Board logo

Getting a current registration to a kit car
the_big_1 - 8/3/21 at 09:10 PM

Hi all,

Reading the DVLA website, the following is quoted.

Get a current registration number

You can register a kit-built car, motorcycle or tricycle with a current registration number if you can prove it’s all made from new parts supplied by the manufacturer.

You can also get a current registration number for a kit-built car, motorbike or tricycle built with one reconditioned part if:

you can show that the part has been reconditioned to an ‘as new’ standard, in line with the manufacturer’s guidelinesthe part is not the chassis, monocoque bodyshell or frame

How do you do this? How do you prove that you have used one part and that it's reconditioned to manufactures guidelines ?

Cheers!

chillis - 8/3/21 at 09:28 PM

You will need receipts for all the new parts which will be pretty much everything, they cannot be reconditioned they must be new. I re-manufactured part can be used and is usually the engine. a pre-1995 engine would enable you to avoid having to meet cat emissions. You will need a receipt for the re-man engine from a recognised engine re-manufacturer. You will need receipts for the kit itself. Basically a receipt is needed for absolutely every last nut and bolt. What kit were you thinking of and is its donor a current or recently out of production model? The biggest challenge is usually finding all the other parts new from the manufacturer.

the_big_1 - 8/3/21 at 09:37 PM

Hi ya,

Not trying to go pre-95 etc, just to use a pre 95 reg?
So for instance I have had the engine reconditioned by me, block has been honed. New cold plugs fitted, crank ground, new shells fitted. New piston rings, all new seals, gaskets. New oil pump etc. New sump, new water rail etc.
Receipts for all parts and pictures.
And it mentions a part, but not what parts? So front hubs have been stripped, shot blasted, new wheel bearings , seals and cover caps. Transmission rebuilt, new bearings, seals, first and third gear changed.
And how do they determine "in line with manufactures guidelines lines" do the DVLA have these guidelines? Or do they just look to see if it looks like you know what your doing lol

the_big_1 - 8/3/21 at 09:40 PM

I am planing to change the engine on my donner vehicle to different engine via log book change. Then use this engine in the kit car. Will use the new engines editions guide. So a pre 95 car, with a 2002 engine and so have the emissions of a 2002 car.

mcerd1 - 9/3/21 at 01:34 AM

the 'parts' the DVLA talking about are the same ones they count for modified vehicles (if you were trying to keep the original reg) as follows:
Suspension (front and back)
Axles (both)
Transmission
Steering assembly
Engine
and they'll want proper receipts for each to prove they are entirely new (not recon or rebuilt using the old castings...)

so basically its not worth it unless your building a caterham or similar where they sell you all new parts anyway...



that gives you 2 sensible options - 'age related' or 'Q' plate:

Q plate is easy obviously and has advantages come MOT time (pre-73 emissions )

Age related should be fairly easy too and could mean no donor engine swaps either:

You can apply for an age-related number if you can prove you’ve used 2 original major parts along with:
a new monocoque/bodyshell/chassis or frame from a specialist kit manufacturer or an altered chassis, monocoque/bodyshell/frame from the original vehicle
https://www.gov.uk/vehicle-registration/kitconverted-vehicles

so you can get an age related plate just using the axles & gearbox and/or steering for most kits - you don't even need to count the engine


quote:
Originally posted by the_big_1
I am planing to change the engine on my donner vehicle to different engine via log book change. Then use this engine in the kit car. Will use the new engines editions guide. So a pre 95 car, with a 2002 engine and so have the emissions of a 2002 car.

why would you do that ? - if you want a new plate won't make any difference...

for the IVA its engine date only - and if you can't prove the date you need to test it at the current standard for new cars.... (this test level should then make it onto your V5 for future MOT's etc....)

also DVLA got wise to this a while back - they will ask for proof that the engine is properly fitted to the donor car (engineers report)


and here's the relevant bit from the MOT manual:

Vehicles fitted with a different engine
If a vehicle first used before 1 September 2002 is fitted with an engine that’s older than the vehicle, you must test it to the standards applicable for the engine. The vehicle presenter must have proof of the age of the engine.

If a vehicle first used on or after 1 September 2002 is fitted with a different engine, you must test it to the emissions standards for the age of the vehicle.

