smart51
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| posted on 4/11/09 at 05:48 PM |
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Some guy just crashed into me. Whose fault do you think it is?
On my way home this evening some guy crashed into me. Here is an old photo of the island in question
Multimap Link.
New description
I hope this is clearer. I was approaching the island in the link from the south, in the right hand lane of 3 lanes. The left lane most lane was
marked as turning left only with painted arrows on the road. There was a short queue of slowly moving traffic in the middle and right hand lanes.
The car in front of me pulled on to the island and after checking the road was clear, I pulled on to the island too. To my left, a car pulled on to
the island but slightly later than me. My intention was to go straight on to the right hand lane of the dual carriage way in front of me.
After passing the exit to my left, I indicated left and continued towards my exit. I noticed the car to my left was rapidly moving closer to me so I
swerved to my right. Despite this, the car to my left hit me.
Whilst exchanging details, the other driver explained that he was turning right and always turned right from the middle lane. He believed himself to
be correct in this.
The damage to my car is the LHS front wing, front wheel and tyre, slight damage to the passenger door and marks all along the LHS of the car.
Original description
We were both travelling from the south on this map and collided where the circle is.
The road I was on is a dual carriageway with a 40 limit. The road going across the island is a single carriageway. The 2 lines divide into 3 at the
island. The left hand lane is marked turning left only by arrows painted on the road. I was in the right hand lane heading straight on for the right
hand lane of the dual carriageway. The car in front of me rolled almost to a stop then pulled onto the island, indicating right. I then pulled onto
the island. The car to my left, who was slightly behind me also pulled onto the island. Passing the last exit, I indicated left and headed for my
lane. I noticed that the car to my left was driving at me so swerved to the right but I was hit by him. He wanted to turn right, he explained,
saying that he always turns right from the middle lane at this island.
We swapped details but he insists he was correct in turning right from the middle lane. I think he was wrong and should have been in the right hand
lane. I also think that both middle and right hand lane are good for going straight ahead. Which is true?
[Edited on 4-11-2009 by smart51]
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mistergrumpy
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| posted on 4/11/09 at 05:51 PM |
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That's a map of Britain mate.
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r1_pete
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| posted on 4/11/09 at 05:53 PM |
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So you swerved and hit the car in front of you??
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smart51
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| posted on 4/11/09 at 06:01 PM |
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quote:
Originally posted by r1_pete
So you swerved and hit the car in front of you??
No, I swerved away from the car to my left who was trying to turn right. Despite this, he still hit me.
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iscmatt
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| posted on 4/11/09 at 06:07 PM |
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Ah, you mean round about when you say island! Yeah, middle and right hand lane for going straight and just right for going right.
It has taken me about 15 mins to work out what you were on about from your description though!!
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Richard Quinn
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| posted on 4/11/09 at 06:09 PM |
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I was witness to a similar incident on a roundabout by us. The exchanging of details became quite heated and the police were called. The advice from
the copper was to be aware of who is where and who is likely to do what and to be prepared to give way even if you consider yourself to be in the
right. Not very helpful in your case but I got the impression it would've just ended up going knock-for-knock.
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tandi
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| posted on 4/11/09 at 06:12 PM |
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I agree the middle lane is for straight on unless roundabout marking suggest otherwise, this one doesn't. The fact that you indicated and the
other driver drove into you means it should be his fault I would have thought?
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Hellfire
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| posted on 4/11/09 at 06:14 PM |
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The way I understand it is that if you are changing lane then it is your responsibility to exercise caution, if a collision occurs as a result of this
manoeuver you are in the wrong. The person who remains in the unmarked lane has right of way.
Phil
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MikeR
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| posted on 4/11/09 at 06:15 PM |
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sounds like you're technically right.....
bet the insurance will go for an easy life.....
Hope the damage isn't too great. I've got into the habit of looking to me left on roundabouts after having a few close calls with people
in the left hand lane (only two lanes) going right. Really pee's me off. Had it tonight with ..... highways traffic officer
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BenB
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| posted on 4/11/09 at 06:17 PM |
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Depends totally on the road markings and sign posts.
It sounds like the left lane is turn left only. If the other two lanes are unmarked then one has to assume it's a free-for-all. If the middle
lane is marked as straight on only then you can claim he was in the wrong lane (though the insurance company could say you should be on the look-out
for idiot drivers).
It's bad luck. I'd so you where clearly in the right lane and logically he wasn't. If he turns right into a single carriageway from
the middle lane then he's a gimp. But as said above the insurance company will say you should have spotted him doing stupid things.
Some wally in a Merc did exactly the same thing to me the other day where the North Circular meets the A41. Almost smashed me off the road Luckily
I spotted him in time....
the really fun one was when I was on a moderately large motorway exit roundabout and had to cut across three lanes from the outside lane just as the
person on the inner lane decided to do the opposite! What fun we had. We did almost both try to go into the middle lane just at the same time 
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turbodisplay
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| posted on 4/11/09 at 06:18 PM |
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You are in the right. I had a similar thing with me in the middle and an idiot in the left wanting to go stright ahead, i just nipped arround him. He
was flashing at me still not realising he was in the wrong.
Darren
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NOTE:This user is registered as a LocostBuilders trader and may offer commercial services to other users
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omega0684
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| posted on 4/11/09 at 06:20 PM |
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he should have been in the right hand lane if he was taking the third exit & head down stonehouse lane
approaching from barnes hill the left hand lane is left only the middle and right lane can be used to go straight onto the duel carridgeway (B4121)
and the right lane should be used to turn right only.
if he says he always uses the middle lane to turn right then he has always been driving incorrectly!
HTH's
I love Pinto's, even if i did get mine from P&O!
