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| posted on 3/8/05 at 08:54 AM |
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Injection to Carb conversion
Hi All,
Has anyone converted a pinto from injection to carbs?
How difficult would it be and what extras would I need, I currently have all the bits from 2ltr SOHC.
Any help gratefully recieved, as always.
Cheers
Adam
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James
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| posted on 3/8/05 at 09:06 AM |
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Loads of people.
Just get an carb manifold and bolt your carbs to it!
Then you need the distributor and amplifier from a 1.6lt Pinto to run the electrics.
This wiring diagram works (long thread but useful stuff is at the end!).
http://www.locostbuilders.co.uk/viewthread.php?tid=18515&page=2
That's about all I can remember...
HTH,
James
[Edited on 3/8/05 by James]
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"The fight is won or lost far away from witnesses, behind the lines, in the gym and out there on the road, long before I dance under those lights."
- Muhammad Ali
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DarrenW
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| posted on 3/8/05 at 09:45 AM |
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Yep - mine too. Originally injected pinto. Now with 38DGAS and manifold. i got a new dizzy and amplifier from GMS Capri spares (£65 and £29
respectively). Not running yet but soon will be when wiring is sorted.
Head has also been reworked as per Des Hammill recommendations plus FR32 cam. Just fitted stainless system from Mac#1 that has been made using Sir
Vizards recommendations. Cant wait to hear it.
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unixguy
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| posted on 3/8/05 at 10:06 AM |
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Out of curiosity, what are the benifits of doing this?
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mookaloid
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| posted on 3/8/05 at 10:23 AM |
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quote:
Originally posted by unixguy
Out of curiosity, what are the benifits of doing this?
I think most people do it for one or more of these reasons:
the Injection system wont fit under the bonnet (although some people have modified it so it will)
You can get more power from carbs than the standard injection system, and it is seen as easier to do this than get involved with new electronics to
tune the existing system
Upgrading to throttle bodies is an alternative to carbs for more power but can be very expensive (unless you are quite ingenious)
Hope this helps
Cheers
Mark
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DarrenW
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| posted on 3/8/05 at 11:02 AM |
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Mine was simple - i didnt get the injection kit with the engine so opted for the easy route.
Also, believe it or not, i havent had many cars with carbs so fancied some experience of them. I may regret it in the future but fancy an upgrade to
bike carbs or diy injection in the future.
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awinter
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| posted on 3/8/05 at 11:30 AM |
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You will also need a fuel pressure regulator to reduce the injection pump pressure to between 3&5psi.
Also Throttle bodies do not make any more power than carbs at peak RPM. You can control the fueling better with Throttle Bodies though.
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gaz100
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| posted on 3/8/05 at 12:13 PM |
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quote:
You will also need a fuel pressure regulator to reduce the injection pump pressure to between 3&5psi.
Would it not be wise just to use a low pressure pump such a facet as well.
the fuel injection pump is designed for pressures of around 40 psi and i would of thought be too much for a 5 psi regulator?
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James
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| posted on 3/8/05 at 01:35 PM |
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Easier still is to get the mechanical pump (and drive pin for it) from a 2 litre.
Should have put this in my first post- forgot it's been so long!
Not sure if the pump from a 1.6 would be high enough capacity? Or are they all the same?
Cheers,
James
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"The fight is won or lost far away from witnesses, behind the lines, in the gym and out there on the road, long before I dance under those lights."
- Muhammad Ali
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gaz100
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| posted on 4/8/05 at 06:20 PM |
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i didnt think the injection engine had the provisions for the mechanical pump?
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8smokingbarrels
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| posted on 22/8/05 at 02:25 PM |
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Out of interest- are carbs very expensive?
What I'm thinking is- if I go down to the local scrappie and get an engine out of an mondeo (there's always loads), surely theres a case
for using the existing FI system? Or are the electrics REALLY scary compared to a carb conversion?
chris
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Peteff
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| posted on 22/8/05 at 02:56 PM |
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an engine out of a mondeo
It would be a zetec, not a pinto as in the thread above.
yours, Pete
I went into the RSPCA office the other day. It was so small you could hardly swing a cat in there.
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NS Dev
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| posted on 22/8/05 at 02:57 PM |
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.............and you would then need to find a way of doing the ignition on it (no dizzy on a zetec)
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paulf
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| posted on 22/8/05 at 05:42 PM |
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But its not to difficult to arrange a Megajolt set up for about £100 complete , infact as cheap as buying a dizzy and amp for efi sierra engine.
Paul.
quote:
Originally posted by NS Dev
.............and you would then need to find a way of doing the ignition on it (no dizzy on a zetec)
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JoelP
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| posted on 22/8/05 at 05:49 PM |
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is the pinto injection head better than the older carb'd heads? or is there no real difference? just curious as im getting one soon, and need to
know what to look for! 
