PM |
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quote:
Originally posted by goodall
do mid engined cars not understeer like theres no tomorrow with just a few bit of box iron loading the front wheels
Kind of like saying, "What type of personality do blondes have?" It's hard to make broad (sorry) generalizations 
Some people feel that a mid-engine car will understeer due to <50% weight on the front tires. Yet others say it'll oversteer due to having
>50% on the rear tires.
Personally, I don't believe there's anything magic about having 50% weight distribution. It's never that value unless sitting still
or at constant speed. How long can a car remain at an unchanging speed in a turn? Plus, it's likely the rear tires on this perfectly balanced
car are larger than the front tires - so much for perfectly balanced traction. With larger rears, it'll push (understeer) in a constant speed
corner.
Check out my videos for how mine handles. In the latest is me spinning it, due to braking hard way too late into a turn; that will happen in any car.
Mine is 41/59 F/R, and I'm very happy with it. The car is very easy to place in any attitude. If I take a corner at constant spend, it has
slight understeer. But if I get on the gas, it transisions smoothly to oversteer, and it's very easy to modulate, to stay between the two
extremes.
Mid-engine Locost - http://www.midlana.com
And the book - http://www.lulu.com/shop/kurt-bilinski/midlana/paperback/product-21330662.html
Kimini - a tube-frame, carbon shell, Honda Prelude VTEC mid-engine Mini: http://www.kimini.com
And its book -
http://www.lulu.com/shop/kurt-bilinski/kimini-how-to-design-and-build-a-mid-engine-sports-car-from-scratch/paperback/product-4858803.html
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nitram38
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| posted on 27/12/06 at 06:43 PM |
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quote:
Originally posted by russbost
My cars handling is very neutral despite having about 2/3's of the weight up the back end, when you push to the absolute limit it starts to
understeer slightly, but a dab of throttle puts the back end out - can then be controlled on the throttle just like a kart
I can second that......I was right behind you when you did it !
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NDC790
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| posted on 27/12/06 at 10:26 PM |
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If you build it..............it will run!
We hope.
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cloudy
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| posted on 27/12/06 at 11:47 PM |
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actually the further the weight is to the rear, the higher the tendency for oversteer, it's not about the weight on the wheels, but rather the
inertia they are having to deal with, when you turn the wheels it's actually having to move less mass than the rear wheels and the car will tend
to oversteer (even without your foot planted)
J
[Edited on 27/12/06 by cloudy]
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khaOs
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| posted on 28/12/06 at 11:25 PM |
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kb what books do you recomend from that list? several of those i can't buy here and the ones i can buy are kind of expensive. The areas where i
have more doubts are the chassis and suspension.
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kb58
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| posted on 29/12/06 at 12:13 AM |
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Anything by Staniforth. He has a practical, easy to understand, way of explaining things. Worked for me.
Mid-engine Locost - http://www.midlana.com
And the book - http://www.lulu.com/shop/kurt-bilinski/midlana/paperback/product-21330662.html
Kimini - a tube-frame, carbon shell, Honda Prelude VTEC mid-engine Mini: http://www.kimini.com
And its book -
http://www.lulu.com/shop/kurt-bilinski/kimini-how-to-design-and-build-a-mid-engine-sports-car-from-scratch/paperback/product-4858803.html
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Doug68
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| posted on 29/12/06 at 12:45 AM |
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Amazon.co.uk has the "Race & Rally Car Source Book" together with Herb Adams "Chassis Engineering" which is another very
practical book for 22 pounds, I don't think the post to you would be too much.
http://www.amazon.co.uk/Race-Rally-Car-Source-Book/dp/1859608469/sr=1-1/qid=1167352750/ref=sr_1_1/026-8771094-8851606?ie=UTF8&s=books
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khaOs
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| posted on 20/2/07 at 05:02 AM |
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Chassis Engineering should be here this week. i'll read this one and after that i'll see what i should do..
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