PSpirine
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| posted on 4/2/13 at 06:18 PM |
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Unlicensed vehicle fine from DVLA!
Locost collective, can you offer your thoughts on this please?
I got given a BMW 7 series from a friend last November (first week).
Sent away the V5 at the same time.
On the 25th November (ish) I parked it up on a street in the village.
Tax expired on the 30th November.
I thought I'd be able to tax the car online with the green slip, as it had valid MOT and insurance. No such luck, you need the reference number
from the full V5.
On the 8th December I got a sticker on the car saying "Police aware, car untaxed, DVLA made aware" or something to that effect.
V5 didn't arrive till about the 10th December. At which point I instantly taxed it online with no problems.
Today I received a letter from DVLA saying that "We have received an offence report alleging that at 11:00 on 8/12/12 the above vehicle was
kept on a public road unlicensed" bla bla bla.
"If you were responsible for the alleged offence, an out of court settlement of £67.00 is requested by the 17/02/13"
Question is what do I do?
Yes the vehicle was technically parked on a public road for 10 days untaxed. However, there was no way I could reasonably tax it as I hadn't
received the V5 yet! Is there any point trying to pursue this further, or shall I just pay up?
I have no problem engaging in letter tennis with them over this as I do feel this is slightly unfair given that they fined me instantly, with no
notice despite ministerial approval of a 2 week compliance period! I always tax and insure my cars so a bit of a kick in the nuts.
What I don't want to happen is for me to write to them endlessly and then end up with a black mark on my record and a settlement fee
that'll be several times higher which I'll have to pay.
Thoughts?
Thanks,
Pavel
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theduck
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| posted on 4/2/13 at 06:32 PM |
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Can be taxed with new keepers supplement slip at both post office and dvla local office, so no excuse really.
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Ninehigh
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| posted on 4/2/13 at 06:33 PM |
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Start the game by notifiying them that you bought the car taxed, and while waiting for the V5 to turn up in your name the tax had expired. Since then
you kept it off the road and as soon as you were able to it got taxed. Since that tax covers all of december there's no case to answer.
I guess then if they really want to press it it's the DVLA's fault you couldn't tax it
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r1_pete
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| posted on 4/2/13 at 06:35 PM |
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I had problems with the bike I bought from a dealer, and didn't tax it, and don't intend to until better weather, I couldn't do
anything online or at the Post Office, even when the V5 arrived.
I just rang them up and explained, they noted the conversation, pointed me at the right form online, I filled it and sent it off, all now OK.
I would give them a call and explain what has happened, you may get a sympathetic hearing, but, the car has been kept on a public road, which is where
you are going to have problems....
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morcus
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| posted on 4/2/13 at 06:40 PM |
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If I've read it right, you have committed an offence thats entirely your fault, you left an untaxed car on the road so you don't have a
leg to stand on as you had two options, tax it or put it somewhere off the road and I'd guess thats what they'll say.
I pretty sure that if you buy tax online without using the reminder then the car should still be off the road until it arrives.
In a White Room, With Black Curtains, By the Station.
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R1 STRIKER
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| posted on 4/2/13 at 06:50 PM |
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Dvla are always hard to deal with. But as you say the car was mot'd, insured and you had the green slip, you were able to tax it at any post
office that does car tax. I think if I were you i'd just get it paid before they increase the fine.
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Ben_Copeland
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| posted on 4/2/13 at 06:59 PM |
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No tax it shouldnt of been on the road, unfortunately its as simple as that.
Ben
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CRAIGR
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| posted on 4/2/13 at 07:01 PM |
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Could have been taxed at post office with the green slip so unfortunately i would just pay the fine and put it down to experience. 
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Dunbikin
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| posted on 4/2/13 at 07:44 PM |
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I had a very similar experience. I bought a van untaxed, I insured it and drove it home. It was parked on the in laws drive until the insurance docs
came through so I could tax it at the post office. The insurance documents came through on the Wednesday morning, so I bought the van home Wednesday
evening and parked it in our close. My wife went to the post office Thursday morning and taxed it. When she got back the van had been clamped and a
big sticker stuck on the windscreen saying unlicensed vehicle. I phoned the clamping company and said it had been taxed that morning (It was about
28th November) and the tax disc started from the 1st November. They said the tax disc starts from the time on the receipt from the post office and it
would cost £180 to get the clamp removed, and if I didn't pay within 2 days the van would be towed away. luckily enough about an hour after I
got home from work somebody cut the clamp off with an angry grinder ( I presume) and I didn't here another thing from the clampers. Anyway about
2 weeks later I got a letter from the DVLA stating I had an untaxed vehicle parked on the road and I had to pay a £50.00 fine. I rung them up and
explained that it had been taxed as soon as I could and that I had paid for all of November, although I had only owned the van for 4 days. They said
technically it still is an offence but they would waive the fine because of the circumstances. So maybe it is worth a phone call to the DVLA and just
hope you get through to someone with a bit of common sense. Good luck
Ron said it would cost 250 quid. My wife thinks it did.