For emission standards on kit cars, read further.

Kit cars
Kit cars and amateur-built vehicles first used on or after 1 August 1998 must have either Single Vehicle Approval (SVA) or Individual Vehicle Approval (IVA).

You must test kit cars or amateur built vehicles to the limits in the vehicle’s registration document (V5c). If the V5c does not show any limits, you must test it to the limits of the engine fitted at the time of the SVA or IVA test.


so putting a 2002 engine in a pre-95 car will give you pre-95 emissions the same as it was... (pre-95 means no CAT required)



[Edited on 9/3/2021 by mcerd1]

the_big_1 - 9/3/21 at 07:26 AM

Hi ya,

I have asked the DVLA for clarification as there website says the part can be reconditioned not new, if it has to be a new part then there website is wrong.

mcerd1 - 9/3/21 at 08:21 AM

quote:
Originally posted by the_big_1
Hi ya,

I have asked the DVLA for clarification as there website says the part can be reconditioned not new, if it has to be a new part then there website is wrong.

One major part is allowed to be reconditioned - all the others must be new to be allowed to call it a new car

(The new websites wording isn't great)

[Edited on 9/3/2021 by mcerd1]

the_big_1 - 9/3/21 at 08:26 AM

Hi,

That's what I have asked them to clarify. It states you only need to use one part off the doner and that the part can be reconditioned.
I have asked them to clarify that's correct and what they require to be a reconditioned part etc

Toys2 - 9/3/21 at 08:41 AM

quote:
Originally posted by the_big_1
Hi,

That's what I have asked them to clarify. It states you only need to use one part off the doner and that the part can be reconditioned.
I have asked them to clarify that's correct and what they require to be a reconditioned part etc


I think that you may be getting mixed up with the different categories



- If you want a brand new 2021 registration, the car must be made up of all new parts, except 1 reconditioned part

- If you want an age related registration, the car must include 2 major parts from the donor + a new chassis, the origin of the other parts is not important (There is no requirement to have the 2 parts reconditioned, only evidence that these came from the donor)

- If you want a Q plate, there are no restrictions on where the parts came from




* "age related" means a number plate of the same year as the donor, but not the actual donor plate number

You can subsequently change the number plate to an older one, ie for a classic replica, as long as it's not a Q plate

Engine date is related to emissions testing, but not the car registration process


[Edited on 9/3/21 by Toys2]

the_big_1 - 9/3/21 at 08:49 AM

Hi ya,

Yeah sorry if I confused it. its an age relegated plate etc.
Looking how to get an age related plate.
So I have a say 1996 car. Fitted a Silver top to it, engine number changed on the log book etc.
Then I fit that engine in to my kit car.
I also use the front up rights and steering rack off the donner.
That should serfise?

Cheers and sorry if I confused it.

mcerd1 - 9/3/21 at 08:51 AM

quote:
Originally posted by the_big_1
Hi,

That's what I have asked them to clarify. It states you only need to use one part off the doner and that the part can be reconditioned.
I have asked them to clarify that's correct and what they require to be a reconditioned part etc


Here's the old wording:. (the rules haven't changed, just the gov.uk site is really crap - not just in this section)

https://web.archive.org/web/20090604200511/http://www.direct.gov.uk/en/Motoring/BuyingAndSellingAVehicle/RegisteringAVehicle/DG_10014246

or this version if you prefer:
https://web.archive.org/web/20050205192141/http://www.dvla.gov.uk/vehicles/regrebil.htm



[Edited on 9/3/2021 by mcerd1]

the_big_1 - 9/3/21 at 09:11 AM

Yeah that's makes it clearer. "If a new monocoque bodyshell or chassis from a specialist kit manufacturer is used (or an altered chassis or bodyshell from an existing vehicle) together with two major components from a donor vehicle, an age related mark will be assigned. The mark will be based on the age of the donor vehicle. An IVA, ESVA, SVA or MSVA test will be required to register the vehicle"
So if I use the engine, front up rights and steering rack should be fine? Obviously the engine number will match the logbook, how do they determine other parts are?

