Does your phone not show the time of all incoming and out going calls??
They can be buggers though, I got stopped for "appearing to conceal items in my lap on sight of a police car", I should have said what i was really doing, scratching my nuts!!
yeh had my appeal against conviction yesterday for using a mobile phone whilst driving. if you remember i was actually scratching the side of my bloody face! first police officer rattled on for ten minutes in the witness stand that he had clearly seen me from the passengers seat and as a passenger in the car he had a perfect view. after a few minutes of this my barrister pointed out that he was actually the driver of the vehicle what a dick head! then the second driver who stated both in his statement and in the magistrates court he d clearly seen a phone in my hand changed his mind to say he believed it was a phone in my hand! and funny old thing the two magistrates are puppets on a string and the judge running it still believed the bloody coppers! what a complete waste of time. spent 1300 in legal fees pushing a principle!!! hate is a strong word but i feel that way to pretty much all coppers now!!! makes me anoyed with the 1000 pounds in tax i pay every month! i know i ll get some replies to this that all coppers aren t like that! but thats not gonna convince me! what a complete bunch of total bloody t@%$ssers! so top tip don t scratch your face whilst driving!
jesus, talk about incompetant. how can the driver give a 10 minute speech about how he was the passenger, and the barrister point out he was wrong, and still be believed by the judge. f*** sake
isn't there a fairly simple way of determining the phone wasn't in use at the relevant point in time?
quote:
Originally posted by 200mph
isn't there a fairly simple way of determining the phone wasn't in use at the relevant point in time?
And I thought i was hard done by getting done for speeding doing a average of 53 in a 50 over 1/2 mile stretch (timed between 2 point by 2 unmarked cars) at 3am even though it was a 60 limit but i was in a sprinter (so limit is 50 instead despite it being a brand new van with all the safety features yet a old morris minor or something with drum brakes all round is aloud to do 60).£60 and 3 points later and i realise why people have such a hatred for the police, dont want to sound like every other person but why were there 2 unmarked cars hidden at 3am trying to catch speeders (even 3mph over the limit) when surely there are people being murdered,mugged, raped,attacked,burgled etc etc and yet when some thieving scum broke into my shed to steal my bike (turned the light on and moved the bike so there would have been plenty of fingerprints) they just said sorry we dont have anyone available! Rant over! (for now at least)
yeh thats exactely what happened! bloody scum. had my phone records which only show out going calls. the indepth mobile info wasn t applied for intime by the police and at the time they didn t botherbecause it was two coppers words against mine. bloody total scum!!!!! i have no issues with naming and shaming pc harper and pc mason both hampshire constab. and the really worrying thing both fire arms officers so all i can be thankfull is that the idiots didn t think i had a gun in my hand or i d be joing the poor brazilian john charles demenzis! judges and magistrates will always take their word over ours!!!! no matter how much crap they are talking!!!
Can't you appeal?
why couldn't you just show the officers your phone at the time.
Does your phone not show the time of all incoming and out going calls??
They can be buggers though, I got stopped for "appearing to conceal items in my lap on sight of a police car", I should have said what i was
really doing, scratching my nuts!!
You've no chance if theres 2 coppers against you they will lie thru there teeth, Because if they get found out there in big trouble. I've been to court 20 years ago for the theft of a welding rod yes only 1. Got let of with it mind you but the judge was gunning for the copper.
offered to show the coppers my phone they said they could because that would be an illegal search! they then denied that in court! trust me i got a shit hot barrister who tore them to shreds! and the judge still sided with the coppers! this was the appeal already found guilty in the magistrates! my little one had a play police outfit for xmas first job of the day was to get that thing in the bin! all i ll say is if you get stopped think about every word you say because they ll use it against you! don t sign their pocket note book if they ask! request indepth phone records straight away. and from now on my phone is going in the boot of the car when i drive! am actually in the armed forces and when asked if i had anything to say before they gave me the fine i told the judge that this was the first time i was ashamed to be british and i was ashamed to have shed blood for it! probably why the fine went up an extra 100! but think i was entitled to sound of!
If that had happened to me i would certainly get my brief to obtain all the phone records and go all out to discredit the pair of them, as they are
totally out of order and a total disgrace to there profesion.
Mike
was to late to get the records, the phone companies don t keep them long enough! trust me my barrister made them look idiots! but the judge still sided with them! one insisted he was the driver for 5 minutes. i thought we d won then but nope. all i can say is i do believe in karma so just hope something really nasty happens to them in the near future!
