scootz
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| posted on 4/6/10 at 10:39 AM |
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BEC Engine Layout
Two things put me off BEC's:
1. The (unnaturally... to me) long prop-shaft on a front engine BEC. I just don't like 'em!
2. The chain and poor reverse set-up on a Middy BEC. I don't want to have to wax a chain every time I take the car out and I want a reverse that
WORKS!
The answer is of course to splash out on a Quaife / Powertec reversing diff assy or their gear-drive system, but at £2.5k and £4k respectively, the
bank-manager says 'NO'!
So, how about this... the bike engine mounted longitudinally in Middy position. Sprocket adapter connected immediately to a reverse box (MNR?).
Reverse box connected immediately to a diff.
Got to be a much cheaper option, but can any of the more mechanically minded spot any issues with this set-up?
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It's Evolution Baby!
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jimgiblett
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| posted on 4/6/10 at 10:59 AM |
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The Fury Menace had this configuration with just a UJ between engine and diff and it was still infront of drivers shoulder meaning almost no legroom
for the passenger
The big issues I see are
- where is the driver going to sit?
- the car will be very rear biased weight wise, and probably not too pleasant to drive quickly.
- Jim
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adithorp
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| posted on 4/6/10 at 11:14 AM |
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As Jim says, thats how the Menace is although the only one I've see was a single seat. To put it behind the seats you'd have to lengthen
the wheelbase or have the seats very far forward. Personally I'd think something like a rubber coupling might be needed just to make it less
harsh.
Whats "unnaturally long" about a BEC drive shaft? It's such a short car and certainly no longer than a Sierra one.
adrian
"A witty saying proves nothing" Voltaire
http://jpsc.org.uk/forum/
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matt_gsxr
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| posted on 4/6/10 at 11:15 AM |
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Or completely forget the passenger and go dp1 style using your S4 engine
The problem is that the bike engine in the longitudinal orientation with a reverse box and a diff on the end ends up being quite long.
You could hang the bike engine out the back, a la 911. That would buy back your passenger space, and make for amusing handling.
Matt
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scootz
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| posted on 4/6/10 at 11:17 AM |
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How does that work Matt? Having the trannie offset to one side?
It's Evolution Baby!
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m8kwr
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| posted on 4/6/10 at 11:28 AM |
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I have got a converted ford lsd chain drive from doug @ westgarage. The unit I have has a reverse unit, it was his prototype 
Not sure on how good the reverse will be, as not even installed it in the car, but this cost be no where near 2.5k.
But like you say, I will have to wax the chain...
I went this route because I can use other ford components etc, to try and keep the cost down.
From the pictures i have seen I think the warner R4 uses this unit as well, or something very similar.
[Edited on 4/6/10 by m8kwr]
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tony-devon
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| posted on 4/6/10 at 12:09 PM |
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use a good o ring or X ring chain, and a scott oiler if your worried
heavy is good, heavy is reliable, and if it breaks, hit them with it
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BenB
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| posted on 4/6/10 at 12:35 PM |
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Of course chain drive isn't necessary if you buy a shaft driven bike engine 
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matt_gsxr
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| posted on 4/6/10 at 01:20 PM |
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Follow the link for more information.
http://dpcars.net/dp1v8/
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ed1801
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| posted on 4/6/10 at 01:54 PM |
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My bike chain and sprockets on my 600cc bike have lasted 30k miles with a scottoiler and still going strong. All I do is bung a bit of used engine oil
in every month. Messy, but zero effort...
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norfolkluego
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| posted on 4/6/10 at 05:38 PM |
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quote:
Originally posted by scootz
How does that work Matt? Having the trannie offset to one side?
Dunno but Mallock have been doing it for years so it must be OK
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Livio
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| posted on 5/6/10 at 09:50 AM |
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If you don't want to lubricate the chain too often I would recommend you a full case for it (just like the good old MZ TS).
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TheGecko
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| posted on 6/6/10 at 08:58 AM |
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I don't agree about the unnatural length of the prop shaft but I certainly agree about the reverse issue. Why not take a leaf from the Badsey
book and do it like the Badsey Bullet. This used a front mounted bike engine with a
conventional RWD gearbox mounted immediately behind with only 4th, 5th, & reverse, thus acting as both a hi-lo range box and a reverse box. From
memory the Bullet used one of the RWD Corolla boxes (probably a K50 or T50) but anything of similar ilk would do the job.
Just a thought,
Dominic
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scootz
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| posted on 6/6/10 at 10:03 AM |
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It's a psychological thing with the prop Dominic... there's no logic based on it!
Some interesting ideas though... thanks for the input guys.
It's Evolution Baby!
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renrut
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| posted on 7/6/10 at 03:41 PM |
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That layout will be long as the others have said and that will create lots of other problems esp if you want a reasonably short wheelbase.
THings that might also be an issue will be angles into the diff and out of the engine.
Maybe a better solution would to feed the output directly into a rear transaxle like one from a porsche 924.
Why are all the fun things in life expensive!
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JF
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| posted on 12/6/10 at 11:03 AM |
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quote:
Originally posted by Livio
If you don't want to lubricate the chain too often I would recommend you a full case for it (just like the good old MZ TS).
Yeah or even a leak proof full case with a layer of oil in it. Running the chain in an oil bath. You'll just have to check on wear every so
often and replace when worn.
If it's good enough for main rotors of helicopters....
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