Can you drive to/from the IVA test on trade plates?


I'll have this to test in the not too distant future:



17 1/2 feet long and weighs the better part of 2 tonnes, so it'll mean hiring a seriously big trailer and a truck/4x4 thing to tow it with. Might be cheaper to pay a trader to get the train to our house in the morning, drive to the IVA test, then he heads back to work whilst IVA test is completed and pops back to drive it to the DVLA or back to our place. Added advantage is that the brakes bed in/engine warms up fully. (175k on the original Nikasil engine may be marginal on emissions)

Is this legal? Its an "unregistered car" right, same as any other new one/imported one? Can you pay people to move cars on trade plates? Can you ride with them? (to listen for clonks/clanks/bits about to drop off)


Thanks!

(Ideally I'd want somebody with a lockup so that if it fails on trivia we could work on it in Swansea and its a short hop back to IVA, rather than trucking all the way back to Pembrokeshire again)

ring dvla local office but i was allowed to drive my car to iva with no tradeplates at all just needed insurance on chassis number!!

drove to dvla inspection aswell

Dont ring DVLA ( unless its for sport)
You dont need any plates to drive to IVA any more than you need an MOT to drive to an MOT

quote:

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Originally posted by big_l
ring dvla local office but i was allowed to drive my car to iva with no tradeplates at all just needed insurance on chassis number!!
drove to dvla inspection aswell

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Cheers guys!

So if I can find an insurer that'll cover (26 y/o male & original car is 4.0 V8 / group 20) on the VIN, I can drive to a pre-booked IVA and registration with no MOT, tax, or plates?

Is there a relevant piece of paper that would show the "this ought to be illegal" know-all policeman that's bound to stop me knowing my luck/the look of the vehicle?

(I've been told all sorts of nonsense by DVLA when ringing them and its no defence in court)

Can I also drive from the IVA back home (nominated repair location) should it fail the IVA?

Thanks,

--
Marko

You have to have insurance (covered using the VIN instead of the reg' but you don't need trade plates. You can drive to and from an IVA with just insurance and the documents for the test to prove thats where you're going should you get stopped.

edit to add...
Don't ask DVLA. Iva is run by VOSA and it's the same regulation that allows you to drive to an MOT without a valid MOT. You can drive to and from a legally required inspection and to/from a place of repair to correct faults found during the test. Only in extream cercumstances will the VOSA inspector issue a prohibition notice if the car is deemed to be too dangerous to be allowed to leave under it's own steam (pretty rare).

[Edited on 14/1/12 by adithorp]

quote:

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Originally posted by adithorp
You have to have insurance (covered using the VIN instead of the reg' but you don't need trade plates. You can drive to and from an IVA with just insurance and the documents for the test to prove thats where you're going should you get stopped.

edit to add...
Don't ask DVLA. Iva is run by VOSA and it's the same regulation that allows you to drive to an MOT without a valid MOT. You can drive to and from a legally required inspection and to/from a place of repair to correct faults found during the test. Only in extream cercumstances will the VOSA inspector issue a prohibition notice if the car is deemed to be too dangerous to be allowed to leave under it's own steam (pretty rare).

[Edited on 14/1/12 by adithorp]

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Can I just ask why this needs an IVA ?

+1
Tell us a bit more about the car?

Interesting car!

When we kit-car types say "you are legally allowed to drive to a pre-arranged IVA test" we are talking about kit-cars / one - offs that we have built ourselves.

This vehicle, although very definitely a 'one-off' is obviously not a kit car, but a vehicle that has been converted from a standard model - that is one that is already covered under 'type approval' which Jaguar sorted many moons ago. The only reason to have to do a full IVA on it would be if you have altered the chassis from the original.
Reiterating what Snuggs has asked - why does it need an IVA test?

I think you may need a VIC check (same as you do with imported and Cat C / D write offs) to register it - however - to further fuel the debate - as you have cut the roof off, and the car's chassis is a monocoque - maybe you have altered the chassis........ (or was it built as a convertible originally?)......

On another point, as the insurance groups now go from 1 to 50, I think you will find it is a group 36 (ish) and not a 20.

Good luck!

quote:

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Originally posted by loggyboy

quote:

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Originally posted by adithorp
You have to have insurance (covered using the VIN instead of the reg' but you don't need trade plates. You can drive to and from an IVA with just insurance and the documents for the test to prove thats where you're going should you get stopped.

edit to add...
Don't ask DVLA. Iva is run by VOSA and it's the same regulation that allows you to drive to an MOT without a valid MOT. You can drive to and from a legally required inspection and to/from a place of repair to correct faults found during the test. Only in extream cercumstances will the VOSA inspector issue a prohibition notice if the car is deemed to be too dangerous to be allowed to leave under it's own steam (pretty rare).