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JoelP
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| posted on 4/2/13 at 07:48 PM |
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Well it seems we have all been turned into a bunch of hoop jumpers. The spirit of the law is that you pay VED. He has complied with the spirit in that
the car was tax was paid for every month. Just because it was paid late one month is a poo reason for a fine greater than the whole months duty.
I vote put it back in the same spot and burn it there, see what they make of that.
Ps how kind of someone to cut the clamp off dunbikin! Love it.
[Edited on 4/2/13 by JoelP]
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chillis
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| posted on 4/2/13 at 07:59 PM |
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Been caught this way myself. Council wanted access to my drive so had to park SORNed car on the road - for just one day - got a ticket - tried talking
to them, they just said keep talking 'cos it'll double the fine, I parked an unlicensed car on the road, its an offence no choice but to
pay up
Also got busted last summer for failure to display a valid tax disc, it had slipped part way down between screen and dash, I again tried to tell them
it was taxed as their records would show, they just came back with we know it was taxed but you are required to display the disc so it can be easily
read from outside, it wasn't so you have to pay!
[Edited on 4/2/13 by chillis]
Never under estimate the ingenuity of an idiot!
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MikeRJ
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| posted on 4/2/13 at 08:12 PM |
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quote:
Originally posted by theduck
Can be taxed with new keepers supplement slip at both post office and dvla local office, so no excuse really.
Quite true, I have taxed several cars using the new keepers supplement.
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rpm
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| posted on 4/2/13 at 08:23 PM |
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dvla are thieves! i've just had similar experience over sorn, last march i bought a sorned car,the same day i sorned it online and received a
confirmation email, thought no more of it. in november i get a letter from dvla saying i owe a £80 fine as the sorn has run out, (this was the sorn
taken out by the previous owner,) i pointed out that sorns are not transferrerable there own system had confirmed my sorning and that the online
pages only required the reference number from the V5 which i had at the time, after several to and fro letters and going through the complaints
system they still refuse to accept my view but as a gesture of goodwill reduced the fine to £40, so in the end i paid it today because it's not
worth anymore hassle, i noted that since my letter to the dvla chief executive there is a new webpage stating that if you are a new owner and
don't hold the V5 you have to sorn by post using the correct form and can't do it online, (not suspicious at all)
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PSpirine
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| posted on 4/2/13 at 08:39 PM |
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Thanks all, I have no problem paying the £67 (well, I'm a bit bitter)
It's just I genuinely did everything I reasonably could to try and follow the spirit, if not the letter, of the law. I didn't use the car
in the period I couldn't tax it (going to the post office unfortunately is not possible when you're working daytime hours Mon-Sat), but
yes I did keep it on a road.
I'll give them a call tomorrow and see whether they can reduce or waive it due to circumstances. If not, I'll just go out a bit less this
month! 
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mark chandler
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| posted on 4/2/13 at 09:12 PM |
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quote:
Originally posted by JoelP
Well it seems we have all been turned into a bunch of hoop jumpers. The spirit of the law is that you pay VED. He has complied with the spirit in that
the car was tax was paid for every month. Just because it was paid late one month is a poo reason for a fine greater than the whole months duty.
I vote put it back in the same spot and burn it there, see what they make of that.
Ps how kind of someone to cut the clamp off dunbikin! Love it.
[Edited on 4/2/13 by JoelP]
If they let people tax after the event then no-one would bother taxing cars, simples.
It was not taxed, it was on the road so a fine is due.
[Edited on 4/2/13 by mark chandler]
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ReMan
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| posted on 4/2/13 at 09:22 PM |
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quote:
Originally posted by PSpirine
Thanks all, I have no problem paying the £67 (well, I'm a bit bitter)
It's just I genuinely did everything I reasonably could to try and follow the spirit, if not the letter, of the law. I didn't use the car
in the period I couldn't tax it (going to the post office unfortunately is not possible when you're working daytime hours Mon-Sat), but
yes I did keep it on a road.
I'll give them a call tomorrow and see whether they can reduce or waive it due to circumstances. If not, I'll just go out a bit less this
month!
Good luck! No really, I hope you persuade them to waive it.
IMO and experience (very similar) your fooked
www.plusnine.co.uk
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Davegtst
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| posted on 4/2/13 at 09:22 PM |
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If I were you I would pay it straight away and be done with it. I put an untaxed car on a road for no more than an hour and had the dvla round
clamping it right infront of me. They said I had to go and get it taxed then prove to them it was taxed then pay a fine otherwise it was going to be
crushed. Fortunatly I managed to bribe them!