Toys2 - 9/3/21 at 09:20 AM

quote:
Originally posted by the_big_1
Yeah that's makes it clearer. "If a new monocoque bodyshell or chassis from a specialist kit manufacturer is used (or an altered chassis or bodyshell from an existing vehicle) together with two major components from a donor vehicle, an age related mark will be assigned. The mark will be based on the age of the donor vehicle. An IVA, ESVA, SVA or MSVA test will be required to register the vehicle"
So if I use the engine, front up rights and steering rack should be fine? Obviously the engine number will match the logbook, how do they determine other parts are?



I would get clarification on that, the engine will be 1 part, but the Uprights are not a full suspension system and the same may apply to the steering, they may expect the rack and steering column?

Are you using the diff and drive shafts from the donor?

mcerd1 - 9/3/21 at 09:39 AM

quote:
Originally posted by the_big_1
Cheers and sorry if I confused it.

Don't worry about - most folk on here just wouldn't want you to waste time, money and effort - for teh DVLA to turn round and give you a Q plate anyway

quote:
Originally posted by the_big_1
So I have a say 1996 car. Fitted a Silver top to it, engine number changed on the log book etc.
Then I fit that engine in to my kit car.

Are you just looking to swap the engine into the donor for the age related bit or have you got a pre-Aug 95 silvertop for emissions ?


quote:
Originally posted by Toys2
I would get clarification on that, the engine will be 1 part, but the Uprights are not a full suspension system and the same may apply to the steering, they may expect the rack and steering column?
Are you using the diff and drive shafts from the donor?

^^ what he said - while I've never seen any hard rule you do have to use the 'steering system' so rack and column is probably the minimum

also axles only count if you use front and back together (so hubs, driveshafts etc...)

transmission could be an easy one too (I know folk have got away with just a gearbox)

[Edited on 9/3/2021 by mcerd1]

the_big_1 - 9/3/21 at 09:42 AM

Hi ya,

Yeah that's what I want to know, how do you prove a part was fitted to the donner? If I convert a car to rear wheel drive, then later use that diff on a kit car, how do you prove it etc? Photographs would be meaningless?

the_big_1 - 9/3/21 at 09:44 AM

Yeah the same, if I go rear wheel drive on the donner, fit Zetec and type 9. The engine changes on the V5, does the transmission have a number on a V5, can not remember? If not, again, how do you prove the gearbox is out of the donner?

christim - 9/3/21 at 10:40 AM

I'd imagine parts are assumed to be from the donor unless you tell them otherwise. Apart from the Engine, which has a unique number and registered specifically in the V5 for size and emissions purposes (The V5 doesn't have a section for Gearbox number, or Diff number, etc).

the_big_1 - 9/3/21 at 10:43 AM

Hi ya,

That's what I thought. What are regarded as major components from say a sierra.
Transmission Type 9.
Rear diff and drive shafts.
Front uprights
rear hubs

all being used

the_big_1 - 9/3/21 at 10:43 AM

Hi ya,

That's what I thought. What are regarded as major components from say a sierra.
Transmission Type 9.
Rear diff and drive shafts.
Front uprights
rear hubs

all being used

christim - 9/3/21 at 11:19 AM

When I sent off to ask for a chassis number/VIN I advised them I was building a kitcar and they sent back instructions on what's needed etc. I've dug out that letter (God coming up 5 years now!) Hope it helps answer some of your queries:





the_big_1 - 9/3/21 at 11:24 AM

Hi ya,

did that get you a Q plate or age related?

christim - 9/3/21 at 11:31 AM

I'm still building lol....but all parts apart from engine (which is a zetec bought from ebay) and suspension will be from the Donor and I'll be going for an age related plate

the_big_1 - 9/3/21 at 11:36 AM

Be interested if it can be done without the engine.
Do you have to fill out the V627/1 if you don't have a doner car. For example, if you buy each part separate.

christim - 9/3/21 at 11:57 AM

No, if you source each part separately you get a Q...even if all those parts come from various Sierras, or various MX5s, etc.

Parts from donor mean from a single donor with unique chassis number/reg number i.e. you've sttipped from one car and placed on another

(Some inscrupulous(?) people may buy a scrap chassis just to get that chassis number then claim all parts they have came from that. Not sure it's worth all that effort mind)

[Edited on 9/3/21 by christim]