Immobilisers
theduck - 6/1/13 at 06:11 PM
So I have been studying the IVA manual as I have decided to change course and finish my car to an IVA standard and put it on the road. One thing I am
missing is suitable Anti theft, so intended to fit a key operated ignition to replace my push button system and an immobiliser. Question is can I use
the cheap eBay specials or do I have to use a thatcham approved one?
renetom - 6/1/13 at 06:25 PM
Hi
we have an ign switch , push button start & immobiliser.
You only need 2 , a key is 1 & immobiliser 2.
we used a toad one , its great.
Job done
Good luck
René
wilkingj - 6/1/13 at 06:28 PM
1. You can put what you want on your car. As long as it covers the IVA aspect.
2. If you put a thatcham one on. You will need the VSIB (installers) certificate signed by an authorised installer.
Usually they dont like you to fit them, as they have their devious ways of wiring them in and hiding them up.
I was lucky that my local VSIB installer company raced an MK Indy. They told me what to do and what not to do.
They then inspected it after I had got it on the road, and signed off the certificate for a tenner (7 years ago).
You WONT get any insurace discounts UNLESS you have a genuine signed and stamped VSIB certificate.
The certificate is only of any use for the insurance co. However, its no good complaining that the Insurace Co wont give you a full payout if you say
you have a thatcham device fitted and its NOT got its accompanying certificate / been correctly installed.
We all know how pedantic the insurace companies can be.
So my advice is to do it right, and right first time, even if it costs you an extra £100 or so.
Whats a £100 in a £8k+ build?? It will cost you a LOT MORE then £100 in the event of a claim and the Insurance Co getting grumpy about it not meeting
the specs etc.
Dont spoil the ship for a Ha'peth of Tar
theduck - 6/1/13 at 06:31 PM
It's a sub 2k build, so every penny counts ;-)
Also manual now says it doesn't need an installers certificate.
fregis - 6/1/13 at 07:04 PM
What kind of engine do you use? Some of the newer version of the same engine ecu has immobilaizer, probably enough to find a newer ECU with wiring
harness, immobilaizer, key and install
[Edited on 6/1/13 by fregis]
theduck - 6/1/13 at 07:06 PM
Running a pinto.
sdh2903 - 6/1/13 at 07:12 PM
I used a toad sterling transponder immobiliser off ebay, bit more than the touch ones but I don't like them, same as this:
Toad Sterling Excel Thatcham Cat 2 Immobiliser Warranty 
I had the certificate in my receipts folder but it wasn't filled in as I fitted it myself, IVA man never even bothered looking at the cert he
just asked me to demonstrate it working.
rdodger - 6/1/13 at 08:17 PM
If you use the immobiliser from the donor car. MX5 in my case. How do you demonstrate it? The transponder is in the key so it automatically un arms/
arms.
theduck - 6/1/13 at 08:25 PM
Thanks all. I think I will pay the bit extra and get a thatcham one.
Slimy38 - 6/1/13 at 08:53 PM
quote:
Originally posted by rdodger
If you use the immobiliser from the donor car. MX5 in my case. How do you demonstrate it? The transponder is in the key so it automatically un arms/
arms.
A cheap copied key (IE without transponder) would operate the lock but the car shouldn't start. If it's anything like my tintop it turns
over but doesn't fire up.
Alternatively perhaps a statement from Mazda based on the VIN to say what it came with as standard? And then evidence to say you reused the
loom/ECU?
wilkingj, how much insurance discount did you get from a Thatcham immobiliser? When I last looked into getting one fitted to an old car it would cost
£300 and give me a £10 discount on an annual premium. 30 years to get my money back didn't seem cost effective.
Personally I'll be fitting an immobiliser to meet IVA requirements, but not including it for insurance quotes. Unless the saving is considerable,
in which case I'll do the full install thing. Or if the MX5 donor I find has one as factory fit then I'll leave it there.
rdodger - 6/1/13 at 09:02 PM
Good point!
My understanding is that you need a key and 1 other method. Mechanical or electronic?
So a steering lock could be the other?
Slimy38 - 6/1/13 at 09:06 PM
quote:
Originally posted by rdodger
Good point!
My understanding is that you need a key and 1 other method. Mechanical or electronic?
So a steering lock could be the other?
