I have just bought this westy reverse gearbox.
linky
I would need more info on it.
p.s. fixed the link to ebay
[Edited on 27/9/09 by ZEN]
Not what you want to here, but I was looking at the same type of box about 5 years ago when I was building my Indy. I spoke to Martin at MK who said
he'd had ten of these all of which had failed. I didn't bother in the end so i'm afraid I don't have first hand experience
Andy
won't want to hear this either but i'd get a refund and get the mnr one.
much smoother. i didnt have one in my mnr but saw it at a show and looked at the other makes there. IMHO of course
MNR sales the Quaife box at 700GBP
I wonder why.......
Also have read on this forum that Quaife reverse boxes fail to..
MNR do their own box, I think it's £500. Supposed to have very little power loss
Andy
That is NOT a Westfield Reverse Gearbox.
This is one of the three that I had circulating on/off the car last year.
http://img208.imageshack.us/img208/4572/reverse.jpg
I have a very awful feeling looking at the pictures that is not a device that I would want you to fit to your car, but then that's my limited
perspective on things.
I've used the factory Westfield gearboxes, and the Quaife ones too. They're damn good at what they do, they provide a solid mechanical
reverse for the huge number of normal people who trundle their cars around. However, bearings, spindles and flanges fail and they all leak (the chain
broke frequently in the Westfield one and the oil got literally pumped out the Quaife ). But, keep an eye on it, it's a consumable, and it
works.
When (ab)used on a track, they're not so good. With slicks, a lot less good. My factory rebuilt Westfield one lasted for 100 yards, exploding at
the top of Avon Rise, Combe (nasty). So for track use, slicks, I went centre bearing.
[Edited on 27/9/09 by motorcycle_mayhem]
quote:
Originally posted by motorcycle_mayhem
That is NOT a Westfield Reverse Gearbox.
quote:
When (ab)used on a track, they're not so good. With slicks, a lot less good. My factory rebuilt Westfield one lasted for 100 yards, exploding at the top of Avon Rise, Combe (nasty). So for track use, slicks, I went centre bearing.
id second that - its defo not a westfield box - new the westy box is over a grand! - well over..
Isn't that the old Blackbird (?) Engineering one ?
I think that was the name of the engineering company, that box must be circa 2003/4 ?
As said defo not a Westie one (green anodised), which are shite, if they last 1000 miles throw a party.
The Quaife ones tend to blow up because the breather spits the oil out and down the tunnel.
By fitting an overflow tank higher, this will let the oil drip back to the box. However they are still unreliable !
In my mind at the moment there is only one box to go for and that's the MNR, especially considering the abuse you should hopefully be giving
it.
Spoke to Marc, he's planning on putting some serious power through a few over the next year so we shall see if they are up to the job.
I will throw the rage of my 197HP 2008 busa engine at it in the spring...if not before 
It's a Eurotech FR2000, these haven't been made for years, I was under the impression that they were agricultural but strong, but the thread
below doesn't seem to suggest this
http://www.locostbuilders.co.uk/viewthread.php?tid=97687
Cheers
David
I think the Westfield reverse boxes are actually very good these days.
You hear of the odd bad story, but I have done loads of miles in mine now, and over 1000 track miles in the 18 months I've had the car, and the
reverse box is still going strong.
At one point I thought it had started leaking, but it turns out they just breath heavily. This means you just top up the oil every 3 months. I had
concerns about it dropping oil on track, but it doesn't seem to actually drop any oil until the car is left overnight, and what it does drop is
only about 3 drops of oil which collects on the chassis rails first, so it wouldn't cause any accidents.
mines doing well as well.. yea they are a bit rattly but its ok.. it does leak oil a bit but its only drips and only when driving.. the trick is dont
over fill it.. it blows out past the seals
its done nearly 15k miles so far no probs just the rear prop flange nut came loose - tightened that up..
Having done a BEC conversion nearly 12 years ago, and being one of the first to buy (and destroy) a westfield reverse box I am happy to share my
experiences on how to make the westfield box more reliable.
OK a little history. The boxes are made for westfield by an engineering company in the midlands (cant remember the name) and they are all
funadamentally flawed by design. To explain, firstly the splines on the input/output shaft are triangular. The should be square. This means the
flanges are always trying to ride up and down on the splines. To make matters worse, inside the box behind one of the flanges is a phosperous bronze
thrust washer. As you tighten up the flange lock nut, all this does is compress this soft washer so you can never get it really tight. Finally the box
only holds about 250ml of oil and as others have found this expels itself out the breather hole as the box heats up ...and it can get VERY hot if
you're dong a transit few hundred miles on a european motorway. The final flaw the the chain that supplied the drive for reverse. There is no
tensioner on the chain and it rattles like hell and can be easily broken with a clumsy left foot on the clutch.
