Coolguyat18
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| posted on 9/2/20 at 09:34 AM |
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Tracking and Toe, any one help me please?
Hi guys, I am new here and this is my first post so first of all a big hello and thank you for letting me join.
My question is about a system I have purchased for my small project that has front and rear toe adjustment, I have purchased a Super tracker system
that has the units you hang on the front and flags for the rear (hope I am posting this in right place?)
I have been doing a lot of research before this so I hope a lot of the newbie questions are done but I am sure there are guys on here who know how to
use this a lot better than me that could help me setup.
1. Does it matter which end I track first? I notice some videos where they track the front and then swap the flags to the front and gauges to the rear
etc and some videos show other way round? Is there a perfect order to do this in?
I will also be doing this in my road car (access to 4post lift and turn plates etc).
2. I think I under stand the process such as
.hang rear flags
.hang front gauges
.center wheel and lock
.note reading on rear flags
.adjust front by adding rear numbers on flags and then half
.then the toe readings either add if in same colour or if in different colour takeaway small number.
So if my flags read 5 and 5, my front toe gauges read plus 1 and plus 2 I have plus 3 toe.
If my car is ment to have total toe of plus 1 how would I adjust and what reading would me toe be on gauges?
Hope you can help?
[Edited on 9/2/20 by Coolguyat18]
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rusty nuts
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| posted on 9/2/20 at 10:51 AM |
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If you have 3mm toe in then you need to adjust both side until you have the same reading on both rear flags and the front gauges reading 1 mm toe in .
Depending on the position of your steering rack , in front or behind the suspension upright, that affects which direction you move the adjustment.I
would also recommend ensuring the adjusters and locking nuts/bolts are not seized before trying to adjust. Super trackers are good kits IF they are
correctly calibrated but they can be abused which knocks the calibration out
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Coolguyat18
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| posted on 9/2/20 at 11:49 AM |
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quote:
Originally posted by rusty nuts
If you have 3mm toe in then you need to adjust both side until you have the same reading on both rear flags and the front gauges reading 1 mm toe in .
Depending on the position of your steering rack , in front or behind the suspension upright, that affects which direction you move the adjustment.I
would also recommend ensuring the adjusters and locking nuts/bolts are not seized before trying to adjust. Super trackers are good kits IF they are
correctly calibrated but they can be abused which knocks the calibration out
Hi, so if I have 3mm toe and require 1mm toe do I adjust so the fronts are still out but rears are equal etc?
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obfripper
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| posted on 9/2/20 at 11:50 AM |
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Track the rear first, aim to get the flag numbers even to minimise the axle thrust relative to the front, this may not be easy/possible ( live axle,
trailing beam, de-dion without shimming) but record the numbers you finish at.
If the car has never been setup before, check the alignment of the inner track rod balljoints is central relative to the suspension mounting locations
to minimise bump steer, you may want to reset your steering wheel to match.
Then track the front, aiming to get the flag number to counteract the numbers you recorded from the rear, this will result in a net thrust of zero
which should make the vehicle drive in a straight line with the steering wheel in the ahead position.
In your example, with even numbers from the rear tracking, you need to adjust the front both sides by -1mm toe to not affect the total thrust.
If instead you had 3NS 5OS flag readings from the rear tracking, you would adjust for your toe value with the flags reading 2 higher on the
nearside, the flag readings may not correlate to mm toe, but for example if you end up with 7NS 5OS flags and toe of +3NS -2OS , that would give the
counteracting thrust on the axle, and correct toe.
If you have the camber/caster/kpi gauge with your kit, setup the camber before adjusting the toe on each axle, ensure you're on level ground as
not being level will skew the readings, you can use the gauge (i can't remember which setting now) to check a ramp, to be accurate it needs to
be level between all 4 corners.
Dave
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Coolguyat18
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| posted on 9/2/20 at 12:00 PM |
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quote:
Originally posted by obfripper
Track the rear first, aim to get the flag numbers even to minimise the axle thrust relative to the front, this may not be easy/possible ( live axle,
trailing beam, de-dion without shimming) but record the numbers you finish at.
If the car has never been setup before, check the alignment of the inner track rod balljoints is central relative to the suspension mounting locations
to minimise bump steer, you may want to reset your steering wheel to match.
Then track the front, aiming to get the flag number to counteract the numbers you recorded from the rear, this will result in a net thrust of zero
which should make the vehicle drive in a straight line with the steering wheel in the ahead position.
