Volvorsport
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| posted on 27/9/05 at 07:47 PM |
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metro turbo is T3 based , much better to use r5 , or volvo 4 series , as thats a T2 .
having not bothered ever with bike engines - i couldnt advise which is the best one to use . what turbos do holeshot use? - that would be my starting
point
www.dbsmotorsport.co.uk
getting dirty under a bus
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ChrisGamlin
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| posted on 27/9/05 at 07:57 PM |
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What make / model turbo is it?
Have a look what else its fitted to, cos on a Metro its boosting a 60bhp engine to about 90bhp so first impressions would say no, although it may be
capable of blowing much more than it does in that application.
Dont underestimate the costs of doing it though, I know Doug did his blade on a very low budget but Im sure its taken a lot of ingenuity, engineering
knowledge, access to facilities and lots of time to do it. The costs are soon going to mount up if you need to buy things like a decent turbo, pay for
custom manifolds and plenums to be made, buy an intercooler and plumb it in etc etc.
Also I would personally factor in my own opinion that the blade in a BEC isnt far off its engineering limits, esecially the clutch and gearbox, so Im
not sure Id be keen to put another 50-60bhp through the engine without beefing up the drivetrain internals at least.
Chris
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ChrisGamlin
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| posted on 27/9/05 at 07:58 PM |
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Holeshot use the one off a Volvo T5 (850/V70?) for the busa ISTR
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mike-ktm
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| posted on 27/9/05 at 08:11 PM |
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to be honest Chris, that was kinda why I was considering the Metro unit - thought 30-40 bhp may be enough of a power step without going crazy and
mashing gearboxes by the mins 
Understand what you mean about the costs spiralling, but i'm pretty much ok on the fab side of things - just a little ignorant about what bits
are needed etc. (which is where i could save about 80-90 % on the likes of a holeshot kit hopefully)
Keep the info coming fellas - this is turning out to be very informative.
Cheers,
Mike
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ChrisGamlin
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| posted on 27/9/05 at 08:45 PM |
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Just to add some stuff to think about, this is a rough list of my mate Bazzer's expenditure on his Megabusa turbo conversion over the winter
quote:
Buying from the US can save a fair bit for the internals.
But here is a taste of the the things I can remember
Turbo £800
Headers £600
Airbox with injectors £600
Rods £800 ($900 if bought in states)
Pistons £400 ($400 in states I think)
Heavy duty Output shaft £300
Link Pipe £80
Intercooler £400
Laminova Oil cooler £350
Boost / fuel pressure gauge £250
Secondary ECU £400
Hoses £500
Induction pipes £250
Fuel Pump £180
Fuel Reg £90
Wastgate Actuator £90 ( old one wanted to be where a chassis rail was)
Dump valve £220 (Same problem as above)
Radiator £300 (Westfield 4 core)
Various TIG welding jobs and fab work £500
Big Air Filter induction kit £150
Uprated Gearbox £800 (includes replacing a couple of gears, your 3/4 gear at least will be worn :-)
You could obviously save some money on some things if you buy secondhand. I will have forgot some stuff which will bump the price up a bit more.
This is the sort of things you would be looking at. I know people will question the above but if you want to use new parts and you want good
engineering solutions to the problem you will face, it will cost a lot.
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mike-ktm
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| posted on 27/9/05 at 08:50 PM |
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Can anyone who's done this the DIY tight*rse route show us their costs ?
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ChrisGamlin
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| posted on 27/9/05 at 09:01 PM |
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It has to be said, it does look like a show vehicle for Samco / Aeroquip though, and should be over 300bhp at the wheels when fully mapped
[Edited on 27/9/05 by ChrisGamlin]
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mike-ktm
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| posted on 27/9/05 at 09:09 PM |
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Blimey Guv'ner
No wonder he managed to spend so much ! V.Nice tho all the same. I'd only be looking at the er.....cost effective method shall we say ?
hehehe
Mike
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ChrisGamlin
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| posted on 27/9/05 at 09:11 PM |
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Lots more pics here if you're interested 
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mike-ktm
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| posted on 27/9/05 at 09:22 PM |
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Thats very nice Chris - real pro. job there, wouldn't be surprised at 300 bhp at all ! Is the manifold mild steel ? Do each of the primaries not
have to be equal length ? (would make life a lot easier for me if they didn't - as shown)
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ChrisGamlin
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| posted on 27/9/05 at 09:32 PM |
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300bhp at the wheels is a conservative estimate, will be at least 350bhp at the crank with a bar of boost, internals are good for 400+
The manifold is mild steel then Camcoated, bought from Holeshot. Ideally they would be equal length but packaging dictates you cant really do it, and
it won't really have a significant effect on a turbo engine anyway, the reason to do it on a normally aspirated engine is to increase the
scavenging effect of the exhaust pulses, but with a turbo sitting in the exhaust you cant gain anything that way anyway, and even if you did I imagine
the gains are almost non existent compared to the gains from the turbo itself.
[Edited on 27/9/05 by ChrisGamlin]
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soggy
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| posted on 27/9/05 at 10:39 PM |
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turbo
hi guys take a look at this found it months ago www.turbo-bike.net
if at first u dont succeed use a bigger hammer!
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soggy
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| posted on 27/9/05 at 10:42 PM |
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or www.situne.no
if at first u dont succeed use a bigger hammer!
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soggy
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| posted on 27/9/05 at 10:46 PM |
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or www.cbr900rrt.co.uk
if at first u dont succeed use a bigger hammer!
