I have a vindicator sprint rolling chassis and have purchased a st170 duratec engine and box.
I am wondering what gearbox to use, I have been told a mk 3 mx5 box will bolt straight on? If this is the case does anyone know what flywheel, clutch
prop shaft I would need to bot up to a Sierra diff?
Also would a Mazda rx8 gearbox bolt straight on or would I need an adaptor plate ? Also what clutch flywheel prop etc would I need ?
I have been looking on various forums but cannot find any definitive answers, I have been advised to join this forum as it give the best advice
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posted on 7/1/16 at 11:10 PM
An ST170 engine isn't really a Duratec
Its actually a tweaked Zetec-E and a duratec badge stuck on it (ford like rebranding things to make them confusing)
In fact none of the Mk1 focus's (98-05) ever had an actual duratec engine.
So you'll want a ford type 9 or an MT75 box with a 4cly bellhousing - the one used in sierra's and granada's
The same ones used on cars with x-flow, CVH, pinto and DOHC engines.
Have a search on here there are loads of old threads on fitting these engines, including the various possible combinations of gearbox, starter,
flywheel and clutch that work together.
Also loads of old threads on the various ways folk have dealt with the VVT on these en
Or you can do the rx8 gearbox thing with an adaptor plate, long thread on turbosport on this fitment.
---------------------------------------------------------------
1968 Ford Anglia 105e, 1.7 Zetec SE, Mk2 Escort Workd Cup front end, 5 link rear
Build Blog - http://Anglia1968.weebly.com
ST170 Clutch has fewer, coarser splines than the input shaft of an MT75.
You can however use the clutch from a standard 2.0 Sierra / Granada and the ST170 Dual Mass flywheel and pressure plate.
You will need the usual MT75 clutch release bearing CT133 or similar and unfortunately - you still need the spacer that either Westfield sell or you
make yourself to bring the clutch arm actuation into a useful range.
With the above assembly I found that a 15mm spacer was slightly better than the 19mm spacer that westfield supply
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posted on 8/1/16 at 08:54 AM
^^^ of course that assumes you want to keep the dual mass flywheel
and while the MT75 box is a bit stronger as standard, its also a bit bulky in places (so you'll need to make sure there is room for one in your
tunnel) and their are fewer options for upgraded gear sets than there are for a type 9 if you feel like splashing out on them later...
What you want is an SPC helical cut close ratio box which is based on the type 9 and will bolt strait on using the standard Ford 4 cylinder
bellhousing (preferably alloy)..
I have just finished putting in a ST170 lump with an Rx8 5 speed box (Much cheaper than 6) , using an adapter plate. I used a Pinto flywheel and
clutch but 1.8/2.0 zetec flywheel and clutch will work.
Also I had a custom made prop shaft with rx8 front end with sierra back. the reason being the ford splines fit but there is a big gap between the seal
and the input. some people use a bigger seal but I have heard reports that these just fall out.
Im running mine on bike carbs with Nodiz Pro Ignition with VVT controller
I have just finished putting in a ST170 lump with an Rx8 5 speed box (Much cheaper than 6) , using an adapter plate. I used a Pinto flywheel and
clutch but 1.8/2.0 zetec flywheel and clutch will work.
I can put some photos up If you want
yeah i would love to see some pictures dude, especially of the stater motor as it would appear i am going to need to cut out some of the alloy to
accomodate the starter, also the slave cylinder as im not sure whether i need to adjust the fitting.
I have just picked up a 6 sped RX8 box and propshaft today, as i have the full wiring loom i am going to run the ST170 injection and ECU which i will
get remapped eventually.
i have located a 1.8 and 2.0 zetec flywhel as it has the pick up for the sensor on them, i want to put a strong clutch in but am unsure as to what one
to use?
the shaft will be in the pinion bearing approximately 10mm with a 10mm adaptor plate, will this be enough or will i need to modify it ?
Ye when I can sus out how to I will upload some photos's,
the clutch slave cyclinder is the standard rx8 on a bracket to move it forward by 10mm to make up the 10mm adapter plate it came with the kit. I
should have uses a zetec flywheel as Im having to use a trigger wheel as the pinto flywheel has no sensor slots/mark.
Ye I had to cut away a few fins on the side of the sump to get the starter to fit, just attacked it with a grinder with some decent sanding pads.
the adapter kit I got came with a sleeve and extended to fit to the shaft, but I didn't use it as it it was too long, mine fit ok without it.
would the standard 2.0 zetec clutch be ok? not as much weight as a focus
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posted on 12/1/16 at 09:26 AM
I believe the 1.8 zetec flywheel is significantly lighter than the 2.0 one
I would think that the zetec clutches would be fine, just make sure you get a good quality one.