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woolly
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| posted on 4/11/09 at 06:45 PM |
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from the south togo to the east stonehouse lane - he should have been in the right hand lane before entering the roundabout.
get the highway code out and prove it to him.
woolly
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smart51
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| posted on 4/11/09 at 06:46 PM |
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My understanding of the highway code is that if you want to turn right, you should approach in the right hand lane indicating right unless otherwise
marked. In this instance, you must only turn left from the left hand lane. The highway code says you must choose the most appropriate lane for all
intermediate exits, only straight on in this case.
From this I believe the middle lane is for going to the left hand lane of the second exit. The right hand lane is for going straight on in the right
hand lane of the second exit, for turning right or for doing a U turn.
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r1_pete
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| posted on 4/11/09 at 06:52 PM |
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Yes he is definately wrong, going right round the roundabout in the left lane is against highway code, generally the reserve of flat cappers...
Have to agree though the insurers will try to take the easy option and pull the 'we have a 50/50 agreement with that insurance co.'
You'll need to fight it, it can be done, dont forget the choice of legal representation is yours you don't have to go with the insurers
appointment.
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Hellfire
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| posted on 4/11/09 at 06:54 PM |
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Were the lanes on the roundabout marked and were either of you changing lanes?
Phil
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oldtimer
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| posted on 4/11/09 at 06:55 PM |
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He was surely in the wrong lane, you were in a lane that could be used for a right turn so he incorrectly thought you were turning also. I also think
insurers may try and implicate you by saying the safest lane to approach on was the middle lane, which would also have prevented this accident
happening. You have done no wrong but the insurers might say you could have been more right!
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smart51
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| posted on 4/11/09 at 07:02 PM |
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quote:
Originally posted by Hellfire
Were the lanes on the roundabout marked and were either of you changing lanes?
Phil
The lanes on the roundabout are not marked, only the lanes leading up to the roundabout. The picture in the link is slightly out of date. The island
was resurfaced about a year ago and the hashed yellow box was not repainted.
As there are no lane markings on the roundabout itself it is hard to say if one or both of us were changing lanes. I contend that I approached in the
right hand lane and intended to exit in the right hand lane going straight ahead. I therefore did not change lane at any time. Given my view that
the middle lane should only be used for going to the left hand lane of the second exit, I believe the other driver did change lane.
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02GF74
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| posted on 4/11/09 at 07:09 PM |
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^^^ all of that is far too complicated.
if the lanes are marked, it makes no difference if there are arrows teliing to go left/right stright on but if you change lane, then it is your
responsiblity to ensure that you don't drive into some one.
so from what I understood of the descritpion, it is the other driver who moved out of his lane into your car. end of.
if you are in the right hand , eventually you wantto leave the roundabout so will have to corss lanes so make no odds what the arrows are saying.
obvioulsy if you are in the left hand lane and arrows say go left, then it still should be possible to go round the roundabout if you are able to to
so withiout coilissions.
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Hellfire
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| posted on 4/11/09 at 07:25 PM |
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Yeah, sounds to me like the guy who drove into you was in the wrong.
Phil
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Worzey
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| posted on 4/11/09 at 07:46 PM |
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Sounds like it will be a knock-for-knock settlement in your case.
I got caught a few years back. Three lanes onto a round-about. Me in the right lane turning right.
The guy in the left lane moved into the middle. The guy in the middle swerved into my lane and braked to avoid idiot in the left lane. I drove into
the guy who moved into my lane.
Guess what? I was blamed because I hit the other car from behind dispite having nowhere to go!!!! Go figure!
Caterham R400
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SteveWalker
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| posted on 4/11/09 at 07:58 PM |
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As the left lane is for left turn only, you can disregard it. Therefore you have two lanes (the middle and the right) and should be using the middle
or right for straight on and the right for turning right.
From what I've heard, most insurance companies cannot be bothered with the hassle and automatically go 50/50 on roundabout accidents unless
pushed very hard.
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Peteff
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| posted on 4/11/09 at 08:07 PM |
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If he hit you he obviously wasn't looking where he was going and it's his fault due to his inattention as well as being in the wrong lane.
Ask him if anyone else has ever got in his way ?
yours, Pete
I went into the RSPCA office the other day. It was so small you could hardly swing a cat in there.
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dhutch
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| posted on 4/11/09 at 08:15 PM |
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I have to admit i also think that the other driver was certainly not driving how i would.
- However, if the right and middle lane where not marked (on the left, left only) he may not actually be techincaly in the wrong? Not sure.
However, if he hit you, while you where taking avoiding action and where ahead of him (latter may be shown in marks on car?) that would be the line i
would be pushing.
To me, the real cock up, is the poor marking of the roundabout. You would in my mind be an idiot to use the middle entry lane to go right. But the
round markings imo should show that. Left for left only, middle for stright on only, right for right and stright on (given there are two exits)
Although often it would be left for left and stright on, middle for straight on only or stright and right, right for right only. Which may be half the
confusion.
Is this a newer image of the roundabout (2008)?
- Seam to still show box, but seems newly resurfaced.
http://maps.google.co.uk/maps?f=q&source=s_q&hl=en&geocode=&q=52.444754,-1.976788&ie=UTF8&ll=52.444882,-1.977088&spn=0.001
166,0.002309&t=k&z=19
Daniel
[Edited on 4/11/2009 by dhutch]
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roadrunner
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| posted on 4/11/09 at 08:37 PM |
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Just for argument's sake say the middle and right lanes are not marked giving as said a free for all on the roundabout, this means that if you
are in the right lane to go straight on and Jo dick is in the middle lane and he wants to go right, imagine the amount of accidents that would come
from a stupid idea . Your right he's wrong, but will the insurance companies see it that, who can tell.
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