So what happens when your driving. Well several things. As the box heats and cools up it expands and contracts as you would expect. This crushes the
thrust washer a little and then when it cools and contracts you suddenly have a loose flange on the spline. Oil runs down the splines to the back of
the lock nut and helps lubricate the flange moving on the triangular splines making the problem worse. At this point the flange is no longer tight and
it starts to vibrate as well as destroying the oil seals so the remaining oil that hasnt thrown itself out the breather already starts to leak. Your
box is going downhill fast at this point. One final nasty little symptom is the at high sustained speeds (motorway) the rattling chain starts to
expand in the heat and rides up on the sprocket on the layshaft. This makes the chain very tight and loads up the layshaft bearings which start to
overheat and make horrible thrumbing noises. When this happens you have to stop immediately (usally on the hard shoulder) engage reverse which loosens
the chain and allows it to drop down on the sprocket and off you can go again.
So why do I still have westfield reverse box and how do I make them last 6000 - 8000 miles between rebuilds.
You can buy a very expensive transmission "lock tite" type gloop especially for gear splines. Having meticulously cleaned flange &
spline, you pour this into the centre of the flange allowing the gloop to run down into the splines. It doesnt set rock hard but instead forms a sort
of "cushion" to take up any gap. This stuff is the real key to stop the flanges rattling loose. Once torqued up, the lock nut is merely
holding the flange in place, it's not really that tight once the thrust washer has "settled" and it's the gloop that's doing
all the work.
Next thing is I blocked the breather hole and replaced the top filler cap (m12 x 1.5 thread) with breather pipe of about 6mm internal diameter. This
feed to an expansion tank mount in the engine bay obviously above the height of the reverse box. Finaly I use Redline Heavy duty shockproof gear oil
... it's horrible stinky stuff but does the job and over fill the box with about 600mm of oil. This set up allows free flowing oil to expand
& drip back into the reverse box. Also the expansion tank is alluminium allowing it to absorb heat out of the oil as well. Finally I run an air
ducting pipe from the front grill down the transmission tunnel feeding cold air across the reverse box.
The only future upgrade I'm looking into is make some sort of chain tensioner to take away the rattling chain but that's going to be tricky
with the lack of space inside the box but i'll keep you posted....
Hope this is help to someone...... 
JR
I have an MK one for £250, would include postage to Croatia if less than £20
quote:
Originally posted by eznfrank
I have an MK one for £250, would include postage to Croatia if less than £20
quote:
Originally posted by loggyboy
quote:
Originally posted by eznfrank
I have an MK one for £250, would include postage to Croatia if less than £20
FAIL
OP is 2 years old!
@JB7
Thanks for the info!
Ref gloopy spline glue JB7 – what type is it? And where from?
Iv gotta do mine soon – iv been toying with a rip out and putting ANYTHING BETTER in but tbh the rgb works well – just its noisy and has lots of slack
in the take up in the transmission line. Gotta do it soon as its gonna break if I don’t.
Have you bought new parts for it when you rebuilt the box or not? From westfield? How much?
had my WF RGB in since 2004, straight away i realised oil pissing out of breather not a good idea, 1st the hillclimb fraternity would throw a fit, 2nd
fed up of cleaning my driveway & 3rd the thought of oil on my rear tyres not a good move, so blocked up breather & fitted catch tank via tube
& adaptor into the bolt hole in the top of the box so now instead of being a total loss oil system the oil drains back into the box & then i
made a hole in the aluminium footwell panel adjacent to the oil filler hole in the RGB to aid refilling, also wirelocked the bottom bolts holding the
box to the chassis as there was a tendancy for the oil to smother these lower nuts due to gravity resulting in the nuts loosening & the box moving
out of line & the prop fouling on a chassis rail. I use EP80/90 gear oil with molyslip & cant remember the last time i topped up the level.
Westfield have realised that having a R/H thread on both output shafts is not a good idea as one will have a tendency to undo hence the new RGB,s have
a L/H & R/H thread, like someone says its just poor design, in the time ive had it ive replaced the oils seals with the props detached in situ i
might add & also both flanges because of worn flange splines as the nuts have this tendancy to work loose, now i use plenty of thread loctite
& there is a recess on both ends of the output shafts, using a hammer you ping the outer edge of the nut (which is thinner than the body of the
nut) & this deformation of the nut into the recess stops the flange nut undoing, it seems everyone on the westfield site hates them but maybe im
just lucky
[Edited on 6/8/11 by andyfiggy2002]
I was just wondering what oil to use 
quote:
Originally posted by ZEN
I was just wondering what oil to use
The gloop I use is "Permatex Bearing Mount"
I've also got a technical drawing of the westfield box HERE which
also includes all the bearing reference numbers.
