Originally posted by smart51
In all weather conditions? And road conditions? Are you sure? You must be a super hero driver then. Especially if you can cadence brake each wheel individually. If ABS were so poor, I'd be out of a job by now
I know a lot of peeps don't like ABS. but I intend to use the car I build every day rain or shine and you can't trust half the muppits round
here not to do something stupid.
So
Anyone fitted ABS using the sierra system?
TT
correct me if I'm wrong but I thought you couldn't have ABS on a amateur built car, the same with air bags.
I could well be wrong, it won't be the first time
Ray has a sierra abs system in his car, I asked him about it and he says it works ok.
I personally would go for a complete system like the newer bosch and kesley hayes system form the vauxhall vectra (sub 2l) version. The modulator and
ecu are one unit, so less wires are required.
The main fear is going into ice mode when wet, due to the low mass the abs comes to the conclusion you are on ice. It then brakes poorly as a
result.
The vx220 suffers from this due to using the system (from a heavier car) with no software change.
You need a system that detects incorrect speed (eg tyre deflated), ie a fairly modern system.
The vauxhall vectra system is excellent, i have wired one into mine, didn`t require too much effort to fit.
Also look for the bosch version from something sporty like a porsche or mazda rx8. The software is optimised for sportiness.
Darren
[Edited on 9/12/09 by turbodisplay]
I dont understand your agument for wanting ABS...
I can stop my tintop quicker with the ABS fuse removed, than I can with the system working properly.
You just need to be awake enough to detect any slippage and lift off the brakes a bit.
The cost and complexity of ABS on such a lightweight car seem to outweigh the benefits to me.
quote:
Originally posted by tegwin
You just need to be awake enough to detect any slippage and lift off the brakes a bit.
quote:
Originally posted by tegwin
I dont understand your agument for wanting ABS...
I can stop my tintop quicker with the ABS fuse removed, than I can with the system working properly.
You just need to be awake enough to detect any slippage and lift off the brakes a bit.
quote:
Originally posted by smart51
In all weather conditions? And road conditions? Are you sure? You must be a super hero driver then. Especially if you can cadence brake each wheel individually. If ABS were so poor, I'd be out of a job by now
Me also, my astra van abs became so leathal, so a wheel sensor mysteriously disconnected (taking the fuse out resulting in no ebd, with the rears
locking too soon).
My astra doesn`t have abs, and i`m fine with it.
However on the track is is so good, you brake very very late, turn in still on the brakes,the abs keeps control, far better than any driver (each
individual wheel is controlled, rather having to lift off all 4 wheels).
There is also an argument when you are not 100% alert (ie tired) or very wet it is useful.
Darren
Well you live and learn. As predicted I was wrong, maybe I should take it up as a hobby I'd be great at it 
Not according to the manual:
21.
If the vehicle is fitted with an anti-lock braking system, all components must be present, undamaged, secure, connected and operational so that the
system is likely to function as intended. See note 4
22.
If the vehicle is fitted with an anti-lock braking system an operational warning lamp must be fitted to monitor the system, visible from the driving
position, which operates when the anti-lock is energised, and extinguishes at the latest when the vehicle speed reaches 10km/h
Note 4: The vehicle must be driven and the operation (modulation) of the ABS system assessed under braking to indicate satisfactory operation of the
system. NB This check is not necessary if the ABS warning lamp illuminates during a speedometer check indicating that the sensors are detecting
unusual wheel speeds/operation
Darren
[Edited on 9/12/09 by turbodisplay]
quote:
Originally posted by smart51
quote:
Originally posted by tegwin
I dont understand your agument for wanting ABS...
I can stop my tintop quicker with the ABS fuse removed, than I can with the system working properly.
You just need to be awake enough to detect any slippage and lift off the brakes a bit.
In all weather conditions? And road conditions? Are you sure? You must be a super hero driver then. Especially if you can cadence brake each wheel individually. If ABS were so poor, I'd be out of a job by now
29 pulses per rev. I used vectra hubs in mine as I have 4wd, the hubs are quite easy to fit, rather than the sierra requiring a ball joint adapter.
The diagnostics, by using op com (from ebay) tells you wheel speeds, if the stop switch works, fault codes etc.
the speed is output via the red/blue wire to a dash.
It also has a G sensor built in so orientaion is very important.
Split is horizontal so no bias possible (it is done inside the unit anyway).