I believe you can sue the police officers for perjury under oath.
You could do another appeal higher than the magistry's court.
this one was an appeal to the crown court after conviction in the magistrates court. next place to appeal is to the court of appeal. can t really take a risk appealing further because if i loose it ll be a shed load more cash gone! looking into making a complaint with the ipcc against the coppers involved. if that goes works might see what happens! i do like the idea of some civil action the 50 50 purdon of proof is far more atractive!
All i can say is ALL THE BEST.
Hampsire po is shite.
If i was you though, i would try to sue the police officers and ask compensation from the PD for their incompetence.
Well from personal experience of police lying to bring charges, all I'll say is fit an in car camera like my T-eye recorder otherwise face ending
up in court.
One tip is don't tell them its fitted till they have made their official statement. That way its far worse for them when the truth comes out 
How long ago did the 'alleged' offence happen?
I got stopped at 3am for going through a red light. The lights actually jam on red regularly. I waited 5 mins before proceeding.
The cop car (with one head light out) followed me and stopped me.
I have a T-eye recorder in my car which records forward view/rear view, sound, gps position, speed and any G-forces on 3 axis.
When I was stopped, I informed the copper he was being recorded.
I explained the lights situation and after the usual checks was sent on my way.
I am pretty sure that had I not had the recorder, then I would have been given a fixed penalty and points.
I know that it is no consolation, but the T-eye would have proved your innocence.
Mine was bought after I had an accident in 2005 where someone jumped the lights, but in the county court he lied through his teeth.
Cost me £293 from cpc farnell, but now worth every penny.
Incidently, the next morning the same cop car had it's headlight out. If it had been you or me and you got stopped again, it would have been
points and a fine.
The world isn't just, so it sometimes pays to protect yourself in advance.
The modern police have swung away from upholding common law to enforcing money-making statutes.
Didn't your solicitor make the case that if the copper doesn't know he's driving how the hell can he spot a phone that's 1.5"
by 3" in your hand? How can a judge side with someone that is obviously lacking detail? This should be taken with you if/when you decide to
appeal it again.
I plug my phone into the radio and listen to the music off it.. Can't make a phone call or it'll screech like mad with the feedback...
Probably no defence there either...
i had the services of a poo hot barrister who came from london down to portsmouth he mentioned all of the above. the judge still went with them!!! the first copper was shitting himself on the stand the second copper left the court and one of my witness s could see them kick a bin up the road!!!! its a bloody joke!!! i can t risk appealing it further because after this i haven t even got the train money to get to the high court! i am gonna get the transcripts and take it to the ipcc!!!!! if the first copper had of said i thought i could see a mobile phone in the magistrates court as he did in the crown court appeal i wouldn t of got convicted. if the ipcc uphold that complaint i ll take civil action simple! all i can say is the copper is the same age as me and i sure at somepoint our paths will cross!
oh ps build is on hold now for a bit till the cash flow sorts itself out! shame as could of got a decent zx12r install for the cash i ve used here!
Is a shame really, hopefully they'll get theirs in the end..
Sorry to here of your troubles.
Had a simular experience of our justice system many years back.
Just gave up in the end.
You could always become a MP. Then claim back all your costs on expenses.
Better still put a bill in for a ZX12R engine as a decorative piece of furnature.
.
My missus was done for whatever the "handheld device" offence is last year. The coppers asked her for her mobile number and then rang it
from theirs to verify the number. They then asked for the network so that they could get the call records if she decided to appeal. This sounds much
more like the "correct procedure" than you have experienced.
One of the issues with the English legal system is Magistrates Courts. I have been 3 times with work and it is apparent that they just nod in
agreement with everyone as though they understand what is being said and then just make a random decision. Of course, if the police are involved then
the Magistrates, being Joe Public, don't want to make an enemy of them.
In hindsight, choosing to fight it at Magistrates was always going to be an uphill struggle and, although it is absolutely no use now, perhaps you
should have let the Magistrates run its course and then taken it higher and thrown the money at it then. At least "proper" judges don't
seem to mind upsetting the plod.