I'm about to head off on a two week tour of Austria in my westy so in the process of prepping the car I've doing some more experiments with
the reverse boxes (I have two & carry one as a spare when on tour)
Firstly I ordered a full set of bearings from www.simplybearings.co.uk who were by far the cheapest and fast delivery.
Test one was replacing the main and layshaft bearings - still noisy as hell & box get's as hot as ever
Test two was to then replace the two spigot bearings. Bu$$er to get out but improvement on the noise but still getting hot.
Test three was to remove the layshaft and chain (no reverse) big reduction in noise but still rattling when the transmission goes "slack" on
light throttle and box still get hot.
Test four was to then remove the transfer gear but leave it's bearing in place as a spacer. I also made a 1mm thick brass float washer to take up
the space. So effectively there are no moving parts inside the box now apart from the shaft itself. Box is now completely silent but still gets hot.
Test five was to reduce the oil level to the recommended level (previously i had it overfilled) and box runs a lot cooler albeit still warm. All the
noise has now dissappeared totally except for a slight rattle on slack transmission. This can only be the dogs rattling as there's nothing left
in there to make any noise
So in summary i reckon the overfill was contributing to the problem with all the gears thrashing around in it , it was generarting heat and of course
sapping power. I'm going to do the tour with the box as is, ie no reverse, and see how i get on and carry the spare box fully assembled.
Hope this is of some use to someone
Jonathan
quote:
Originally posted by JB7
The gloop I use is "Permatex Bearing Mount"
I've also got a technical drawing of the westfield box HERE which also includes all the bearing reference numbers.
I'm about to head off on a two week tour of Austria in my westy so in the process of prepping the car I've doing some more experiments with the reverse boxes (I have two & carry one as a spare when on tour)
Firstly I ordered a full set of bearings from www.simplybearings.co.uk who were by far the cheapest and fast delivery.
Test one was replacing the main and layshaft bearings - still noisy as hell & box get's as hot as ever
Test two was to then replace the two spigot bearings. Bu$$er to get out but improvement on the noise but still getting hot.
Test three was to remove the layshaft and chain (no reverse) big reduction in noise but still rattling when the transmission goes "slack" on light throttle and box still get hot.
Test four was to then remove the transfer gear but leave it's bearing in place as a spacer. I also made a 1mm thick brass float washer to take up the space. So effectively there are no moving parts inside the box now apart from the shaft itself. Box is now completely silent but still gets hot.
Test five was to reduce the oil level to the recommended level (previously i had it overfilled) and box runs a lot cooler albeit still warm. All the noise has now dissappeared totally except for a slight rattle on slack transmission. This can only be the dogs rattling as there's nothing left in there to make any noise
So in summary i reckon the overfill was contributing to the problem with all the gears thrashing around in it , it was generarting heat and of course sapping power. I'm going to do the tour with the box as is, ie no reverse, and see how i get on and carry the spare box fully assembled.
Hope this is of some use to someone
Jonathan
Westfield are sodding useless for parts ...i'm still waiting for prices from them four weeks later however the parts are all available elsewhere
if you look.
The chain is a standard Renold one however upon checking neither of mine have stretched at all. If you think about it, the chain is under no load
whatsoever. Ok it is spinning freely at prop speed but under no load so it's not really surprising that it does stretch. The only time it is
under load is when you're going in reverse. There was no signs of any real wear on the cogs too.
The spec for the bronze float washer is 2mm .... again mine was bang on. The spec for the bronze crush collet is 3.85mm. The last time I enquired
about a new set of crush collets, which was direct from the manufacturer (not westfield) they wanted 120GBP for them plus VAT!!!
You will note from the drawing that there is no end float whatsoever built into the design. I suspect this is where the heat is generated from thermal
expansion but not proven it yet. There is a float washer but it only provides float for the transfer gear.
When you go to rebuild I think you'll find a new set of bearings and seals (50GBP) is all you'll need and throw it all back together again.
The flange nuts are the only thing i've not been able to source. They are stake nuts M22 x 1.0 ..... let me know if you find a source for them
please.
wow, its funny on a locost site i get better information than on the westfield site?? i shove a shot of molyslip gear additive in addition to the gear oil in mine which might explain my RGB,s longevity & reliability, this stuff coats bearings and cogwheels with a molybdenum film, deadening unwanted sound and reducing the effort of gear changes