In your example, with even numbers from the rear tracking, you need to adjust the front both sides by -1mm toe to not affect the total thrust.
If instead you had 3NS 5OS flag readings from the rear tracking, you would adjust for your toe value with the flags reading 2 higher on the
nearside, the flag readings may not correlate to mm toe, but for example if you end up with 7NS 5OS flags and toe of +3NS -2OS , that would give the
counteracting thrust on the axle, and correct toe.
If you have the camber/caster/kpi gauge with your kit, setup the camber before adjusting the toe on each axle, ensure you're on level ground as
not being level will skew the readings, you can use the gauge (i can't remember which setting now) to check a ramp, to be accurate it needs to
be level between all 4 corners.
Dave
Am I right in saying if I have 5 and 5 on rear flags. NSF 2 toe In and OSF 1 toe in total of 3 toe in.
What I am lost is if I need a total of 1mm toe In i take it i have to adjust to 1mm while keeping the numbers on the flags equial how ever how will I
get the 1mm toe?
I would need to read 0.5 on each scale but my numbers are not even as one is 2 and the other is 1?
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obfripper
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| posted on 9/2/20 at 12:19 PM |
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You're aiming for 1mm toe, so take -1mm toe from each side, this will alter each flag value by an equal amount not affecting the thrust value,
and giving the correct toe.
Your reading on the gauges will be +1NS 0OS, total +1mm toe, the mm toe readings on the gauges are not needed to be equal, only their sum needs to be
correct.
Dave
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Coolguyat18
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| posted on 9/2/20 at 12:32 PM |
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quote:
Originally posted by obfripper
You're aiming for 1mm toe, so take -1mm toe from each side, this will alter each flag value by an equal amount not affecting the thrust value,
and giving the correct toe.
Your reading on the gauges will be +1NS 0OS, total +1mm toe, the mm toe readings on the gauges are not needed to be equal, only their sum needs to be
correct.
Dave
Now that makes sence, thank you so much.
Also the flags, if I butt them up to the tyres I notice one will be at an angle a little more, I take it its more important to have them 90 degrees
(use a s level). Reason I asked is if I use a level one flat will be closee to the tyre side wall than the other etc if that makes sence.
And as for the rear I track that up first with the flags on the front? Using the same process, read flags, half number and adjust to equal number and
read toe?
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obfripper
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| posted on 9/2/20 at 01:04 PM |
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So long as the flags are equally angled both sides the reading will be ok, you can set them level for easier reading, the horizontal plate needs to be
in contact with the tyre, the upper hook is just for positioning.
Set the rear up as per the front, remember that when the gauges are fitted on the rear are they reversed, so you need to read toe-in as toe-out and
vice-versa.
I usually look at the current toe before adjusting the flag values to make sure i'm heading in the right direction, the half method puts you in
the right place adjusting the rear, but is only ok for the front if the rear was equal.
Dave
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Coolguyat18
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| posted on 9/2/20 at 02:01 PM |
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quote:
Originally posted by obfripper
So long as the flags are equally angled both sides the reading will be ok, you can set them level for easier reading, the horizontal plate needs to be
in contact with the tyre, the upper hook is just for positioning.
Set the rear up as per the front, remember that when the gauges are fitted on the rear are they reversed, so you need to read toe-in as toe-out and
vice-versa.
I usually look at the current toe before adjusting the flag values to make sure i'm heading in the right direction, the half method puts you in
the right place adjusting the rear, but is only ok for the front if the rear was equal.
Dave
That's what I thought, thought I would check as if I set it up like:
NSR flag, both 3 points (long horizon bar and top hanging bar) are making contact with tyre it looks squarely on and the laser line projection looks
square as it is straight with the marker lines.
OSR flag setup the same way BUT it looks like it is set back a little by my eye and the laser line is not straight but crooked etc, I have to the make
sure the long bar is still on contact with the tyre side walls but the top hanging bar I have to bring out a little so the line is the straight.
Is that correct then that rather than just butting up against the tyre it's better to make sure it is square etc by making sure the laser line
is straight etc, I might purchase so stick on levels to stick on the flags..
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Coolguyat18
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| posted on 4/3/20 at 06:09 PM |
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Hi guys, so the tracking is going very well but I have one question.
The setup I have (as per above) will allow me to set the thrust and toe in the correct manner however I notice on the rear of my car I all so have
adjustable camber adjustment.
When I put the flags on the front wheels and heads on the rear wheels, when I adjust the toe will this knock out or change my camber?
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