If you can take it to the IPCC then do it!
didn t happen totally like that richard, was heard in the magistrates by a district judge not a magistrate who still went with the coppers so i appealled that to the crown court and that still came back as a guilty dude! the first district judge was a total and utter cock!!!!! i had to have the trial delayed because i m in the armed forces and was in afghanistan between january and april. his first comments were thank you for finally joining us so we can start this much delayed trial! what a complete cock a total utter complete cock!!!! yeh i was of having a lovely holiday at the time!!! any coppers on here fancy adding their side?!
hi i had an instant not exactly like yours but i got caught doing donuts in a car park by cctv (i didint notice)left the car park went back later(STUPID IDEA) and instantly was surronded by local plod they issued me with the warning that if i do it again then my car would be crushed while trying to get off with this they did a check on me and the car and apparently there was a warrent for my arrest and the car wasent on the insurance computer itryed to get my policy from home but they werent having none of itthe tryd componding my car by which time my misses had turned up with my polisy the car woudint fit the low loader so they coudint take it but i still had to pay 150 pounds to get my car back even though i had produced my policy and to ad salt to the wound i was arresten and jailed for 8 hours for a warrent that wassint even for me some bugger in dunnoon got a traffic fine with the same name as me and the prosacator got my info from dvla ive now contacted the dunoon prosacator office and tryed to get the 200pounds fine that i had to pay to the police to get out of jail but they keep saying we have got the paper work and are lookin into it now 2 months later the prosicator dealing with it it on long term sick INJUSTICE OR WHAT, cant afford a solisiter SO THE HAVE ME BY THE BALLS
Legal aid?
If the guy dealing with it is on long term sick someone else should be dealing with it
quote:
Originally posted by mad_dogpompey
...........any coppers on here fancy adding their side?!
I realise I am stepping into the bear pit here, but, it is sad that no one has yet come on to say 'all police are not like that' - and, of
course, they aren't.
There is a huge difference between telling a lie (as you say the police are) and having difficulty remembering this incident from the hundreds of
other ones these police may have dealt with before and since. This incident is obviously very personal to you and the minutae of it etched in your
memory - this will not be the case for the police and the courts give an allowance for this.
I do not believe they would get any personal gain from prosecuting you so we have to imagine that they (possibly erroneously) think themselves in the
right as much as you think they are in the wrong.
Without the phone record evidence you never had a chance, and, to be honest, I think you were pretty badly served by the barrister for not postponing
it - I'd be angry at him for going ahead without the one piece of evidence that would got you off.
It can be very hard to remember in court. As a firefighter I was once in court as a prosecution witness against an arsonist and I got the floor number
of the flat wrong. The defense was all over me for this and tried to get my evidence thrown out as the senior firefighter - it was an irrelevant
mistake but the defense were all for getting their man off on a technicality. It is probably a reaction to this type of behavior by the defense that
worked against you in court.
I hope you work it out. I also hope you can get what the Americans call closure. We all get the short end of the stick sometimes. I got done by a
parking ticket and towing scam whilst legally parked - I was furious but realised I was on an automatic looser by persuing it, so, I swallowed my bile
and paid up - still wrankles now.....
You have my sympathies but don't loose all respect for the police over this.
As Fozzie said. Is it fair to say that you're from Portsmouth with a name of Pompey? And if you're in the forces (as I was for 7 years) is
it fair to say you're in the Navy? That being the case and as you've collectively called me a tosser without knowing me is it fair that I
say all Navy staff or people from Portsmouth are complete tossers too?
I do understand your frustrations but please don't tar us all because of the actions of a few and your 'perceived' views on them.
Oh and no, I don't wish to comment on another persons actions in another part of the country that I've never met nor am very unlikely to
meet.
Oldtimer, I think there have been a few threads over the years, about the police..and more often than not they also get blamed for the
'soft' sentences meted out by the magistrates/judges (which as we know are nothing to do with the police), but,every time people do say
'Not all police are like that'.....(and I must say myself that there are some damn good police/police forces in this country).... it usually
falls on deaf ears or starts another debate.....as it is often the last thing the OP wants to hear. 
The OP in this case, said in an earlier post that he threw away his kiddies toy police uniform, which is sad, as, if we heard about a rogue service
man/woman, who maybe did/did not play by the rules, would it be reasonable to get our kids play toys pertaining to the armed forces and throw them
away.....?
Without any of us having been there, it is unfair to ask anyone to comment on the right or wrongs....