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ianclark1275
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| posted on 4/2/13 at 11:58 PM |
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the DVLA are a funny bunch arent they??
completely institutionalized
like one of those mental hospitals but still full of patients.. :-D
there local offices do not accept incoming calls, i want a phone at work like that, one that never rings, unbelivable
anyway
i used to get those SORN letters saying 40 fine when SORN first came out and i used to bin them
i tried it last year and they are much keener...
i would definitely challenge them as they have had all there tax due, and want more?
talk to them and if its starts looking like your not going to sway them, then have a rant and at least you may feel better
IC
measure twice, cut once, scrap it, start again.
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Ninehigh
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| posted on 5/2/13 at 01:07 AM |
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quote:
Originally posted by chillis
Also got busted last summer for failure to display a valid tax disc, it had slipped part way down between screen and dash, I again tried to tell them
it was taxed as their records would show, they just came back with we know it was taxed but you are required to display the disc so it can be easily
read from outside, it wasn't so you have to pay!
If they know it's taxed why do we need a slip of paper that tells them what they already know?
I've been tempted to "accidentally" slip my new one behind the old one (I just stuck it in the holder officer, I didn't check
it was on top!) and see how long it is before anyone notices
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coyoteboy
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| posted on 5/2/13 at 01:43 AM |
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I don't see any argument her. Parked on road untaxed, fine issued, simple. "spirit of the law" means nothing, you either follow the
letter of the law or you break it.
Everyone knows the rules, the responsibly less with the owner/keeper.
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swanny
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| posted on 5/2/13 at 09:07 AM |
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this is making me think i was very lucky, but it seems to suggest that they are really inconsistent about the way they punish this offence,
i bought a car late 2011 from a dealer and we agreed (i think; no way to prove it now one way or the other) for him to tax it. got down there, handed
over my car, picked up the new one all excited and drove off...failed to check tax.
then about a week after getting back from the le mans classic i got a letter saying that i had been spotted by a camera at the ferry port without a
valid tax disc. turns out dealer hadnt renewed it, and it had expired the previous december, so i'd been driving about all that time without
tax. various threats about crushing etc in the letter.
got the paperwork together and drove straight to post office to buy tax. bought it, expecting at the very least to have to back date payment to
previous year, if not a referral for a fine etc then the lady said, i will have to charge you to the start of this month, is that ok?
ok? 6months wirthout tax? is it ok for me to pay a weeks extra tax? oh yeh!
makes me wonder why they arent stricter if they spot you on the cameras (i'm glad they arent) but also makes me think that its nosy neighbours
who spot and report untaxed vehicles maybe, and the kit car is never out on the drive for longer than the time it takes me to open the garage door.
paul
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mcerd1
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| posted on 5/2/13 at 09:18 AM |
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quote:
Originally posted by rpm
dvla are thieves! i've just had similar experience over sorn, last march i bought a sorned car,the same day i sorned it online and received a
confirmation email, thought no more of it. in november i get a letter from dvla saying i owe a £80 fine as the sorn has run out, (this was the sorn
taken out by the previous owner,) i pointed out that sorns are not transferrerable there own system had confirmed my sorning and that the online
pages only required the reference number from the V5 which i had at the time, after several to and fro letters and going through the complaints
system they still refuse to accept my view but as a gesture of goodwill reduced the fine to £40, so in the end i paid it today because it's not
worth anymore hassle, i noted that since my letter to the dvla chief executive there is a new webpage stating that if you are a new owner and
don't hold the V5 you have to sorn by post using the correct form and can't do it online, (not suspicious at all)
I had it a different way round
I was given a car that had been off the road since 1984 (so the last owner didn't need a sorn) - I asked if the transfer of ownership would
affect this and was told that technicaly it did and would need sorn'd, but ultimatly it was up to the local officer
so at the advice of the local officer I took out a sorn the same day as the V5 was changed, but the confirmation never came... phone them and they
said don't worry about it, its not liable for anything on the system.
next year I tried to renew the sorn online and on the phone with the v5 and both were rejected
I eventually got to talk to someone at swansea and they said it showed as last taxed 1984 so the computer can't accept a sorn for it as its not
required !!!
all this for a car thats been off the road for nearly 30 years - the last time it even near a public road was on the back of a trailer ~15 years
ago
In the end I'm onto a winner as I'll never have to sorn it untill after its been on the road again, but they made it very hard work to get
that answer
[Edited on 5/2/2013 by mcerd1]
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jossey
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| posted on 5/2/13 at 10:38 AM |
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quote:
Originally posted by theduck
Can be taxed with new keepers supplement slip at both post office and dvla local office, so no excuse really.
+1
Thanks
David Johnson
Building my tiger avon slowly but surely.
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