Darren
Also there are 2 or 3 software revisions, i think the 139xxx revision is the crap one.
My parents vectra has the good (later) revision, i can personally testify to how good it is in the wet!.
Darren
I pulled the fuse on my Rover 45 after having to steer round a car at a junction.. no matter how hard I pressed it just wouldn't stop.
Car now stops better and I feel safer
Possibly due to it being the type that does not sense a wheel speed fault.
That is why it is specified for IVA, due to the danger of the brakes being so poor when a fault occurs.
Darren
i had a subaru impreza type r, which was the 2door homolgation vehicle for rallying, i also had a type ra, again built with rallying in
mind.....neither had abs fitted, yet my jdm wrx did.....
i found without much better, but i like a raw driving experience...
imho alot of people rely too much on modern safety aids and feel indestructable in their cars....but thats just my opinion.
I hate abs. My zetec-s fiesta i had the abs nearly made me crash on a few occasions mainly on ice. I pulled the fuse and it braked so much better. My bmw is the same right pain in the arse.
I also hate ABS. My astra doesnt have ABS and i have only had one scary moment when the wheels locked on a big sheet of ice at a blind junction but
even then i managed to stop the car before i slid into the road.
If however, you have no experience of controling an uncontrolable car, i would say to fit the ABS and also some for of traction control, especially if
you are going to use it everyday.
I have discussed this with a high up tecky guy from Fords, he goes to test Traction controls and ABS systems on the ice lakes in sweden and writes the
anti logs etc, so knows his stuff.
When i mentioned using an ABS system from a donor he started talking about the original mass of the donor and how the abs ecu interprets the signals
from the wheel sensors, the upshot was that unless the abs ecu is programmed for a 7 size and weight car and understands the chassis dynamics or at
least has data to work from, your abs system from the donor will only give marginal performance at best.
Dangerous IMHO.
One of the main reasons I'm building a locost is to have something different to the modern tintop, ie. none of the following,
ABS
Power steering
Airbags
Fuel injection
Hydraulic clutch
Brake servo
Catatalytic converter
Not so sure about no roof or windscreen or heater though.
Of course I reserve the right to fit them later if deemed necessary from a performance point of view. I think there is a strong case for banning
power steering cos if your engine cuts out it's nearly impossibly to steer. I nearly hit a tranny van once cos of this. It give's no
feedback through the wheel of the road surface either.
quote:
Originally posted by coozer
I pulled the fuse on my Rover 45 after having to steer round a car at a junction.. no matter how hard I pressed it just wouldn't stop.
Car now stops better and I feel safer
quote:
imho alot of people rely too much on modern safety aids and feel indestructable in their cars....but thats just my opinion.
On a lot of different models anything from Audi to Vauxhall cracked ABS reluctor rings are becoming increasingly common.
The problem arises because the rectuctor ring and the CV have no paint or corrosion protection, water gets in between the ABS ring and the cv joint
and as a rust layer forms forces an expansion of the ring until it breaks.
Usually you don't get any warning light just the ABS cuts in prematurely.
The problem seems much more common on post 1999 models probably because of a change in manufacturing methods,
The fix usually takes about 25 minutes per side ---, undo the bottom ball joint, pop the cv joint out from the strut, clean up cv joint, heat shrink
ABS ring on and put it back together.
If you have ABS and disconnect it you could well find your insurance company won't pay out if anything happens.
[Edited on 10/12/09 by britishtrident]
quote:
Originally posted by Danozeman
I hate abs. My zetec-s fiesta i had the abs nearly made me crash on a few occasions mainly on ice. I pulled the fuse and it braked so much better. My bmw is the same right pain in the arse.
On of the pickup rings failed on our V6 Mondeo. That posted a fault But the Teves MK2 systems usualy do.
TT
quote:
Originally posted by snapper
I have discussed this with a high up tecky guy from Fords, he goes to test Traction controls and ABS systems on the ice lakes in sweden and writes the anti logs etc, so knows his stuff.
When i mentioned using an ABS system from a donor he started talking about the original mass of the donor and how the abs ecu interprets the signals from the wheel sensors, the upshot was that unless the abs ecu is programmed for a 7 size and weight car and understands the chassis dynamics or at least has data to work from, your abs system from the donor will only give marginal performance at best.
Dangerous IMHO.
And it's fully acknowledged by manufacturesrs that in ice and snow that ABS will usualy make no difference as all wheels will lose traction and
lock up anyway.
TT