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mookaloid
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| posted on 22/8/05 at 06:40 PM |
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Yes the injection head is better. I think the standard ports are a bit better and it has bigger valves I think than some of the earlier heads. It may
be better able to cope with unleaded too.
Cheers
Mark
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8smokingbarrels
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| posted on 23/8/05 at 08:30 AM |
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Ah I see, I assume Zetec engines arent used as much as Pinto ones because of their ignition systems- is that right? By the way is 'Zetec'
the name of the engine or its ignition system?
Sorry for going off topic- interested but ignorant of the facts here!
chris
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James
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| posted on 23/8/05 at 10:25 AM |
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quote:
Originally posted by gaz100
i didnt think the injection engine had the provisions for the mechanical pump?
Well mine works miraculously well if it it doesn't then!
The pump is driven by a short (40-45mmx8mm) stainless pin. Which is itself driven by a cam on the timing pulley shaft.
My EFI engine had the cam on the timing shaft and Ned, had the pump and Mick kindly sent me the drive pin!
Just remove the cover plate and fit the spacer plate and then lube the pin and pump and fit together- easy! 
Chris,
Up until recently the Pinto was plentiful and cheap whilst the Zetec (which is the name of the engine!) was pricey.
Zetec prices have recently dropped (AFAIK a 1.8 is about 50 quid now) and Pintos are getting a little scarce.
The Pinto is pretty easy to get going with a disctibutor/carb and mechanical pump- whereas the Zetec needs a little more thought/expense.
HTH,
James
[Edited on 23/8/05 by James]
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"The fight is won or lost far away from witnesses, behind the lines, in the gym and out there on the road, long before I dance under those lights."
- Muhammad Ali
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chrisg
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| posted on 23/8/05 at 02:43 PM |
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It's worth remembering that you need an adaptor plate to run carbs on an injection head.
The carb manifold leaves gaps at the top were the pear shaped injection ports are - you need to make the plate the outside shape of the injection
gasket but with the centre cut outs of the carb gasket - mines 5mm ali.
The stud holes are all the same.
you need to make a sandwich - Head / injection gasket / adaptor plate / carb gasket / carb manifold.
It's also possible to weld ali on to the top of the carb manifold with a tig to cover the ports and then machine, then use the injection
gasket.
Cheers
Chris
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DarrenW
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| posted on 23/8/05 at 02:54 PM |
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I havent made a plate up and it seems to work ok. I havent ran it for long tho'. What has everyone else done in this area??
I wonder if the need for plate depends on what carb / manifold set up you use. Mine is 38 DGAS and manifold if it makes a difference. I wonder if it i
sthe aftermarket twin weber etc manifolds that need the plate????????
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chrisg
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| posted on 23/8/05 at 04:09 PM |
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Could be mate,
I'm using the webber 32/36 carb and manifold. Perhaps the 38 manifold is bigger.
It certainly wouldn't run with the gap you get with my set-up, you can get your finger in the gap, more than a "slight air
leak"!!
Cheers
Chris
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DarrenW
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| posted on 24/8/05 at 08:40 AM |
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Id better take a closer look at that then - this might be one of the reasons im getting a bit of spit back thro the carbs. The head has been fully
reconned so i know valve seats etc are A1, perhaps i have a small gap that is allowing extra air in or something of the sorts.
I assume the gap you are talking about is due to where the injectors would normally sit in the inlet area, like a half moon cut-out.
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James
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| posted on 24/8/05 at 09:21 AM |
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Just to add to the fun I have a 32/36 carb and manifold- and I didn't appear to need the plate either!
Don''t think Conrod or Bob (if he has a '205'?) have bothered either.
Cheers,
James
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"The fight is won or lost far away from witnesses, behind the lines, in the gym and out there on the road, long before I dance under those lights."
- Muhammad Ali
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mookaloid
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| posted on 24/8/05 at 01:14 PM |
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No plate on mine
I can't imagine that the half moons are showing on mine - I have never noticed but I've never checked either.
I will have a look though.
Cheers
Mark
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Kieran
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| posted on 24/8/05 at 08:50 PM |
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I converted my efi pinto a 40 DFAV carb. The cheaper carb inlet manifold gasket have more "meat" around em, and I can't imagine the
relieved injector area being visible over the top of the carb manifold?? The engine runs a lot better with the carb, seems to have more grunt and and
more top end too, fuel consumption is the downfall. The injection head is uses metric sized valves, but mainly benefits from the port "turn
in" to the inlet throat being better blended than the standard heads sharp turn. I think ford quoted 100bhp for carb pinto and 115 for the efi.
Most people reckon this is due to porting, as aopposed the efi.
Probably.
Kieran
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