A quick search on here brought this up;
quote:
from manual
section 13A
"Method of Inspection
Check, in addition to the normal “ignition” switch, that the vehicle is permanently fitted with an anti-theft device or an electronic immobiliser that
can be activated to prevent the vehicle being driven or moved under its own power.
A mechanical anti-theft device could be a steering lock or transmission lock. "
Here's the original discussion for info;
IVA Mechanical anti-theft
[Edited on 6/1/13 by Slimy38]
theduck - 6/1/13 at 09:17 PM
Yes key and steering lock is suitable. Unjust font have either at the moment so key and immobiliser is the solution.
theduck - 16/1/13 at 10:42 PM
quote:
Originally posted by sdh2903
I used a toad sterling transponder immobiliser off ebay, bit more than the touch ones but I don't like them, same as this:
Toad Sterling Excel Thatcham Cat 2 Immobiliser Warranty
I had the certificate in my receipts folder but it wasn't filled in as I fitted it myself, IVA man never even bothered looking at the cert he
just asked me to demonstrate it working.
Thank you for the recommendation, just picked up one for £42 
loggyboy - 16/1/13 at 11:35 PM
quote:
Originally posted by wilkingj
2. If you put a thatcham one on. You will need the VSIB (installers) certificate signed by an authorised installer.
Usually they dont like you to fit them, as they have their devious ways of wiring them in and hiding them up.
That requirement was removed from 2009, the imobiliser just needs to function as one should.
If an alarm is fitted it does need to have documentation, but a VSIB one is no longer accepted as suitable.
Rogthebandit - 28/1/13 at 12:17 AM
Hi
I was thinking about this the other day also as im trying to get all my electrics finished. I have the sierra key and steering lock but i am also
using the bike engine chipped key as the imobiliser. I have bypassed the other functions of the bike ignition, its now a slot for the key chip. Do ya
recon this will be ok for the iva or do i need to get another imobiliser?
Cheers
rog
Jimfin - 28/1/13 at 09:01 AM
Rog,
Why make life more difficult - the Sierra key for the ignition and steering lock are all you need for the IVA.
Keep it simple for the test and if you want to play about with the immobiliser later - feel free.
loggyboy - 28/1/13 at 09:48 AM
Indeed, as above, dont over complicate it! Do the bare minimum, its less to go wrong! If you want one for safety/securities sake, the fit one after.
Rogthebandit - 28/1/13 at 11:16 PM
Cheers for that feedback chaps, for some reason i had it in my head that i needed some sort of electronic immobiliser! I will simplify it now and just
secure the bike ign under the dash for now.
On a different note without starting a new thread, i have fitted a few savage switches on the dash (horn, fog and handbrake light). All 3 illuminate
when in operation but do these need to have back lights when the side lights are switched on?
BangedupTiger - 29/1/13 at 12:27 AM
Ive got a manual immobiliser, its a hidden toggle switch that cuts the ignition. I also have a spline door lock fitted into the tunnel, that locks
the car in reverse.
My car was sva'd 10 years ago so things may have changed.
BangedupTiger - 29/1/13 at 12:28 AM
quote:
Originally posted by Rogthebandit
On a different note without starting a new thread, i have fitted a few savage switches on the dash (horn, fog and handbrake light). All 3 illuminate
when in operation but do these need to have back lights when the side lights are switched on?
no indication need for sidelights, only main beam IIRC
Slimy38 - 29/1/13 at 06:16 AM
quote:
Originally posted by BangedupTiger
Ive got a manual immobiliser, its a hidden toggle switch that cuts the ignition. I also have a spline door lock fitted into the tunnel, that locks
the car in reverse.
My car was sva'd 10 years ago so things may have changed.
I seem to remember reading something about it not being good enough to just have a 'hidden' switch. The door lock sounds effective though.
loggyboy - 29/1/13 at 10:04 AM
quote:
Originally posted by Slimy38
quote:
Originally posted by BangedupTiger
Ive got a manual immobiliser, its a hidden toggle switch that cuts the ignition. I also have a spline door lock fitted into the tunnel, that locks
the car in reverse.
My car was sva'd 10 years ago so things may have changed.
I seem to remember reading something about it not being good enough to just have a 'hidden' switch. The door lock sounds effective though.
Things have definately changed since SVA, expecially for imobilisation requirements.