(worst thing I ever did to my 1.8 tin-top was fit a cheap valeo clutch, it slipped every time I pulled away a bit quick and smelt horrible too)
Also if you think you need a different clutch then some folk use the 2.0 pinto clutch (I believe this requires the zetec flywheel to be drilled to
suit) its 215mm and easily up to the job, just get a good quality OE spec one. (OE spec LUK ones get a good name)
I have just picked up a 6 sped RX8 box and propshaft today, as i have the full wiring loom i am going to run the ST170 injection and ECU which i will
get remapped eventually.
Will that work using the original ECU? I been looking to do the same myself but was under the impression that it was a pain in the ass to get running
due to all the extra sensors on the car that the ecu needs to run correctly!
My st170 install was as follows... 1.8 zetec flywheel, mk1 1.6 Mondeo plate and cover, Capri ct133 release bearing, sierra dohc lrr707 starter and a
bog standard type 9 gearbox. All bolts together with no fuss.
I have just picked up a 6 sped RX8 box and propshaft today, as i have the full wiring loom i am going to run the ST170 injection and ECU which i will
get remapped eventually.
Will that work using the original ECU? I been looking to do the same myself but was under the impression that it was a pain in the ass to get running
due to all the extra sensors on the car that the ecu needs to run correctly!
I'm sure the wasa will be along soon but in the meantime have a look at this...
I have just picked up a 6 sped RX8 box and propshaft today, as i have the full wiring loom i am going to run the ST170 injection and ECU which i will
get remapped eventually.
Will that work using the original ECU? I been looking to do the same myself but was under the impression that it was a pain in the ass to get running
due to all the extra sensors on the car that the ecu needs to run correctly!
I'm sure the wasa will be along soon but in the meantime have a look at this...
[Edited on 12/1/16 by coozer]
Yeah have been reading up about it, wasa has done an amazing job! not sure I have the patients to do it mind.
What kit would people recommend without using the ECU? burton do a weber setup with loom but its around £900 plus you need a second system to run the
VVT at around £200+
quote:Originally posted by coozer
I used an Omex 600 with bike throttle bodies. Used one of the shift light outputs to simply switch the vvt via a relay.
Omex 600 you can also use the ALT function to turn the VCT off/on/off and also limit it's use under light load to help economy(say under 25%
load). Jenko on here did this with a Puma 1.7 very successfully and the ST170 VCT works in the same way IIRC. Worth looking at Jenko's blog to
see the dyno graphs with the different VCT settings, this illustrates perfectly how the VCT works and when it is required to kink in/out.
---------------------------------------------------------------
1968 Ford Anglia 105e, 1.7 Zetec SE, Mk2 Escort Workd Cup front end, 5 link rear
Build Blog - http://Anglia1968.weebly.com
The ST170 is not an on/off system. It is a fully variable closed loop angle controlled system. Just switching the solenoid on and off will not give
the correct cam angle. The cam runs at about 32 Degrees from its retarded position for best power. if you just switch it on, it goes from 85deg btdc
to 145deg btdc.
Locking the cam at the peak power point works fine and is very drivable. But if the VCt is mapped and full used you gain low end torque. It all
depends on what you want out of the engine.
quote:Originally posted by Rob Allison
The ST170 is not an on/off system. It is a fully variable closed loop angle controlled system. Just switching the solenoid on and off will not give
the correct cam angle. The cam runs at about 32 Degrees from its retarded position for best power. if you just switch it on, it goes from 85deg btdc
to 145deg btdc.
Locking the cam at the peak power point works fine and is very drivable. But if the VCt is mapped and full used you gain low end torque. It all
depends on what you want out of the engine.
Good info, I thought the VCT in the St170 was the same as the Puma 1.7 system i.e. it is fully mapped/variable in the OEM ecu but basically this
rounds of the edges of the central "on" area. However, based on the work jenko did (Northampton motorsport tuners) with the puma system
this can be very effectively used as an on/off/on system with an off under a certain load setting to give a bit of extra economy. Picking the cross
over points is the key and is fairly easy to spot based on his graphs. Off setting is good for low rev and also high revs, on setting is good for mid
range, this maybe where people go wrong i.e. not turning it off at high revs and so loose a lot of top end, agreed it is not s VTEC just off/on
system.
---------------------------------------------------------------
1968 Ford Anglia 105e, 1.7 Zetec SE, Mk2 Escort Workd Cup front end, 5 link rear
Build Blog - http://Anglia1968.weebly.com
Will that work using the original ECU? I been looking to do the same myself but was under the impression that it was a pain in the ass to get running
due to all the extra sensors on the car that the ecu needs to run correctly!
I'm sure the wasa will be along soon but in the meantime have a look at this...
[Edited on 12/1/16 by coozer]
Does anyone have an ecu wiring diagram of what is used and not used on the standard ecu please?
Also is there an alternative for the standard air intake to use as there is no room and i am struggling to find the cheapest way to get the car set up
and running.
i want to tweak and tune later but right now i am on a tight budget
any assistance with options for carbs / ecu / manifolds / air intake will be truly appreciated