[Edited on 14/1/12 by adithorp]

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Pretty sure that happened to the Haynes Roadster maybe?
Im sure I read he was glad he trailered it as the inspector wouldnt let him drive it home due to a brake issue? or maybe it was a different car, but same story...... i forget!

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It's got a vin number which identifies it as a pre registered car which has a registration number already.
You need to insure it on the reg now MOT it, advise DVLA of the modifications and probably be required to get an engineers report

quote:

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Originally posted by stevegough
Interesting car!

When we kit-car types say "you are legally allowed to drive to a pre-arranged IVA test" we are talking about kit-cars / one - offs that we have built ourselves.

This vehicle, although very definitely a 'one-off' is obviously not a kit car, but a vehicle that has been converted from a standard model - that is one that is already covered under 'type approval' which Jaguar sorted many moons ago. The only reason to have to do a full IVA on it would be if you have altered the chassis from the original.
Reiterating what Snuggs has asked - why does it need an IVA test?

I think you may need a VIC check (same as you do with imported and Cat C / D write offs) to register it - however - to further fuel the debate - as you have cut the roof off, and the car's chassis is a monocoque - maybe you have altered the chassis........ (or was it built as a convertible originally?)......

On another point, as the insurance groups now go from 1 to 50, I think you will find it is a group 36 (ish) and not a 20.

Good luck!

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When my car was being SVAd someone rang the test station and asked if the car could be driven on trade plates, I can't remember the reason but I'm sure they said it was illegal. As for the car having a registration number because it has a vin number ALL production cars come off the assembly line with a vin number but not a reg number

What ever you end up doing, if you go for an IVA, CARRY ALL your Paperwork with you, including your driving licence insurance etc etc etc.
If you get stopped, it will be easier to explain to the police. They are far more likely to believe you if you can back up your story with the paperwork.
Especially any appointment or letters from VOSA etc.

Its easier to explain a kit car with no number plates and an IVA. But a std car, even though its been modified is a Lot harder to convince them it hasnt got a registration.
They will stick the VIN number into their computer, and out will pop the old reg, as you can bet the DVLA wil not have changed any records!

My Nephew is a policeman, and he tells me that the stories he geta are often very far fetched. Most are outright lies. So they will be pushed to believe an explanation that is a bit unusual.
Having all the paperwork will show that you are not trying to hide anything.

Also remember..... getting it wrong, they will sieze the vehicle. This will cost you the tow away fees, the storage fees on a daily basis, and till having to sort out the paperwork to get the vehicle back.

Sorting out the paperwork on something like your vehicle, could take days or weeks. Then you car could get crushed as you run out of time before their time limit is up.

Maybe you need it IVA'd etc, and you cant do that as they have it impounded. ie chicken and egg job.

Make sure you get this right.

Last resort, trailer it to the IVA.

Morning all,



More info about 'why' at the bottom of this page:

http://www.speedview.co/about

(short version - pubs and eBay app on smartphone is to blame)


Structurally it looks like "the roof has been chopped off" but in reality there isn't a lot left of the 'middle bit' that's original:

Double-thickness gearbox tunnel and inner chassis rails. (600x600x3 mm dropping to 300x250x4 mm section there!)
3 additional cross members on the bottom of the tunnel to turn it into more of a box (one at the start/A-pillar position; one in the middle, and one at the other end on the crossbeam under the rear seats) in addition to the two from the factory (gearbox and prop centre bearing) Can see the scale of the tunnel well in this shot:



150x150x5mm sills tied into the rear chassis legs (themselves over-plated and plugged w/4mm plate), a strengthened rear seat crossbeam (more sections removed and re-fabbed in 4 mm plate), and the front chassis legs/bulkhead (you guessed it, big chunks removed and re-fabbed in 4 mm plate.

A and C pillars are tied in with 3 mm plate on the insides; windscreen frame is a mixture of 30x30x3 mm box and 3 mm plate, with some delicate little gussets in our favourite 3 mm plate (hide behind the door mirrors with the doors shut) 2 mm centre span deflection with no glass and a British Standard bloke hanging off it, 1 mm if you try the same at a corner, so we should be good for the inevitable hanging off the screen frame to get out the car without killing the glass. B-pillars are the factory outers (they're actually a pretty serious pair of pressings, 4 mm total in high strength steel), with the inside halves made in 6 mm plate for the lower half with the belt hole in, and 3 mm plate for the upper half.