Fozzie
mmm well guys i ll change what i said because i admit i said it slightly wrong 'in my experience all police officers are useless lying
gits!'. and yeh maybe if in the future if i report something of mine being stolen and don t get given a crime reference number and told to go to
my insurance company because they can do more for me! and if the next time i get mugged and get a bit of a kicking if the police officers actually
make some effort to catch the twats instead of saying they ve checked the cctv when they haven t. and if i get puller over without having some stupid
copper fitting me up then maybe i ll start to consider that not all coppers are the same.
And as for them screwing up when giving evidence he read his statement before giving evidence! and even had his pocket note book and statement to
refer to whilst giving evidence! and yeh he still insisted he was the passenger! they may deal with hundreads of issues but they record them all in
their notebooks!!! so thats no defence for the idiot! oh and i m in the raf couldn t join the navy can t swim! ha ha
Ex RAF armourer myself. A I'm an armourer, B I'm an armourer etc.etc 2 years or so up Lossie and some more at Leuchars.
I've given tickets out for mobile phone use in the past yes, but I'll only give them if I'm 100% certain and I'll usually get them
to admit it whilst under caution. I'm also not on any kind of quota for them, I do them because I feel them necessry. I do use my discretion too
if I think it's right. In fact I let a lad off earlier last week who faced a ban but was a working electrician in a works van and I understand
it's difficult sometimes in that game but it's still no excuse. So I am nice really
I have some sympathy for the OP...maybe you can send the Officers concerned to site at the end of the main road near me and watch all the truckers turning right through the lights into a narrow road with their phones clamped to their ears....
any coppers on here fancy adding their side?!
Yeah, thanks for the offer. Go suck some more lemons. I've never met you before, know your name or anything else about you but i think
you're scum too. Here's looking forward to never meeting you.
[Edited on 16/8/09 by scoop]
bla bla bla scoop !
Scoop i think (and I hope others do) that is out of order.
edited to clarify,
"Yeah, thanks for the offer. Go suck some more lemons. I've never met you before, know your name or anything else about you but i think
you're scum too. Here's looking forward to never meeting you. "
I wrote what i did originally last night when very tired and a little bit worn out after a long hectic stressful day. Reading the above that you
posted - it didn't seem to fit with the ethos of the site where we try and be nice to each other & I thought it was directed at the bloke who
is a police man. It doesn't seem fair to call someone you've never met scum, when he's been polite, honest, open and reasonable.
If I've got it wrong i apologise.
[Edited on 17/8/09 by MikeR]
shame i didn t get you at the road side then mr grunmpy! i wouldn t of needed any discretion as my phone was of! think i should say sorry the branding of all police officers as scum was probably a little ott. but i am more than right for being pissed of with this! as a tax payer i pay for a service which has been a total joke! and yeh i am bitter! wasting my money trying to defend on the basic principle i d done nothing wrong! think if the situation was reversed you d be as anoyed as me scoop! as were in a similar boat this effects my employment! and amrourer hey mr grumpy? i m airframes but not sure how long i m gonna stick it out fed up of spending my life in afghanistan.
When reading this thread please don't forget that I am SCOOTZ not 'Scoop'!
Would hate to be mistakenly associated with the type of bile he wrote in his earlier post!
quote:
Originally posted by MikeR
Scoop i think (and I hope others do) that is out of order.
[Edited on 17/8/09 by MikeR]
With regard to the post by Scoop, I have had a few u2u's of concern of which I would like to clarify here.
The OP had requested that he would like to hear from 'coppers on here, to fancy giving their side'.
Scoop took up his invitation....he is indeed a policeman too....
Like many police personnel on this site, and not one coming from Portsmouth Police, there had been a lot of restraint shown given that the OP had
insulted and called the entire UK Police Force 'to%%ers, scum, liars' and such......
Fozzie
That's a fair point Fozzie.
I read about half of this post when it started, and the other half just now.
I have a few police in my family, as some on here know because I've posted supporting them, but I also have seen "the other side" (not
of the law, of their impossibly unprofessional behaviour and decorum.
Mind you, Scoop's (Not Scootz!) post went a long way to convince me that they're not all ignorant bafoons...
Edited to add - Sorry Mr G...
[Edited on 20/8/09 by Steve Hignett]
Indeed Steve
The vast majority of police are NOT ignorant buffoons.
As I have said in a previous post on this thread, without prejudice to the OP, it is impossible for anyone to comment on the said involved police
officers/court case without having been there at the time of the alleged offence, or subsequent court hearings...
Fozzie 
sounds to me like you have been badly done by..................sorry to hear that..
rich(non believer)