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garage19
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| posted on 28/9/05 at 07:10 AM |
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quote:
Originally posted by mike-ktm
Can anyone who's done this the DIY tight*rse route show us their costs ?
Right,
Manifold - £0
Bought the bike crash damaged and this included a manifold that had been a bit flatened. Cut it up and used that. Mig welded and coated in high temp
paint!
Headers do not need to be equal length. Would coat with ceramic next time (£80) and tig weld as i have just learn't to!!!
Flanges were laser cut by a mate, but you can buy then for pennies off ebay these days.
Intercooler £6 + £20 welding.
Cut down an old subaru on i found at the breakers and made my own end tanks that i got welded at local fab shop.
Turbo - £30
Local scrap yards or ebay! RHB5 or small T2/5 are your best bet.
Plenum - £0
Made from steel. Tubes turned up that connect to carbs were bonded (posh for extra strength arraldite, with whole lot baked in oven) into plenum to
prevent distortion.
Fuel pump - £5
XR3i from a breakers
Regulator - £50 malapssi/FSE one from burton power.
Dump valve!!!!! £10 from a local gary boy.
2x genuine honda headgaskets to lower the CR £80
This is waht holeshot do on most of they're conversions.
Associated fittings from local hydraulics place prob made up a bit of the rest.
A blade engine will take 190-200 bhp all day with no probs. Up rate the clutch springs and check your plates are in good nick, but that is about
it!!!
Doug.
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Jeffers_S13
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| posted on 28/9/05 at 12:41 PM |
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Nice work, very impressed
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kb58
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| posted on 28/9/05 at 04:01 PM |
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About parts cost...
Tuning (extremely important) may very well cost more then all the parts listed. Even if you make/buy your own ECU, it still needs a dyno/rolling road
session to do the tuning right.
Leaving tuning out will likely mean a destroyed engine. Buillding a *reliable* turbo engine is not cheap. Yes it can be done less then buying a
complete solution, but the cost doesn't stop at just the components.
Mid-engine Locost - http://www.midlana.com
And the book - http://www.lulu.com/shop/kurt-bilinski/midlana/paperback/product-21330662.html
Kimini - a tube-frame, carbon shell, Honda Prelude VTEC mid-engine Mini: http://www.kimini.com
And its book -
http://www.lulu.com/shop/kurt-bilinski/kimini-how-to-design-and-build-a-mid-engine-sports-car-from-scratch/paperback/product-4858803.html
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mike-ktm
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| posted on 28/9/05 at 09:55 PM |
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Agreed
A good rolling road session was always on the cards to get it running right throughout the rev range.
Garage19, what did you do fuelling wise, ecu, etc. ? Did you go to a mappable system ?
Cheers guys,
Mike
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mike-ktm
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| posted on 28/9/05 at 11:13 PM |
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As oppose to the thick end of £500, including a rolling road session ?!?!?!?!
If it all goes bang - i surrender and stick another blade motor in/rebuild for £400. I reckon i'm willing to take my chances for that money !
Who's with me ?
Mike
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mike-ktm
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| posted on 28/9/05 at 11:16 PM |
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Could've sworn there was a post a second ago where someone said the expensive rout was the thick end of 8 or 9 grand or so ????
Think i'm going mad / seeing things. Sleep may be a good idea methinks................
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colibriman
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| posted on 28/9/05 at 11:19 PM |
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no, it was definitely there....I'm sure it's deleted for a good reason though..
maybe that was priveliged info..
need a bike engine? - www.colibriman.com
SVA ready Mk Indyblade possibly for sale.....if the offers good...!
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NOTE:This user is registered as a LocostBuilders trader and may offer commercial services to other users
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mike-ktm
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| posted on 28/9/05 at 11:23 PM |
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Thanks Colibriman - if nothing else it proves I won't be on my own in the place with padded rooms ???
aahhh........padded rooms. Must go,,,,
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kb58
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| posted on 29/9/05 at 01:15 AM |
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quote:
Originally posted by mike-ktm
If it all goes bang - i surrender and stick another blade motor in/rebuild for £400. I reckon i'm willing to take my chances for that money !
I'd rather pull onto the track and not wonder if I'll finish. Cutting corners is a hollow victory after you've paid your track fee
and blow up the motor after two laps, then spend £400 to put in another. Of course that one will blow up too since it's not tuned either...
Oh, and if another fellow shows up with the exact same car combination as you, except his is tuned, he'll be faster.
If nothing else, at least test it with a wide-band to confirm the mix is at least close!
[Edited on 9/29/05 by kb58]
Mid-engine Locost - http://www.midlana.com
And the book - http://www.lulu.com/shop/kurt-bilinski/midlana/paperback/product-21330662.html
Kimini - a tube-frame, carbon shell, Honda Prelude VTEC mid-engine Mini: http://www.kimini.com
And its book -
http://www.lulu.com/shop/kurt-bilinski/kimini-how-to-design-and-build-a-mid-engine-sports-car-from-scratch/paperback/product-4858803.html
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jambojeef
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| posted on 4/10/05 at 09:06 PM |
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Hi all,
Doug nice costings - well done getting it made for that amount of money. Pretty much the same set-up and me then I guess.
Interesting to note that you reckon the t25's turbine housing might be a bit big - I guess I'll just have to see now!
The guys I've spoken to at various places reckon a hybrid isnt actually too costly to build from a t25 even from turbo technics so I'll
just have see how she drives and get her set-up as the funds come in I suppose!
Interesting though - would love to see your turboed blade some time Doug
Geoff
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