Or in photos, the grey bits look like they were fabricated in a shipyard...



In terms of structure I guess its a Discovery 3 sized chassis with a monocoque shell as a template. Heavy as all heck (+ somewhere between 200 and 250 kg in steel) but its cheap and the car isn't a flyweight kit car anyway. Net (having lost a lot in roof, glass, soundproofing, electric motors/adjustments etc) I doubt it'll be 150kg, and you don't really notice two passengers in the original anyway. Time will tell though!



Why an IVA? The monocoque has been modified (it doesn't matter how trivial the mods are by the way - anything structural invalidates the original type approval) so it loses type approval.

If you make a notifiable change (eg, change of bodystyle), DVLA will now ado the following when you notify them:

http://www.cosic.org.uk/MarkoStuff/xj8/XJ_DVLA/

Supposedly that car doesn't exist any more. but if you hit up R32 FND Jaguar in here:

https://www.taxdisc.direct.gov.uk/EvlPortalApp/app/home/intro

It says that it isn't due for SORN until 01/12/2012 - suggesting that it has two identities: New unregistered vehicle SABTVRO397B223240 and used/SORNED vehicle R32 FND?

If you haven't made any notifiable changes, you're supposed to voluntarily de-register the vehicle, request a new VIN, take a BIVA test, and re-register. They're going to begin enforcing this with the MOT test checkboxes for 'modified monocoque' but they're already starting to give anything roof-chopped/pickup-converted etc a tug after seeing them at shows.



Poking about, it looks like the IVA is the same waiver as the MOT:

http://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/1994/22/schedule/2

quote:

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22(1)A vehicle is an exempt vehicle when it is being used solely for the purpose of—
(a)submitting it (by previous arrangement for a specified time on a specified date) for a compulsory test [F45, a vehicle identity check][F46, a vehicle weight test or a reduced pollution test], or

(b)bringing it away from [F47any such test][F48or check].

[F49(1A)A vehicle is an exempt vehicle when it is being used solely for the purpose of—

(a)taking it (by previous arrangement for a specified time on a specified date) for a relevant re-examination, or

(b)bringing it away from such a re-examination.]

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quote:

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(4)In this paragraph “compulsory test” means, as respects England and Wales and Scotland—

(a)in the case of a vehicle for which by virtue of section 66(3) of the M10Road Traffic Act 1988 a vehicle licence cannot be granted unless certain requirements are satisfied, an examination such as is specified in sub-paragraph (5), and

(b)otherwise, an examination under section 45 of the M11Road Traffic Act 1988 with a view to obtaining a test certificate without which a vehicle licence cannot be granted for the vehicle.

(5)The examinations referred to in sub-paragraph (4)(a) are—

[F59(a)an examination under regulations under section 49(1)(b) or (c) of the M12Road Traffic Act 1988 (examination as to compliance with construction and use or safety requirements)]

(b)an examination for the purposes of sections 54 to 58 of that Act (examination as to a F60. . . vehicle’s compliance with type approval requirements), [F61and]

F62(c). . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .

(d)an examination under regulations under section 61(2)(a) of that Act (examinations in connection with alterations to . . . vehicles subject to type approval requirements).

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Cheers for that.

IVA is definitely the way to go but as others have said you should only need to be insured and attending a pre-booked test to be legal.

Also as said, carry every bit of documentation that you have.

Good luck with the IVA

Must be quiet at Dyfed Powys Police HQ at 10:30 pm on a Sunday...


"In the not too distant future I shall be driving a vehicle from
Milford Haven to VOSA's inspection facility in Cardiff... [bit about IVA test] ...The
vehicle WILL be insured, but WILL NOT be registered, taxed, or
MOTed. It will not show any registration plates or trade plates."


"Sure - just let us know the date."


(dropped them an email earlier this afternoon)


Rural Wales is awesome sometimes

IVA is unquestionably the best approach to go yet as others have said you may as well just need to be safeguarded and going to a provoked test to be lawful.

quote:

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"Sure - just let us know the date."

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Trade plates if you are entitled to use them bring the vehicle under the insurane cover company of the
motortrader who own the trade plates.
There are however restrictions on the use of trade plates you cannot just borrow them from the local garage, basically they are to allow employees to move unregistered or untaxed vehicles, the only exceptions are for demonstration purposes and recovery vehicles.

quote:

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Originally posted by caroline89
IVA is unquestionably the best approach to go yet as others have said you may as well just need to be safeguarded and going to a provoked test to be lawful.

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Still not bloody finished either. :-o

(topic reply notification)



I hate interiors...

If you hate them dont have one :-)